"I don't care if I RR mines and it said 200hp"

You'd be on the phone to me like a shot asking where it had all gone

 

Not if it still felt as fast! I would perhaps suggest to the RR guy the something might be screwed at his end

But if its 200 at the wheels I'd phone you up to thank you

[Edited by Saxo Boy - 4/29/2003 9:53:43 PM]

 

"I would perhaps suggest to the RR guy the something might be screwed at his end"

I tried that one and he said, "The rollers dinnae lie". Then we settled it at the airfield

 

versatility.

I'd like to see the same wee front wheel drive keep up with a scooby on ice, in snow, across a field, in the wet, round a corner, on gravel. what about the braking? braking in a VTS is not exactly fun once you are used to a scoob - and thats with the scoob weight penalty.

What happens when your luck runs out and your outer wheels have dug into the sand trap and you are on your second barrel roll? at least with the scoob you'll have a fighting chance of getting out alive...

mine gets used to cart mountain bikes to races - not many vehicles can be up to the axles in mud and shortly afterwards doing 0-60 in 6 seconds.

rd

 

Interesting thread. I remember a good few years ago doing a standing start from a roundabout in Cov onto the A46(??) dual carriageway in my new (at the time - 1995) Corrado VR6.

I was up against a mate's Celica (so it was 190bhp front drive vs 140-ish - I guess). Nice clear stretch, got up to about 110 or so, then I backed off, and looked in my mirror to see where he was. What amazed me was that he was only about 9 or 10 car's lengths behind.

Now in retrospect, I guess that's a hell of a lot. Just didn't seem so at the time.

I was so shocked, I had to get a Schrick VSR variable inlet tract head for the thing. Straight up to 225bhp - no messin'.

 

I remember trying to outdrag a 911 turbo in my old sport. He didn't bother initially, then saw how much noise I was making (SS zaust ) then firkin wasted me...

That's a mahoosive difference in power

Scoob never stood a chance

 

When you get used to the Scoob's punch, simply take a work mate for a spin, they kind of let you know how good they are - the car that is!

:-)

Mike

 

Why try and drag me into an Evo Vs scooby argument?? I dont recall anywhere in my posts stating that Evos are untouchable. I asked you if you have owned both. If you dont get your findings from actual experience than where do you get them from? Back of max power on the stats page perchance?

Yes I own an Evo but you already know that dont you. I unlike your good self have owned both and I disagree with your post. Simple as really, we can agree to disagree?

As for the fellow at Crail, who knows and who realy cares?? Could be down to anything. I couldnt catch PTMW round donny because he knows the track and is a better track driver than me. So there you go Evos are by far beatable.

I dont think you will ever understand.

Thats the first sensable thing you've said. See above.

To pull any noticable distance at speed on the road you need at least 100bhp difference from the car trailing.

[Edited by cryptwalk - 4/30/2003 12:16:02 AM]

 

Saxo Boy's right, a standard EVO will not totally waste a CTR or FRS. Infact you go on to (effectively) agree with him Cryptwalk:

 

I didnt say it will totally waste it. I only have my own experience of the cars, when my evo was standard it would easily pull distance (granted not miles) on my old modded wrx.

I disgreed with this from my own findings..

Depends what you mean by detroy, the hatches he mentioned I have no problem with atall.

 

It does depend what you mean by destroy I agree, and I don't know if your EVO is std or not, but a CTR or FRS would not be destroyed by a std EVO in an acceleration test where traction is not an issue.

By not being detroyed I mean the same as Saxo Boy was saying - any difference would look like nothing at all, even if on paper there was a considerable difference.



BTW this all just goes to show how unimportant straight line performance/acceleration really is.

 

It was and it didnt have a problem pulling distance.

I wouldnt dissagree with that. I just asked weather he'd drove both to comment on A slightly modded UK scooby Vs standard Evo because in my experience it wouldnt touch it.

Than came all the crap, you know the *and you think us scooby drivers have their heads up their asses* *what about the Evo at crail*

Sadly he tried to turn it into another pointless Scooby Vs Evo debate. I don't recall ever saying my evo was unbeatable. We seem to of got wires crossed somewhere.

Agreed but it's great fun.

[Edited by cryptwalk - 4/30/2003 1:29:29 AM]

 

Saxo Boy

You say you'd be happy with 200 at the wheels...

Why don't you try the DeltaDash RoadDyno?

I would be interested in comparing results - I have a similar(ish) spec to yours and am getting:

Maximum Wheel Power: 211.5 BHP @ 5978 RPM
Maximum Wheel Torque: 225.9 LbFt @ 4041 RPM

Not sure how accurate RoadDyno is though, cos I wasn't expecting that much to be honest.

Si

 

And that IMHO is the most sensible thing you've said We are assuming relatively similar weight though

I didn't and don't want to turn this into an EVO V Scooby debate. I've always felt that is one of the most pointless debates ever as the direct comparison is STI 5/6 Vs EVO 6/7 and they are close enough on everything to put it down to driver preference.

Its like when people ask, 'what should I get, a 106GTI or a Saxo VTS!!' - That's even worse because they practically are the same car!!

I personally don't think I could live with an EVO for two reasons:

a) sound crap (comparitively speaking)
b) mine scooby is off for a service, AGAIN!!!!, today and thats with 7500 intervals!!!

I still like/respect them though

FWIW when I dragged a CTR from 3rd into 4th I only just had enough power to start behind, draw along side and stick my nose in front!

 

out of interest crypt (or anyone else for that matter) how much power do the EVOs lose through transmission? Is it a similar amount to the Impreza?

Steve

 

Its all about how much hp is actually being put down onto the tarmac & weight. A Classic gets about 170 to the wheels & something like a Clio Cup 145 due less transmission loss, then take into account what a cup weighs (1011kg) as opposed to 1235kg & you can see why they can give you such a hard time ...well when its not raining

...& yes RR's can & DO lie

 

RB5320

The only way I know of to accurately calculate transmission loss is to 'know' a cars flywheel hp (engine dyno) its top speed, weight, Drag(Cd) & frontal area- you can then calculate both rolling resistence power & air resistence power, which when added together will tell you how much bhp is making it to the wheels & then just deduct that from your flywheel figure.

A P1 (which was the only Impreza I could all the info for) with a top speed of 155mph (these are Prodrives figures) 'needs' 218bhp @ the wheels- thats a loss of 62bhp or 22%- compare that to what 'some' RR's are calculating

If you could supply all the relevent data for an EVO, I could work its losses out

 

cheers Daz. That makes sense. No idea on the relevant figures for the EVO as I have so far been able to resist the pull of the dark side. Just wondered whether the EVO transmission is more efficient at tranferring the power to the wheels.

Steve

 

My Evo 5 has been measured at 333.5 bhp at the flywheel and 242 bhp at the wheels.

A standard Evo will put out about 210-220 at the wheels.

Have a look at some of the scooby/evo graphs here: http://www.scoobymods.co.uk/SRollingRoad01.htm


[Edited by Spanpody. - 4/30/2003 10:59:21 AM]

 

My pretty much standard RA puts out 195bhp at the wheels but strangely only running 1.0bar on the RR. It runs 1.3bar on the road so you tell me whats it actually running . Yes EVOs are quick but a standard GSR is slower than a standard RA due to gearing and weight.

Yes you say buy an RS evo which it will be a lot closer. A standard evo will destroy an standard UK spec but not a classic 280ps import. When cars have similar power and weight the difference on the road is minimal. Trouble is you find people who buy the more extreme versions dont keep them standard but you can turn a great car into an undriveable, peaky, laggy car.

I just filter and cat backed mine and still pulls well from 2,500 rpm right the way to 7,500. Standard you are looking at 12 seconds 0-100. Any car that can seriously destroy that ( I dont mean a couple of car lengthes over a 1/4 mile) must be very quick indeed.

 

having read this discussion early on in the first two pages -

I have a STI type UK (02) , today i was following an MGF around a roundabout on a dual carriageway, i floored it as we came off the roundabout, and i couldnt believe how quick it was. i only just crept past, and then started to very slowly pull away.

It opened my eyes anyway

 

I bought the car coz I love scoobys, yeah speed helps, but I still think they are sexy beasts!! And they handle so well on the hilly roads of Wales

Edited because, yet again, I didn't read the WHOLE thread Lol!!

[Edited by Scoobybraids - 5/1/2003 8:11:50 AM]

 

whos complaining?!

People are just saying that the days of leaving most cars in the distance are gone.

The looks and drive are still leaps ahead of most cars though IMHO

 

Buy an import

 

an angle from an escort cosworth owner... its a T35 version so when it finally comes on boost, it has more punch than Lennox lewis after you have slapped his face with a pair of poo stained pants!

now std the esc is a slouch, the turbo lag is huge and the power is never there to back it up. Never the les, it still has a book 0-60 time of the late 5 seconds! not bad really!

now ive upped to Stg 3 and the car is realistically putting out about 315-320 brake and at forst it felt like a ballistic missile! so calm at first then it propelles you down the road at a breathtaking pace.... but.. as some member have pointed out in past pages, you DO get used to the power , and yes.. when you take people out in it, they re-assure you the power is still there!

but never, and i mean never has a hot hatch such as a Civic Type R / saxo Vts ever kept up on a motorway blast! and i mean never.

Few try against an escort cossie anyway due to its reputation and looks... but the odd few that have really dont .. i can see how std scoobs are suffering as they are really pretty slow things out of the UK box.. my old rst used to maul them once rolling.

but surely you 290 / 300 brake guys cant be having any probs with hot hatches?

Im not a massive uk original boring scooby fan.. they are extremely common and not very exciting to say the least.. i much prefer the 3 door versions such as the P1 and the STI Type RA etc.... but surley once the power has been upped they make a fairly rapid trolley?

as for twisties, your right... ive just fited brand new toyo proxes on my comps and the esc now sticks like glue!

 

ScoobyBraids- read the whole thread properly!!!- no-one is complaining! I love my Scoob, the point of the thread was to see what peoples views are on the speed of UK Scoobs compared to other things on the road!

Dunc.

 

If you want further info on this after Span has put the link up, best to ask on the MLR someone will know the answer.

Chris P

Saxoboy

 

On a motorway accelerating from 70 and assuming the best gears for the job the CTR and stadard 03 WRX are almost identical. Once it gets above 100 (private roads of course!!) the CTR pulls away slowly as it is more aerodynamic (vastly). I have seen somewher that it beats the STI8 to 130 by 1.7 secs so it must be at least 3 secs ahead of std WRX.

So in high speed drags the CTR will beat most of the Scoobies and stndard EVOs out there. I have tried this on a couple of Mways and it was quite amusing to see the looks on the faces of the Scooby and EVO drivers (EVO6 and 7 - both looked std).

However, the minute the roads get bumpy and twisty and throw in a drop of rain or muck and the Scooby is much quicker as it inspires so much confidence and a good driver can use the car's ability much more than than, say, a CTR which is really set up for a track in the dry ideally - or a straightline high speed drag as above.

I am not sure why VTS's keep getting mentioned inthe same breath/line as CTR's though - no real comparison. Any CTR driver that could not leave a VTS behind pretty quickly needs some driving lessons!!

 

Ooh, now you've gone and done it! The handbags will be flying. Saxo Boy enters stage left.

 

All the above. But 1 thing. ?? What else sounds like a Scoob whether it be 30 mph or 70 mph Flat 4 sounds the Dogs. And with old bill realy giving grief for speeding its not worth it so u might as well behave yourself and settle for

1 The looks of Scoob

2 The sound of a Scoob

3 The Handling oif a Scoob on the Twistes