And so it begins
19 March 2022, 10:16 AM
#271
Horse stable bolted. Sadly.
This has been brewing for decades and we (western democracies) wilfully ignored it.
Putin from the start has been playing the long game, he had a 20yr plan (As likely China), to progressively build internal strength and segregation whilst undermining western democracies using subversive tactics.
Our countries only work on short term outlooks. Our leaders only have a 5yr plan, as that's about as long as they're in power for (without restructuring). Our increasing liberalism (not a bad thing as a ideology), has weakened our strength of leadership and weight of power on the world stage, our economies are eroded to the point we cannot afford big wars.
The warning signs were there; Decades ago Putin started regularly flying Russian long range nuclear capable bombers (Bears) straight over our heads "for testing/training". We did nothing apart from escort them. Just like their "training" at Ukrainian boarders. Their nuclear subs pop up everywhere like whack a mole. They've assassinated a defector via poisoning using a chemical weapon on UK soil. We did nothing but have a whinge. Just like when they invaded Georgia. Then they recklessly used another chemical weapon as a another assassination attempt on UK soil, contaminating a town/park, with potential to contaminate the watercourses and anything downstream. We whinged, Putin did a shaggy (wasn't me). And then you have Crimea. And they shot down a civilian airliner for no reason and no apology/acknowledgment.
During all of this we encouraged the Ukraine to de-nuclear its military. And Nato poked a wasps nest by encouraging expansion closer to Russian boarders; I mean come on...why is there a NATO training facility in Ukraine? That to Putin is like saying "tell me you're in Nato without telling me you're in Nato".
What we should have done is this: Bears flying over scotland...act of war aggression. Warning shots upon entry. Firm public warning if it happened again we'll shoot to destroy. That would have nipped this in the bud decades ago. UK sanctions on everything Russian should have been done after Salisbury and assets seized to pay the clean up bill. I could go on, but my point is what we are doing now needed doing 15+ years ago. Putin was just waiting for enough weak leaders to run the show before pouncing (2000 onwards Tories; Moron, May, Boris, Macron, Trudeau, Sleepy Joe Biden, etc.).
The following users liked this post:
19 March 2022, 10:36 AM
#272
Scooby Regular
Good post
19 March 2022, 10:43 AM
#273
Scooby Regular
Cmon Dreep your turn😊
19 March 2022, 10:46 AM
#274
Scooby Regular
C,mon Dreep and BMW Where
You two are hot on this. And I say that nicely
You two are hot on this. And I say that nicely
Last edited by Lozgti2; 19 March 2022 at 10:47 AM.
19 March 2022, 11:28 AM
#275
I probably should say that shooting at TU-95s in "neutral waters" over Scotland is a contentious point. But what I mean is our neutral airspace corridors should be demilitarised, and agreements put in place between all nations with no flying of aircraft with bombing capability without pre-authorisation with clear methods of action if these are repeatedly ignored/flouted.
19 March 2022, 11:51 AM
#276
Scooby Regular
Russian warships patrol up and down the channel all the time dont they , they could have pretty big impact if they wanted to without ever entering British waters . Same as US warships off Taiwan / China
19 March 2022, 08:04 PM
#277
Scooby Regular
Have to ask yourself why and how does foreign head get to address parliament directly , on video call no less
all down to the rich wanting to accelerate the boom bust 10 year cycle
this and covid
all down to the rich wanting to accelerate the boom bust 10 year cycle
this and covid
Last edited by IdonthaveaScooby; 20 March 2022 at 10:03 AM.
21 March 2022, 04:44 AM
#278
Scooby Senior
21 March 2022, 05:29 AM
#279
Scooby Senior
Those Russian bears that like to fly "off the coast" of Scotland and Norway, are in fact way off the coast in international airspace. We send them a nice escort to keep them company, but they are doing nothing wrong. You'd also have to be extremely naive to think that we're not also flying sorties along the edge of Russian airspace.
It is fair to say, that we've let Vladimir get away with far too much for far too long. Our politicians were happy to turn a blind eye while welcoming Russian money. You can see now how the UK is lagging the EU and US when it comes to sanctioning individuals and seizing assets of the oligarchs. That fact that Boris overruled security advice to give Evgeny Lebedev a peerage and the fact that Lord Lebedev is still sitting in the house of Lords says it all about how implicit the conservative government is tied into enabling this crisis.
On perhaps a more interesting note, this conflict has really exposed how ill equipped, poorly trained and very uncoordinated the Russian war machine is. Their vehicles are old and unreliable and seemingly not für for purpose. They have also been unable to achieve air superiority which is really quite surprising. The West had been supplying Ukraine with many state of the art defensive weaponry which has never really been tested against a well equipped army. The anti-tank weapons habe proved extremely effective against the ageing Russian tanks. Similarly anti-aircraft defences have pretty much kept Russian aircraft grounded forcing Russia to rely on rockets which often also get shot down. The Ukrainian defense had been truly amazing.
The longer the conflict goes on for and the more Russian casualties are sustained, then the harder it becomes for Russia to sell the value of this "special operation" to it's people. Obviously the sanctions start to have a big impact on the Russian consciousness. When the few independent media channels are closed down, many internet portals such as Facebook and Instagram disappear, travel to some favourite holiday destinations are no longer possible, and many of their favourite products are no longer available and many foreign stores closing down. There will be an increasing feeling that Russia is being isolated and the freedoms they have enjoyed for the last 30 years are eroding as a new iron curtain is being erected. There will be little appetite amongst Russians to return to isolated living. We can only hope that the fear of the regime will become less than their desire for freedom and as in 1989 there will be a public uprising and a demand for regime change!
It is fair to say, that we've let Vladimir get away with far too much for far too long. Our politicians were happy to turn a blind eye while welcoming Russian money. You can see now how the UK is lagging the EU and US when it comes to sanctioning individuals and seizing assets of the oligarchs. That fact that Boris overruled security advice to give Evgeny Lebedev a peerage and the fact that Lord Lebedev is still sitting in the house of Lords says it all about how implicit the conservative government is tied into enabling this crisis.
On perhaps a more interesting note, this conflict has really exposed how ill equipped, poorly trained and very uncoordinated the Russian war machine is. Their vehicles are old and unreliable and seemingly not für for purpose. They have also been unable to achieve air superiority which is really quite surprising. The West had been supplying Ukraine with many state of the art defensive weaponry which has never really been tested against a well equipped army. The anti-tank weapons habe proved extremely effective against the ageing Russian tanks. Similarly anti-aircraft defences have pretty much kept Russian aircraft grounded forcing Russia to rely on rockets which often also get shot down. The Ukrainian defense had been truly amazing.
The longer the conflict goes on for and the more Russian casualties are sustained, then the harder it becomes for Russia to sell the value of this "special operation" to it's people. Obviously the sanctions start to have a big impact on the Russian consciousness. When the few independent media channels are closed down, many internet portals such as Facebook and Instagram disappear, travel to some favourite holiday destinations are no longer possible, and many of their favourite products are no longer available and many foreign stores closing down. There will be an increasing feeling that Russia is being isolated and the freedoms they have enjoyed for the last 30 years are eroding as a new iron curtain is being erected. There will be little appetite amongst Russians to return to isolated living. We can only hope that the fear of the regime will become less than their desire for freedom and as in 1989 there will be a public uprising and a demand for regime change!
The following users liked this post:
21 March 2022, 09:41 AM
#280
Normally only happens when the military and police are no longer being paid, because the country is banktrupt, and are willing to stand with the public
21 March 2022, 11:43 AM
#281
Scooby Senior
Whatever happens, the good times for Putins Russia are over! As long as he remains in power he will be living in paranoid fear of his own people!
21 March 2022, 12:13 PM
#282
Scooby Regular
21 March 2022, 10:30 PM
#283
Scooby Regular
Might have got a bit a bit lost on the translation. However the peace talk seems to say surrender or we will utterly destroy you.
might have misheard the odd word or two
might have misheard the odd word or two
22 March 2022, 09:43 AM
#284
Scooby Senior
22 March 2022, 07:12 PM
#286
Scooby Regular
So we could take out the 40m convoy. We could take out the ships now bombing
We are doing utterly nothing. Embarrassed at my own country
We are doing utterly nothing. Embarrassed at my own country
Last edited by Lozgti2; 23 March 2022 at 07:10 AM.
23 March 2022, 07:24 AM
#289
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/much-...181144673.html
23 March 2022, 10:12 AM
#291
Scooby Senior
If only he'd been half as good an actor as the quality of mental health professionals it would take to fix you.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/much-...181144673.html
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/much-...181144673.html
23 March 2022, 11:02 AM
#296
Scooby Regular
This is what US /UK have been doing across multiple continents for centuries
you'd really need to be very "Thick skinned " not to realise this
you'd really need to be very "Thick skinned " not to realise this
23 March 2022, 11:35 AM
#298
Scooby Regular
The only way left for the US now to impose the greenback on the whole world is unfortunately
War
very sad
its NOT the electorate , its the power shareholders behind large coperations / lobby groups
War
very sad
its NOT the electorate , its the power shareholders behind large coperations / lobby groups
Last edited by IdonthaveaScooby; 23 March 2022 at 11:57 AM.