BrownPantsRacing

iTrader: (6)

Is a godo thread, reading now, on page 7 and have to say Jerrick and MeisterR coming across well, while another trader Clivew is making himself sound like an aggressive tool who thinks he knows everything while trying to directly compare £2.5k Ohline to £700 MeisterR coilovers. Can only see praise so far for MeisterR from lots of users like myself.

Honestly Smurf, don't know why you feel you need to constantly shoot things down you have no personal experience of. I only comment on my personal experiences.

Are you honestly saying Ohlins have never made a bad shock or made a mistake?

SmurfyBhoy

His point is there is no comparison between the cheap stuff and the stuff not made to fit a small budget, especially on the road where the cheap stuff shows its true colours

I did like the idea of the longer travel ones with helper springs that markyscoob mentions in another thread, couldnt find a price but i imagine with the fancy valving & extra length its not the entry level budget ones, even then still no match for a proper strut & spring for comfort on a rough road.

I'm saying they are not made out of the same low cost material so should last & perform quite a bit better....

Not sure if the cheap ones are repairable either, afaik my BC's were for the bin if anything happens to them.

BrownPantsRacing

iTrader: (6)

LOL. On page 14 now and reading post 207 which is nice to see. Well written review by a member with a lot of experience with different brands etc.

MeisterR units still looking good and nice to see Jerrick really wading in with info and specs to be honest. This is one reason that swung me to buy these, there support and communication is excellent.

I should add, I'm considering MeisterR GT1's for my MY15 because overall they will have greater suspension travel and general road tolerance than my lowered STI suspension setup.

Anyway, good thread Smurf. Thanks for sharing.

BrownPantsRacing

iTrader: (6)

Just got to the image of the snapped BC coilover. OUCH.

SmurfyBhoy

See i don't just troll

Thats the latest shape STI eh ? did you lower it yourself ? i've never tried a lowering spring and thought that's comfier, did you run it on stock springs ever ? plus that being the new shape you can be a brand 5lut and go after Ohlins even if it's just for the toolbox sticker

BrownPantsRacing

iTrader: (6)

Yep, mine is the MY15 new shape STI that I purchased before I sold my FSTI recently. I ran it on the standard STI springs and standard shocks for a while and it was very good. Handling very good out of the box and minimal body roll. The standard STI setup is quite stiff, even more so than a newage STI. A few people have complained about it, but to be honest it's fine. I fitted H&R lowering springs to the standard struts and so far it's been ok. Certainly no more harsh or crashy than standard and you wouldn't really notice much of a difference, except for the fact I've also fitted subframe kit, camber bolts and adjustable brackets so the whole car could be setup to the recommended fast road settings. It's good, no complaints so far, but obviously it's a daily and not a race car so it won't get pushed to it's limits. Bumpy B roads are just fine at the moment, but I think suspension travel is probably compromised now with the springs.

ST-X

Definitely not. The problem with coilovers is that there are just so many more parts involved which take up too much of the budget for a set price vs struts. You can pick up basic strut bodies for some cars for less than £50 a corner, so when you're paying £150 a corner (or more) the majority of that extra cost will be in the internals. With coilovers at £150 a corner you're paying most of your money for a complex chassis, even if it isn't very good. Coilovers can be perfectly fine for road use if they a) have enough travel, b) have the right damping and c) have the right springs. Unfortunately the problem arises when people buy cheap ones and expect them to be as good as top dollar stuff. From what I've seen of the internals of the BC's they're actually quite well made, and I know a few guys with other cars who've taken inspiration from the Lexus thread to revalve them using 46mm Bilstein pistons and a more complex shim stack. But that's custom, not stock, and at the budget end of the stock spectrum you have to accept that there will be compromises. And the biggest one for me is travel, particularly when the damping is complex enough to control the lesser travel. When a basic Koni insert costs the same as a fully assembled BC coilover you know that something is different. Sure, the Koni's aren't perfect but the comfort is equal to whatever springs you use them with at low speed (with WRX springs they feel virtually stock), and the control on rough and undulating roads simply blows the cheap coilover options out the water. I also have confidence they'll last slightly longer.

As an example, back when I used to race MTB's the best shock I had wasn't the mega expensive one, it was instead the basic cheap thing that had been custom tuned with a new piston and shim stack. It had great fluid flow to prevent spiking while the shim stacks on both rebound and compression gave exactly the control I was after. Was it any good for someone who didn't know what they wanted or how to tune their suspension? Hell no, but it fulfilled my very specific requirements. Interestingly the shocks at this time were valved with way too little compression valving which meant they actually felt better to *most* mid-pack riders in the carpark test (which led to glowing reviews) but didn't actually perform well when on track under someone quick. That's similar to the contrast in requirements with suspension; someone wanting to track their car will want something different to someone who favours rural road blasts who will again want something different to someone who wants low, big wheels and 'the look'. And unless you're spending absolute top dollar for some premium Ohlins coilovers these are not goals which can be mutually achieved from one setup.

SmurfyBhoy

What suspension setup do the Halo models use ?

Ra-R/S203/4

Surely as these are considered the best roadgoing OEM cars is it not safe to say they come with the best OEM setup ?

A little off track here but for me, the best all round car I've driven recently is the Mk7 Golf R with the Optional Suspension DCC i think its called, i was amazed with this setup as far as comfort/damping goes,

I would also say on a smooth track the budget coilovers will stand up better to the gucci stuff, than they would on a rough road,

Soon as you have those solid metal top mounts NVH goes up big time,

As far as £150 per corner goes see how far it get you when you want to properly overhaul the OEM stuff With every little spring cover rubber seats etc, i mean even a good set of OEM Group N topmounts will not leave much change

BrownPantsRacing

iTrader: (6)

Totally agree on the top mount comments. This is one reason I wanted to go lowering springs on standard struts on my MY15 STI. You can clearly hear an increase in road noise with solid top mounts on coilovers and I wanted to maintain a little refinement on the new car.

Mick

iTrader: (1)

Quite a good review on the Ohlins on a MY15 WRX STi here...

BrownPantsRacing

iTrader: (6)

If I could afford Ohlins, I'd have a younger more expensive wife.

2pot

iTrader: (3)

Front spring 6.1kg/m
Rear spring 5.1kg/m
Nice relationship front to rear, but too stiff for a UK b-road.

SmurfyBhoy

For a comparison with Coilovers tho i was meaning, they must be far more compliant ?

Do they not use any fancy shocks or that too ?

2pot

iTrader: (3)

s203/s204 same springs
s203 adjustable dampers
s204 non-adjustable dampers

The damper controls the oscillations of the particular spring.
A coilover is a strut. But, with an adjustable perch and a small diameter spring.
Lower the spring rate, taller the ride height, the more compliant you can make it.
You can fake it, with high rate springs, as mentioned earlier by @ST-X: the ratio between rebound and compression damping is key.
A 3:1 ratio rebound to compression is common - feels OK, comfort-wise. 1:1 low speed damping is better, at speed - like a Koni insert at its softer adjustment settings.
Bump stops are key, to chassis balance.
Or, you could use the compression damping, to effectively replace the bump stop.

Markyscoob

Sorry. yes I do run the ZR. Most difficult thing is finding a place under the hood for the gas bottles on a standard Hawkeye under bonnet fit.

Cambs_Stuart

iTrader: (3)

I had meister r's on my daily drive/family transport wrx wagon. They were fine, even on a 10hr drive home from Devon with wife and two children. So I've no hesitation in recommending them.
However a really well recommended set up I don't think has been mentioned is the PCA dynamics springs and koni shocks.
When I costed it up the PCA dynamics plus new top mounts so in was about £150 more than the meister R's.

SmurfyBhoy

Could you give us a rough guide to how much those cost all in ?

Compared to the ones you mentioned you had previously with the helper springs and extra travel ?

How do those two compare back to back ?

Thanks

Markyscoob

OK. the ER's lasted about 36,000 miles and ran with 6/5 in Summer and 5/4 in Winter. Nicely adjustable, towards the end I got a wheezing sound at the back and all needed quite a lot of damping winding in to stop the bouncing. They were +60mm so I could (and did0 run them slightly higher than O.E. in the snow and lower in Summer, but only slightly. The problem is BC don't supply springs long enough! Do the calculations and the standard springs would go coil bound unless you use the helpers. Having them just reduces travel. Eventually I fitted a longer set of springs from Demon Tweeks and that enabled me to run them nice and supple. Dirt was the other problem, the boots aren't long enough on longer travel stuff.

The ZRs come with limited warranty, and with +40mm I again got helper springs. The minimum supplied spring rates are 10/8. I thought that silly stiff but learned a lesson in that. More worried was that the 10kg was only 180mm long. Far too short.

Anyway. I've got them on 8/6, with the helpers half compressed and wound out to the maximum permitted. For next Summer I will order a set of longer 10/8 springs and do away with the helpers. The high rates didn't translate at all into a jarring ride, actually the car is softer and very nice. No bounce, no wobble, just a properly damped ride.

These have rebound 30 clicks and it only went from too soft to Goldilocks with 15 clicks in. The Hose leads to a gas bottle and compression adjusters on them. I am running slow compression at 2 clicks of 20 and high speed fully off. Standard is both fully off.

I'm sure I could get them to racetrack hard with just a few more clicks underneath and a few on top but it's nigh on perfect for now.

The BIG difference this time, is I have a tin of ZX-1 grease and the neoprene boots to keep them spotless. I will not pressure wash them, but everything down below is now sprayed liberally with ACF-50. Cost is just short of 2K. Eye watering, yes, but the thing with the Chinese/Taiwanese machine shops is you get what you pay for. Each can turn out cheap tat and also exquisite jewels on request, as long as you pay for it.

BC are a big manufacturer, they make stuff for a lot of people. You can recognise a lot of parts on a lot of other big names' struts.... Anodising a different colour is hardly a USP.... The know how is there, it's not rocket science. Valving and oil viscosity are a known engineering discipline and the ZR is huge step up from the ER for about £100 a corner more.

Inverted struts do need to be kept clean and pampered regularly though. My car only does 1,000-2,000 miles a re year now due to work.

Mick

iTrader: (1)

Got myself the Tegiwa coilover covers and a can of the ACF-50 - ready to get them protected when I swap the winter wheels on
Thanks for the advice

SmurfyBhoy

Thanks for that budd.

Sounds like a pretty unique setup.

hackisfun

Just replaced my knocking suspension with eibach pro street s coilovers. Including new rear top mounts and whitrline front mounts and new sets of own front and rear droplinks.

took the mechanic over a day to install due to compressor failing and dealing with multiple seized and cross threaded bolts caused by a previous owner lowering it badly.

First impressions are very good, handling definitely improv3d however still taking it easy as wheel alignment and camber still need done.

Mick

iTrader: (1)

Front Ohlins R&T - Legacy GT2.0 spec.B


Rear Ohlins R&T - Legacy GT2.0 spec.B


Front Ohlins R&T with Tegiwa 'sock' - Legacy GT2.0 spec.B

Kaosone

Those Evo owners make the scooby lot over here look like a jolly bunch in comparison

I am pretty sure you've sold me on the MeisterR's...

The more I read the more good things are said about them & their customer service & specifically the ride quality. Plus ZetaCRD's are in the same ballpark (price wise) as BC's BR series (which seem to get mixed reviews).

While it seems like KW Variant 3's are the holy grail as our friend in post 207 says "it's not logical to spend 20% of your cars value on its suspension.

Ste333

iTrader: (3)

so in the end, after reading all this and pondering for a few months. I bit the bullet and bought some HSD coilovers. I DO think they're going to be a bit more bouncy/harsh than I wanted....but they came up at a good price and my knocking rear shock(s) are forcing my hand somewhat. I did opt for softer spring rates of 5/4, so I'll give some feedback once they're on. I'm under no illusions that they're a budget coilover kit and I've had these same ones (DualTech) before. If they **** me off too much, I'll save up and go for the KYB/oem top mount/eibach spring route.

RRP1STI

Any more info/feedback on these?

boggissimo

I missed lots of this thread as I don't have an Impreza anymore so hardly ever visit, but wanted to add that I fitted HSD coilovers on my blob wagon when I first got it, as the OEM shocks were knackered. The HSDs were very hard and harsh, and I soon looked for an alternative. After a fair bit of reading around I went for MeisterR Zeta CRDs (the £800 ones) and they instantly made the car lovable again! I used them for a couple of years and having adjustable damping for road vs track was very helpful. I never adjusted the ride height after setting it just after fitting them, as I had the geometry done and didn't want to keep having it done again. When the wagon died against a wall at Silverstone earlier this year, I bought a Legacy wagon instead. I took the MeisterRs off before I got rid of the carcass so if anyone wants them, drop me a PM!