Mr Fuji

I think that there is always going to be issues in mass transit or private vehicles. Getting around quicker than nature intends is always going to have consequences, but electric (by whatever means - personally I'm hoping for 'Mr Fusion' from Back to the Future
) has to be the way to go.

I will miss the thrill of petrol engines (though I doubt they will be anywhere near gone by the time I shed my mortal coil), but time moves on, electric is, on the whole, less polluting, we have to progress. We will overcome most of the polluting elements of creating electric cars, I am sure of it, but we will never remove the fact that burning fossil fuels is bad.

dpb

There's 192 cells in car battery pack !

And anyway What about the weekly cost of hiring those batteries . Need to re address those 'savings'

andy97

iTrader: (1)

Hiring, what's this concept?

Either buy or don't buy

jonc

How so? I'm not the one bragging about how "clean" and non-polluting I am. The hypocracy is you highlighting the how London is a filthy polluted place to work and where carbon particles "could potentially" be passed on to unborn babies. Never mind the fact of the direct harmful effects to children actually working and mining the cobalt, nickel and lithium in a far away country for your lithium ion powered cars (out of sight, out of mind!). Sure you can be smug in the comfort of your nice clean car and brag how little it costs YOU to consume and run these cars, but do bare in mind the cost of those who bring that technology to you at the other end of the process and at least be gracious in acknowledging this.

andy97

iTrader: (1)

Wind now generating 20Giga Watts of electricity

An ever increasing capacity from nearly 20 years ago when the first turbines were installed

Deployment climbed to 1 GW in 2005 and 5 GW in 2010 before expanding to 10 GW in 2013 and 15 GW in early 2017 — meaning that a further 5 GW was added in the last 21 months

dpb

andy97

iTrader: (1)

Just amazing pollution. I see quite regularly older diesels belching out blue smoke and soot. Thankfully, just recently I am seeing less older vehicles on the road.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

dpb

dpb

No more leccy hybrid grants

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.i...166.html%3famp

andy97

iTrader: (1)

This is good news, 95% of journeys could be done by electric only. Quicker ICE are phased out tbe better

dpb

Have to start putting ved on pure electric sooner or later , as well as fuel duty ( somehow )

dpb

So the new dyson leccy car , will be built in the far east And be more expensive to buy in uk than in the eu ....

what a result

BMWhere?

Not sure it'll even be sold anywhere in Europe. Seems they are primarily targeting the Asian market, at least in the beginning!
Dyson is a w@nker anyway; manufactures nothing in the UK and then sells at stupid prices. His first cleaners were revolutionary, since then the competition has caught up.
Be interesting to see if his cars double as road sweepers though

Richy P1984

He does employ quite a few people in the UK for research and development purposes though.

dpb

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Scooby_LewC

Here's a really interesting video to watch from Engineering Explained.. a proper engineer and someone who cites all sources etc regarding the environmental impact in terms of emissions over a usable vehicle life-cycle from producing the vehicle to scrapping it of BEV's/Hybrids and ICE. You may be surprised, I certainly was!

Either way, there's no denying Li-Ion mining is destructive and dirty process but we can't be on our high horses when it comes to cars when we're sat typing this at laptop computers whilst messaging on our iPhones!

I'm kind of balanced on EV's - The tech is early and is evolving rapidly, anything here now will be obsolete within a few years imo. I was working on product development in the i-Pace project for JLR and it's an incredible machine truly truly stunning. Would I have one? Yes. Would I still have a Subaru/Weekend toy in the garage? Yes.

andy97

iTrader: (1)

Well, who'd of thunk it, running an electric vehicle takes very little time to be in credit in relation to emission payback.

^Qwerty^

Not sure I buy that. I'm fully able to accept that a leccy car is cheaper to run, but the envrionment story doesn't stack up for me. I only have to look a few miles down the road at Drax burning the trees (some hardwood) chopped down in NA to know that our green electric is not as green as it seems.

Scooby_LewC

I think that's the sticking point for me - until the energy being used to generate the electricity is completely renewable such as Iceland, which is near on 100% now.. then it's not 'green'

He covers that in depth in his video by looking over a few states in America and makes numbers based upon how much of their energy is green etc .. obviously I don't live there to see that in action or not but those are numbers cited by their relevant states (and I'm sure they're completely reliable )

dpb

So have i got this right

There's almost no benefit to the environment in having a leccy car in places where coal is king ie most the undeveloped world

andy97

iTrader: (1)

So because its not totally non CO2 neutral, youll keep using and burning fossil fuels to run your car, when running an electric car for local journeys and 95% of all journeys are local, does significantly reduce localised pollution?

dpb

its global warming thats the problem , isnt it !

the particulates from diesel is a side issue

Scooby_LewC

Absolutely. I'd get an electric car because it suits me and my needs. If I could get the same performance and range as my daily for the same monthly payments etc then I'd already be in one but they're out of reach at the moment and certainly not the front of the queue of cars when I look in the region of my monthly payments. I can't say they excite me (aside from the Teslas, I-Paces etc which amount to big money).

I think locally it absolutely makes sense in terms of reducing local pollution, that's not really looking at the bigger picture. Offsetting pollution locally doesn't solve the issue, but it is a start!

Scooby_LewC

Yes. I can't imagine seeing many fast chargers in the middle of nowhere either!

As Andy97 points out though, it's a definite benefit to local environment though. At the end of the day, if an electric car works for you and you can afford it, then it's ace and no doubt a great experience to own, that just isn't me at the moment though.

^Qwerty^

I think my issue is that CO2 is not measured that comes out the chimney at Drax due to politics and polices rather than the truth, so the actual CO2 released when generating the leccy is much higher than the figures quoted, but still no doubt less than burning petrol etc. Secondly, cutting down forests in North America is not sustainable. There is also dubious claims about how much CO2 new trees soak up to what the old ones produce when burned. I fully buy the argument that a Note is cheaper to run, but the environmental argument is dodgy to say the least, especially if hardwood forests are being cut down, in part, to power them.

BMWhere?

His arguments about mining are somewhat sketchy! His claim that lithium extraction is only done in areas where nothing can survive is just plain rubbish. There are many communities, particularly in Bolivia that have been severely impacted in areas quite far away from where the mining is taking place as ground water is taken from water rich areas for the lithium extraction and resulting in shortages of water and expansion of desert.

He also fails to address the environmental impact of mining for other materials such as cobalt and nickel and not to mention all the other nasty chemicals that are used in batteries.

There are far more scientific studies that show that from a CO2 perspective (globally not just US) EV's are marginally better over the life of the vehicle, but the total environmental impact when you consider the mining and chemical environmental damage, then EV's are slightly worse.

The general recommendation is to only use EV's in urban driving to remove harmful emissions from inner-cities.

There is still the fundamental problem that the capacity of the electrical grid is not sufficient to cope with large scale adoption of EV's.

The best solution to reduce petrol vehicles is hydrogen, but until we have government policy to expand the hydrogen supply network, then the take up will be zero. Consider California and Japan where legislation has been made for hydrogen supply - these are the only two places where hydrogen vehicles are being sold to the public.

With hydrogen, you have zero emissions at the vehicle. Lower CO2 costs of vehicle production the petrol cars, Lower mining and chemical impact. Slightly higher hydrogen production environmental costs which are reducing with continuous research in hydrogen production efficiency. Overall currently better than EVs and improving!

dpb

SO Dull, they had provide muzak backing track

andy97

iTrader: (1)

So electric car smashes the Nurburgring lap record, no surprise there

My Nissan left a 3litre Audi entering onto a bypass

My Tesla is so fast with normal acceleration, Ive put it into Chill mode for a more pleasant 7 sec 0-60

The Nissan is going soon for the Tesla 3 for the wife.. Now, she will use all the AWD power