Cosworth427

What is there to make excuses over? For all I know, you're a bunch of kids on their school break with nothing better to do. The internet is famous for its charlatans and bull****.

more idiocy from you, trollhunter. You obviously don't understand the implications of your posts. Standard J-spec Supras make less mean power than a Euro/US spec prior to 1998 models. You have this hard-on with your modified Supra as some kind of proof or exception that I am wrong about a STOCK J-spec using the FACTS available for ALL to see!

Claiming that you dont care what it makes as standard doesnt detach yourself from responsibility of what you claim or say.

I'm not going to lose sleep over a MK4 J-spec with a leaky intercooler. On the other hand, my car is getting stronger and stronger from every modification I do with basic stock CT-26 turbo, and it doesnt cost me 20K to go as fast neither!

Watch out for those Astras...


That made me look back at one of your older posts, jawa...

Strange that, a MKIV fuel pump is nearly double as effective as my MK3 pump. My standard pump can flow enough for 300 + HP.

MKIV "BPU" Supras in the states use the standard fuel pump, and they're making 390 - 410 AT THE WHEELS. Using stock turbos, injectors & fuel pump.

Who's advice was that then?

Beef

So? Doesn't make 'em slower, as they have shorter gearing and less weight.

WRX280

>>>"The people who are usually disappointed are those with UK spec cars, I drive dozens of MKIV's, to be honest i wouldn't have a UK car as a gift, they are as different as chalk and cheese, forget cited power figures, the Jap cars are eager and responsive, they really screwed up with the UK / USA models, IMO. /ducks/
C.Wilson 14/11/03"<<<

Now Chris is someone who knows his sh*t. If its coming from him, its saying something. Here is some of the articles he's wrote for www.imoc.co.uk :

http://www.imoc.co.uk/technical/arti...akeupgrade.htm
http://www.imoc.co.uk/technical/article/wi.htm
http://www.imoc.co.uk/technical/article/NAtuning.htm
http://www.imoc.co.uk/technical/article/dumpvalves.htm
http://www.imoc.co.uk/technical/article/octane.htm

Thanks

WRX280

>>>MKIV "BPU" Supras in the states use the standard fuel pump, and they're making 390 - 410 AT THE WHEELS. Using stock turbos, injectors & fuel pump. <<<

Yes, and they use dynojets, which typically read 10% higher then our typical dyno here, but lets not get into that, shall we

Cosworth427

10% can vary from your damn tire pressure! Stop making excuses all your life. The trap speeds of US spec BPU Supras confirm the amount of power per weight it has (full trim, 6 speed cars).

You can only confirm how little you know.

Maybe I should open up a "Jap performance tuning garage", I'll make a mint out of overpaid underworked naive people like yourself.

Cosworth427

They ARE slower. 5 MPH slower at the end of a 1/4 mile. That shows the disparity of power between the two cars. The average trap speed of the J-spec is 99 MPH, vs 104 for the Euro/US. I have seen 106 from the Euro/US spec, and I have seen 101 from the J-spec - but the consistency lies in the difference between the trap speed.

I'm going to return back to what the J-spec is all about. The J-Spec makes more usable power at the lower revs, around a 100 HP at just 2000 RPM! That's 30 HP more than the Euro/US spec. This is thanks to lower lift intake camshafts/valves suited for mid-range torque. Ceramic turbochargers build maximum boost sooner (although less air flow). There is nothing about the J-spec in design that intends it is just as powerful or as ULTIMATELY as fast as the Euro/US spec.



It's the same Getrag type 233 V160 transmission, silly.

*sighs* Euro/US weighs 4.1% more than the J-spec, but makes 12% more power.

ScoobyJawa

Contradicting yourself again. The website link you posted shows they have no more bhp than the pre 1998 models.

Nor us.

LMFAO - a scooby owning friend of mine, with 350bhp/320lb/ft commented on that. He has no problems at all with Astra's, they aren't even in the same league as his. And he admits he's lost to me in the wet from a standing start, so I don't think I'll be watching out for them.

Right, so WTF has Chris Wilson's quote got to do with what I posted. You seem to forget he is 1 of 2 of the most respected MKIV tuners in the country as we've said. No ones heard of you, so I know who I'm listening to. Chris has seen more MKIV's and worked on them than you've had hot dinners.

Not strange at all, the fuel system is different on the Jspec to the export spec, so it requires a better flowing pump to keep up with the demands of fuel into the engine. Also the stock MKIV pump works on a 9v-12v switching for when the fuel demands are greater, you ideally get a aftermarket pump and run 12v only.

And yet again - you can't compare States bhp and rwhp figures to ours, they are completely different, there dynos use different standards, and have been know for ages to seem generous compared to the rest of the world. Also, yank mentality, they tend to whack the boost up for 1 dyno run and do anything they can to get the figures higher, for one run, which is not what the car actually does on the street. Here, we dyno as we drive them (mostly as theres slways some )

Sorry, I tell a lie re the 395, it was 393 and no aftermarket fuel pump, Mods were HKS exhaust and decat, FCD, HKS induction doen at Well Lane.

There's also from THOR - JSpec, HKS Hiper, Decat, FCD - 367bhp @ the hubs. Graph here:

http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/attachm...&postid=174406

[Edited by ScoobyJawa - 12/23/2003 1:43:38 PM]

ScoobyJawa

He's referring to the different diff again, gearbox is the same, the diff is different so ultimately it does effect the gearing by some degree.

Beef

It's a different diff ratio, silly.

SteveW2

Cosworth427 - you keep referring to us as 'overpaid and underworked' which is a bit of a stupid statement considering you also say'we could be a bunch of 15 year olds for all you know'.

Perhaps if you didn't spend all of your life acting like a **** and spouting bollocks then you could be overpaid and underworked too, and not just coming on to decent car forums like this one and talking absolute bollocks about cars you won't ever be able to afford becuase you are a jealous GEI with a **** cavalier!!

[Edited by SteveW2 - 12/23/2003 2:06:52 PM]

WRX280

>>>10% can vary from your damn tire pressure! Stop making excuses all your life. The trap speeds of US spec BPU Supras confirm the amount of power per weight it has (full trim, 6 speed cars).

Am suprised you haven't posted some links yet

>>>You can only confirm how little you know.<<<

Am not afraid to admit it.

>>>Maybe I should open up a "Jap performance tuning garage", I'll make a mint out of overpaid underworked naive people like yourself.<<<

Well i hate to break it to you mate, but you wont get many customers , simply because you have a serious attitude problem . In any case, i do ALL my work on the car MYSELF, since i am not overpaid!

Dillweed

skylinelee

iTrader: (1)

just get ya cars to york on the 9th may and lets AVE IT like dude said..... i also think you'll find moneymark is the most knowldgable supra owner on mkiv.net.......you seen his fur conversion???

class

keep it up ladies its good reading

trollhunter

Cosworth , when you stop playing with your small member think about what you are saying , you obviously have no experience of MKIV supras you have made the mistake everyone else does , youve believed the manufacturer!!!!!!! shame you just cant admit your wrong , tell you what ive also got 2 6 speed sups one is stock except exhaust (both cats still in) the other exhaust and one cat still in , how about you go have a borrow of a UK 6 speed and we have a race and see whos wrong and whos right , i'll even chip in for your petrol if your a bit short but i'll need the ok from your dad that your allowed to be out !!!!

[Edited by trollhunter - 12/23/2003 7:39:58 PM]

Branners

j-spec supras have a smaller fuel pump, UK and US spec fuel pumps flow more fuel. But then of course you knew that.

JB

MONKEYmark

whats all the fuss over stock supra. they ok but how many stock supras are out there. i thought my stock jap spec supra was ok to drive in stock trim, but decat and exhaust and its like a different car.
uk cars are better spec, you have to work with what car you have got. just have fun and stop talking about it.
theres not much in the top 5 cars on the supra site. top 3 jap cars. and american cars run drag radials. next year we might see better times when people use drag radials to compare times to american cars. i want to try get in 11`s on drag radials and stock peashooter turbos. before i decide to go single turbo.


Dragracing times for Stock & Hybrid Turbos

01.MONKEYmark (TT auto) JAP (Elvington)
12.53 @ 114 mph 60 Foot = 2.166

02.Adam Kindness (TT auto) JAP (hybrids) (Crail)
12.705 @ 114.8 mph 60 foot = 2.175

03.Matt Harwood (TT auto) JAP (TSC 2)
12.79 @ 114mph

04.Kevin Huntley (TT 6) UK (Elvington)
12.81 @ 110 mph

05.Justin M (TT auto) JAP (TSC 2)
12.85 @ 110 mph

06.Michel l / JJ (TT 6) UK (York dragstrip)
12.859 @ 113.920 mph 60 Foot = 2.235

by the way i have had a standard mk3 supra turbo. they seem to run 15+ 1/4`s from what i have seen of them and astra 2l turbos soom to be 13.9+ 1/4`s


have fun its nearly christmas

hope he brings me my single turbo kit and fueling system

Cosworth427

Oh really? ...

MK4 US/EURO spec: http://www.mkiv.com/specifications/p...p/sep20_17.jpg

Japanese spec (RZ): http://www.toyotasupra.info/toyotasupra_gears.htm

Another source!

http://mkiv.supras.org.nz/specs.htm

Ah, gotta love pub talk...

Cosworth427

LOL, more pub talk!

US/Euro spec Denso pump: http://www.roadraceengineering.com/f...pflowrates.htm

"Japanese spec" Denso pump: http://mkiv.supras.org.nz/techo.htm#FUELPUMPS

Flow rates for standard Supra pump AND Bosch upgrade pumps mentioned in previous link here: http://www.alltrac.net/tuning/fuel.html



[Edited by Cosworth427 - 12/24/2003 1:01:13 PM]

ScoobyJawa

You do like posting links which prove you wrong.

Yeah - really. From YOUR link you muppet:

JSpec Diff Ratio : 3.266
Export Diff Ratio : 3.133

[Edited by ScoobyJawa - 12/24/2003 2:52:18 PM]

ScoobyJawa

And again, nothing there states the difference, just pages waffling. Branners runs MKIVsupra.net and has run a JSpec and now a UK.

Also these following guys (all top MKIV UK based tuners) recommend an upgrade for high power so I don't think we'll be listening to you yet again. Perhaps you might want to run your answers by Chris Wilson, Leon @ JPS and Nathan at TDI Powertuning.

But then this is all irrelevant as the thread isn't about upgrading/mods is it, its about stock cars, and you are being continually shown there is nothing in it from real world examples and still are unable to take it on board:

the shoulder on a chip

rearrange to make a well know phrase.

[Edited by ScoobyJawa - 12/24/2003 3:23:13 PM]

scooby_si

ahhhh it's just like the muppets now you mention it pmsl
Si

ScoobyJawa

SI - why? Because someone should come on and spout untrue rubbish thats been disproved by any MKIV owner/tuner and REAL WORLD examples? Or should we leave all threads to run with incorrect information so anyone with a genuine interest is misinformed?

I know you're just trying to lighten the mood mate but I'm sure you can see our (MKIV owners, UK and Jspec) point. And since the thread poster is after a 1998 car onwards its JSpec anyway so all of 247's waffling is ultimately pointless.

[Edited by ScoobyJawa - 12/24/2003 3:21:43 PM]

scooby_si

lol yeah m8 was merely an attempted 1 liner & i 4 one can see thru such feeble baiting & fishing & even if other parties do think they're adding knowledge they come across as petty IMO & i am quite happy to take the word of owners of mkiv's such as yer goodself although i already know full well any mkiv supra is guna have a large portion of power & performance but please carry on pointing out the weakness is with others attempted sniping it's quite nice to see people put in their place lol but lets not loose site of the bottom line which is ohhhh baby check out me big BHP init! lmao
Ho ho ho lol
Si

[Edited by scooby_si - 12/24/2003 4:00:49 PM]

scooby_si

& the pair of muppets i posted did seem to fit quite nicely lol
Si

ScoobyJawa

LMFAO Nicely put mate - anyhow, time to go get sh!tfaced!!!

Have a good Xmas

scooby_si

lmfao yeah but wots this u mean yer not already on the wifebeater wots rong with ya man!? lol
Si

ScoobyJawa

LMAO - bit of a bender tonight so thought I'd start easy

ya p!sshead

trollhunter

Hey guys we been doin this wrong the fact that the uk fuel pump is bigger than the j-spec means nothing obviously we should just leave it in there !!!! Inside info is that Cos 427 is the owner of HIROSHIMA TUNING, motto send em to the pub with a BANG to talk about cars !!!!!!!!!!

dangerous brain

This is about the most childish thread I have ever seen LOL

However its like a crap soap opera and I just had to sit and read the lot

Seems to me that most people are saying that in their very own j-specs NOT A PIECE OF PAPER FROM SOMEWHERE official or web based enthusiasts-that the standard j-specs are competetive with the UK models. Regardless of facts figures and chest thumping in all reality its what a driver extracts from his car that matters and if the j-spec drivers are getting similar on road performance from their motors as a UK motor driver is then who really cares what MR Toyota or anyone else has to write about it.

If a UK motor floats your boat then go buy one I test drove one a couple of months ago it was going for 8k and I have seen them about for that money in top marques and auto trader. The rest of us will just have to keep our inferior j-specs and nod knowingly to ourselves.

Regards to burnin up soops in a scooby if you were 20 car lengths in front of the black one you would be most of the way off the frizzel roundabout and down by the tesco's LOL and to be fair that roundabout has 3 viscous 90 degree bends the last of which has big kerbs and railings on the edge, plus the water pools a few inches deep on the inside of the second in the wet so in a soop you need huge ***** to race that rbout. The red one may even have been my Mrs and she doesn't even notice other road users exist!! She might even have been doing her make-up at the time LOL!!!

Cosworth427

Put foot in mouth, jawa...

I used the 2nd link to prove the gearing of the J-spec, not the US/Euro models. The 3.133 final drive was probably a mistake in the 2nd link. All 3.27 for all manual TT's regardless of spec, here's why...

Take a look at the 1st link, http://www.mkiv.com/specifications/p...p/sep20_17.jpg it is a specification book for the US spec, and it is indeed a 3.27 final drive. NOTICE where the scans are linked from...that's right, the beloved MKIV.COM site! The holy grail of Supra JZA80 knowledge!

I'm serious now, jawa - it's xmas you need to chill out and not get frustrated by the facts that you have to resort to outright lies that can be proven wrong in a matter of seconds.



[Edited by Cosworth427 - 12/25/2003 12:23:55 AM]

Cosworth427

No need to get upset because I've provided information to prove you wrong - again.

Now you will need to use your brains here, troll-hunter. (obviously you want to prove that you know what you are talking about) USE the flow rates vs pressure data for the "Euro/US" pump vs the 300 KW @ 20 PSI boost and look at the flow rates of the Bosch upgrade pumps, you'll see the "J-spec" pump has very similar flow rates to the so called Euro/US pump.

It's the same Denso fuel pump, twit.





[Edited by Cosworth427 - 12/25/2003 12:25:44 AM]