Coronavirus Pah!
23 March 2020, 07:01 PM
#211
Trouble is what the f do you do when the money isn't there! After paying 3 months vat last week then being told a few days later it will be suspended so a big chunk of cash gone!
23 March 2020, 07:11 PM
#212
Since I first commented on this thread only 20 days ago where there were only 51 cases and 0 deaths to now over 5600 cases and 280 deaths, to be fair, how do you prepare for that? I don't think anyone here or the medical experts could have predicted the speed with which it has spread. Since then the Government has given advice that has resulted in the closure shops, pubs, leisure centres, gyms, cinemas, major sporting events, festivals, etc, committed hundreds of billions into NHS, funding salaries of millions workers, delayed taxes for all businesses for a year etc. Forgot the polictial personalities and caricatures that we hold of our ministers for a moment and think as a Government, given the short time frame, some recognition should be to the Government in pulling out all the stops to try and keep this country running the best it can. They can only do so much and can't count on the collective stupidity and selfishness of individuals not heeding the Governments advice.
the fact is the powers that be were woefully slow in reacting.
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23 March 2020, 07:21 PM
#215
I must say, Boris and his cronies really shouldn't be surprised that people are ignoring the advice around social distancing, they have spent the past 5 years convincing people that they shouldn't listen to experts (Gove June 2016 - "people in this country have had enough of experts" 
), so who'd have thought that would come back to bite them? 
Is it me, or does Boris just look like a lost little kid, utterly out of his depth?
), so who'd have thought that would come back to bite them? Is it me, or does Boris just look like a lost little kid, utterly out of his depth?
Last edited by lockheed; 23 March 2020 at 07:22 PM.
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23 March 2020, 07:59 PM
#217
Trust me, any virologist, biomedical scientist (me by education) or infectious disease specialist saw what was going to happen the minute it started. I worked for years for Novartis Vaccines (i was involved in the H1N1 and H5N1 vaccine project) amd everyone I spoke to from them days all saw what was going to happen.
the fact is the powers that be were woefully slow in reacting.
the fact is the powers that be were woefully slow in reacting.
23 March 2020, 08:35 PM
#218
Trust me, any virologist, biomedical scientist (me by education) or infectious disease specialist saw what was going to happen the minute it started. I worked for years for Novartis Vaccines (i was involved in the H1N1 and H5N1 vaccine project) amd everyone I spoke to from them days all saw what was going to happen.
the fact is the powers that be were woefully slow in reacting.
the fact is the powers that be were woefully slow in reacting.
23 March 2020, 08:54 PM
#219
Scooby Regular
Not enough masks and or testing of medical staff even now .....??
ony america could be worse in the developed world
can you even believe that tit of a president is bikering over funding , and how it'll all *look* bad on him
ony america could be worse in the developed world
can you even believe that tit of a president is bikering over funding , and how it'll all *look* bad on him
Last edited by IdonthaveaScooby; 24 March 2020 at 10:02 AM.
23 March 2020, 10:10 PM
#221
They were late and inadequate.
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23 March 2020, 10:39 PM
#222
So again, as a biomedical scientist by education, please explain what you would have imposed, what effect you think it would have and how you think the general public would recact to your impostion so early on? I guess, as a scientist, you have evidence for you to emphatically state that I'm wrong.
Last edited by jonc; 23 March 2020 at 10:42 PM.
23 March 2020, 10:46 PM
#223
Scooby Senior
The full measures needent be put into place immediately, but they should have been planned in advance and appropriate advice about what is coming given to businesses and public to make sure everyone is prepared. This government made no preparations and has been acting on the back foot ever since. While most European countries were closing their borders, Boris was still waffling on about herd immunity.
23 March 2020, 11:12 PM
#225
It really is about how quickly the government reacts!
The full measures needent be put into place immediately, but they should have been planned in advance and appropriate advice about what is coming given to businesses and public to make sure everyone is prepared. This government made no preparations and has been acting on the back foot ever since. While most European countries were closing their borders, Boris was still waffling on about herd immunity.
The full measures needent be put into place immediately, but they should have been planned in advance and appropriate advice about what is coming given to businesses and public to make sure everyone is prepared. This government made no preparations and has been acting on the back foot ever since. While most European countries were closing their borders, Boris was still waffling on about herd immunity.
Germany announced their lockdown when infection reached 27000, the UK at 6000, is that not quick enough for you?
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23 March 2020, 11:53 PM
#226
Scooby Senior
Well maybe, just like you, they didn't appreciate how the virus could potentially overwhelm the health system, but I'm only speculating. The Chancellor announced £330bn of measures I listed above to combat the coronavirus on 11 March, how long do you think it takes to plan something like that?
Germany announced their lockdown when infection reached 27000, the UK at 6000, is that not quick enough for you?
Germany announced their lockdown when infection reached 27000, the UK at 6000, is that not quick enough for you?
Those number merely reflect the amount of testing that has been done by each country. The number of deaths gives a more accurate picture of the situation in each country. UK has 281 deaths while Germany has 94 deaths. That puts the death rate in the UK at nearly 5% while in Germany its less than 0.4%. In reality, those figures are not accurate and the more you test, the lower the death rate will be. If you take the German death rate and apply it to the UK number of deaths, that would mean there are probably at least 70,000 cases in the UK, which means around 64,000 cases have not been detected in the UK.
The UK simply has no clue how widely spread the desise is due to a lack of testing. Germany has been testing as much as feasibly possible and have been able to far quickly identify cases and impose strict quaratine to anyone who has had contact with those people
As soon as the situation in Italy became apparent, Germany reacted immediately, started making it plans and gradually introduced restrictions. The same is true in Austria, Switzerland, Poland and many eastern European countries. From the start, the message has been clear and consistent.
What could the UK have done differently? It could have listened to Italy! It could have listened to the experts! It could have reacted much quicker with a conststent plan!
24 March 2020, 12:32 AM
#228
Not sure where you're getting those numbers from, the WHO states Germany has 24,774 cases.
Those number merely reflect the amount of testing that has been done by each country. The number of deaths gives a more accurate picture of the situation in each country. UK has 281 deaths while Germany has 94 deaths. That puts the death rate in the UK at nearly 5% while in Germany its less than 0.4%. In reality, those figures are not accurate and the more you test, the lower the death rate will be. If you take the German death rate and apply it to the UK number of deaths, that would mean there are probably at least 70,000 cases in the UK, which means around 64,000 cases have not been detected in the UK.
The UK simply has no clue how widely spread the desise is due to a lack of testing. Germany has been testing as much as feasibly possible and have been able to far quickly identify cases and impose strict quaratine to anyone who has had contact with those people
As soon as the situation in Italy became apparent, Germany reacted immediately, started making it plans and gradually introduced restrictions. The same is true in Austria, Switzerland, Poland and many eastern European countries. From the start, the message has been clear and consistent.
What could the UK have done differently? It could have listened to Italy! It could have listened to the experts! It could have reacted much quicker with a conststent plan!
Those number merely reflect the amount of testing that has been done by each country. The number of deaths gives a more accurate picture of the situation in each country. UK has 281 deaths while Germany has 94 deaths. That puts the death rate in the UK at nearly 5% while in Germany its less than 0.4%. In reality, those figures are not accurate and the more you test, the lower the death rate will be. If you take the German death rate and apply it to the UK number of deaths, that would mean there are probably at least 70,000 cases in the UK, which means around 64,000 cases have not been detected in the UK.
The UK simply has no clue how widely spread the desise is due to a lack of testing. Germany has been testing as much as feasibly possible and have been able to far quickly identify cases and impose strict quaratine to anyone who has had contact with those people
As soon as the situation in Italy became apparent, Germany reacted immediately, started making it plans and gradually introduced restrictions. The same is true in Austria, Switzerland, Poland and many eastern European countries. From the start, the message has been clear and consistent.
What could the UK have done differently? It could have listened to Italy! It could have listened to the experts! It could have reacted much quicker with a conststent plan!
"Lothar Wieler, the president of the Robert Koch Institute (RKI), the government’s central public health body, has said he does not expect there to be a significant difference in mortality rates between Italy and Germany in the long run."
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...uzzles-experts
So I'd take their confirmed deaths with a pinch of salt for now.
You can get all the latest figures and for all the other countries from this site: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries
You keep stating the Government should have reacted quicker and listened better, but you don't say what policy or measure specfically they should put in place that would reduce or halt the spread. But I think haters are gonna hate. Nothing this Government does, whatever the measures, past, present and future, to tackle this crisis will ever please you.
Last edited by jonc; 24 March 2020 at 12:41 AM.
24 March 2020, 04:22 AM
#229
Have to say, I am extremely worried generally
24 March 2020, 04:51 AM
#230
a) isn't capable of doing their job from home, or
b) doesn't work for one of the business types that's been told to close, or
c) hasn't been told by their employer to stay home because the business is going into voluntary shutdown
should still carry on going into work until/unless they or someone in their household starts showing symptoms.
24 March 2020, 09:14 AM
#233
If a business doesn't involve working directly with the public, it's pretty likely it will be staying open. The only reason(s) it might close while this is going on is if too many staff are affected, or it's no longer economically viable to keep running due to reduced demand.
24 March 2020, 09:51 AM
#236
Scooby Senior
Well this is what the experts think regarding Germany's low death rate:
"Lothar Wieler, the president of the Robert Koch Institute (RKI), the government’s central public health body, has said he does not expect there to be a significant difference in mortality rates between Italy and Germany in the long run."
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...uzzles-experts
So I'd take their confirmed deaths with a pinch of salt for now.
You can get all the latest figures and for all the other countries from this site: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries
You keep stating the Government should have reacted quicker and listened better, but you don't say what policy or measure specfically they should put in place that would reduce or halt the spread. But I think haters are gonna hate. Nothing this Government does, whatever the measures, past, present and future, to tackle this crisis will ever please you.
"Lothar Wieler, the president of the Robert Koch Institute (RKI), the government’s central public health body, has said he does not expect there to be a significant difference in mortality rates between Italy and Germany in the long run."
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...uzzles-experts
So I'd take their confirmed deaths with a pinch of salt for now.
You can get all the latest figures and for all the other countries from this site: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries
You keep stating the Government should have reacted quicker and listened better, but you don't say what policy or measure specfically they should put in place that would reduce or halt the spread. But I think haters are gonna hate. Nothing this Government does, whatever the measures, past, present and future, to tackle this crisis will ever please you.
Sure hindsight is a great thing, but foresight is even better!
Throughout this crisis, I've been getting news and information from both German and UK sources. From the media, from the governments in both countries and from friends and family in many more countries. When I compare the message I've been getting from Germany to that from the UK, it's really quite apparent that the UK was woefully slow to react to this and start taking it seriously.
The announcements in the UK are all reactionary and not fully thought out. Take the closing of schools for example, they hand't worked out who the vital people who kids could still go to school were before the announcement, which just leads to confusion. When they announced school closures in Germany, they already identified key jobs who's kids would receive care during closures before making the announcement. It's not rocket science to work out you need to make a complete plan before making an announcement, but the UK continues to make half plans and then sort out the details later.
It seems to me only Donald Trump is doing a worse job of managing this crisis!
24 March 2020, 09:56 AM
#237
24 March 2020, 10:02 AM
#238
If a business doesn't involve working directly with the public, it's pretty likely it will be staying open. The only reason(s) it might close while this is going on is if too many staff are affected, or it's no longer economically viable to keep running due to reduced demand.
24 March 2020, 10:12 AM
#239
I interpret the lockdown
If you have to work with anyone who isnt living in your house and your job is not essential (medical, food distribution) then stay away from everyone else.
By all means have a walk, cycle, run but completely away from non family
The rest of us, stay at home, inside
If you have to work with anyone who isnt living in your house and your job is not essential (medical, food distribution) then stay away from everyone else.
By all means have a walk, cycle, run but completely away from non family
The rest of us, stay at home, inside
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