trails

iTrader: (41)

Isn't that the same with any collective of anyone or anything that agree to abide by a certain set of rules?

trails

iTrader: (41)

I think there is a valid argument for a second referendum, but I wonder how much of that is because I voted remain...it's a sticky wicket regardless; dammed if they do, dammed if they don't...but isn't that what we pay these ******* for?

On-the-bog

Very True.

Although EU was never voted on int he first place, just a trade agreement was. But that discussion has been done to death

trails

iTrader: (41)

well quit it then

On-the-bog

Why is there any valid argument for it? The majority spoke. All this crap about it not being a big enough majority is stupid, a majority is 1 vote more.

Besides it's not a decision we can evaluate based on a few months. Once were out, deals in place and things have settle down for a couple of years we will know.

Geezer

No one has said we cannot trade with the EU, so after we leave we continue to trade with them, but more likely than not, on worse terms.

Now, if France's trade with us amounts to 15% of their foreign trade, they take a hit on 15% of their trade. If Germany has 15% of their trade with us, they take a hit on 15% of their trade. And on it goes, each individual member state takes a hit, but not a great one.

However, 46% of our trade is with the EU. It doesn't matter which states they are individually, we trade with the EU as a bloc, we cannot trade with them individually. So, you can say the EU trades with us a lot (but still only about 18% of their trade), but they will suffer a lot less than the UK will.

It really is as simple as that.

I suspect if the question on the referendum has been something like "Would you rather have less immigration but a considerably worse economic situation or have immigration but a strong economy without a failing currency" instead of the ambiguous "Should the UK remain a member of the EU?" then I suspect the outcome would have been different.

The question was too simplistic and didn't allow people any chance of making an informed choice unless they were willing to invest considerable time to look at the ramifications. Leave campaign was then able to appeal to the fears of an island nation, it was too easy.

Hey ho

On-the-bog

No you quit it

O god, we sound like mp's, there's no hope for us,,,,

hodgy0_2

lol, b0ll0cks

and made more hilarious by the fact that you laugh at the remain crowd getting it wrong

trails

iTrader: (41)

I think there are a few, but my particular #1 reason is the lies spouted by the leave lot.

On-the-bog

And that in itself is a leading question. How do you know if the economy is going to be weaker? your guessing it will be weaker, it could as easily be stronger. Right now the BOE is predicted higher than initially expected growth.

Again it comes back to optimism vs pessimism,

The question was and still is simple, how you came about the answer to that question is what is not.

Geezer

What's good for the goose is good for the gander, don't you think?

Of course, there is some truth in that, but it would be good to know what sort of deal we can get before exiting, wouldn't you agree?

On-the-bog

And the remain were just as bad, the whole argument was won on who could shovel the most **** on the other side

On-the-bog

I agree on that, but that was never going to happen.

trails

iTrader: (41)

That is utter bollocks and you know it.

On-the-bog

I laugh at the people on their soap box sprouting doom and gloom being proven wrong.

Martin2005

Which is why we should never hold referendums

On-the-bog

O so everything they said was fact? Come on, both sides were at it. Both sides ran negative campaigns.

Look at the US pres election, it isn't about who is better, its about who is least worse.

On-the-bog

How else do you gauge it?

Our system is broken because of party politics. each MP should vote the way the majority of their constituents want them to vote, not the way their party leader tells them to vote.

But again this is going way way off track from the original point

Geezer

Its clear that we will not get unfettered access to the single market without unrestricted movement of people.

So, the options are a Norwegian type affair, which Brexiteers don't like, or a hard Brexit, which means WTO rules, so increased tariffs, so our relationship with the EU is going to cost more. Unless you think we shouldn't trade with them at all?

That leaves our trade with the rest of the world. I'm sure some deals will be great, but you can get your bottom dollar that a country like China is going to want to get the best deal for them, not us (as they have already shown). I think it unlikely that the world of queuing up to give old Blighty the deals they want, as opposed to the deals they want. It will be long, protracted business, some good, some not so good.

We do not have the manufacturing base, or workforce anymore, to become competitive against the far east.

What does that leave us with? Our services industry, which is heavily dependent on our EU membership.

Sounds like a winner to me.........

trails

iTrader: (41)

I talked about deliberate misinformation, not negative campaigns...oh, sorry I mean £350M mistakes (vote grabbing lies).

Paben

iTrader: (5)

Sad but true. And I am confident that not a single poster on this thread has altered their opinion on the subject one iota

hodgy0_2

lol, your simply in denial

trails

iTrader: (41)

I'd love to see anther vote, both from the perspective of leaving being a dumb thing to do...and to see what the results would be a second time around.

On-the-bog

I suspect with the current fear and panic mongering it would prob go other way.

But thats what people are like.

trails

iTrader: (41)

Fixed that for you

On-the-bog

Or you could aqdd that the scaremongering hasn't come to pass as well.

All about perspective

trails

iTrader: (41)

And how is the pound doing? [Bangs head against wall]

dpb

except the highest profile outers have since be completely rumbled as self serving power seekers and little else

Geezer

That's because we haven't left the EU yet

scoobyboy1

iTrader: (16)

First time voting in the EU referendum obviously

I always vote, im in my early 30's and have been voting since 18 years old, So not a first time voter, and I dont get to upset when the party I vote for doesn't get elected either!!!