hodgy0_2

yes, or more simply put

"where is everybody"

well I would argue my actual point was nuanced by saying "simple life form"

and the question of how that, if discovered would change things (again my belief is that we will find strong evidence)

but anyway

obviously the basic problem with the Fermi Paradox is that stripped away from its fancy name it comes down to that old

"god of the gaps" argument

maybe they are communicating in a way we don't yet understand, using technology beyond our current grasp - a myriad of possibilities

after all it won't be the first time in history actual knowledge has closed a once seemingly impossible "gap" in our understanding

JTaylor

Fermi was a weak agnostic so I'm unsure why the Nobel Prize winning genius would offer-up a hypothesis that was in support of a god of the gaps. That the paradox does support a Christian worldview is coincidental.

hodgy0_2

careful that simply sounds like an argument from Authority

and I don't think it ever made it into an hypothesis - more of a thought experiment

edited to add - we have only recently discovered amino acids (building block of life) on meteorites

and bacteria on the outside international space station

a tiny "god of the gaps" closed

Fermi died 60 od years ago - science moves us on

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermi_paradox - examines many reason why it might be so

but I will concede that chances of another Clarkson are infinitesimally small

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

A friend of mine once coined the phrase 'Land rights for gay wales' during a similar discussion, I have to say I think there is a large element of 'fashion' involved in the original topic.

Something else I find amusing is. religious people are perfectly willing to accept some sort of entity created the world in 7 days, yet suggest that we are not alone and just maybe we evolved from other creatures, and it's considered to be an absurd point of view.

JTaylor

Evening, Ditch. I've been mulling over how to respond to this and have trawled through some footage and papers that I thought might help unpack things. If you find ten minutes, perhaps you'll draw some understanding from the video below. These are, in my opinion, some of the best theologians on our planet.

Norman Dog

iTrader: (1)

Hmm, bet Charlie Sheen wishes he'd never been 'curious' about them.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrit...al-man-6893577

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Ok I only managed to get somewhere around half way through that.

As suggested one needs to get into the minds of the time, which to me says, back then the scholars were dealing with mostly un-educated people, and could basically sell them any old crock of the proverbial. (or even proverbs )

Problem now being, the vast majority are educated, so all that flash of lightning, thunder (Big bang theory ) doesn't hold water, due to educated, enquiring, independent minds coming to their own conclusions and being able to prove it in the cold hard light of day.

So the answer, (bugger these science boys have rumbled us) erm, erm, erm, these things need to be taken in context.

JTaylor

You've not understood. Watch the whole vid' in order to get a handle on the 'seven day' scenario.

dpb

has it got anything at all to do with the original post ?

Paben

iTrader: (5)

Not in any way; before this point Clarkson would have glazed over and walked off!

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Ok I've listened to the end, sorry to say I'm not convinced, they just come across as being somewhat similar to a guy at the fairground trying to convince me a slight of hand is magic.

I could go further, but you're happy in your faith and I wouldn't want to cast any doubts in your mind because I know you're a bit of a thinker and a dweller on such matters.

Ultimately my opinion of religion is, if it makes people happy, helps them get through the day and helps them to be a good person, then it's fine by me, it's just a shame that so many followers seem intent on forcing their faith upon the rest of us that either don't feel the need or have any interest, to the point of murder in the name of their version.

To me it's no different to Lord of the Rings fans wanting to convert or kill Harry Potter fans.

Both great books but neither a reason to kill some one because they don't agree with you.

JTaylor

Of what?

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

ok it's raining and I have nothing better to do until it's time to cook dinner so I'll let you in for a game of ping pong.

Of the way they're trying to move the posts, I get the contextualisation argument, but as usual they're only prepared to accept it's validity with regards to their side of the argument.

Since the scientific evidence is not refutable they're now trying to align themselves with it. I'd have more respect for them if they were more like muslims and just blindly followed regardless, that's real faith, however missed placed

The people in your vid are basically p1ssing on me and trying to tell me it's raining, but there's a funny smell and it's steaming.

Turbohot

JTaylor

Thanks for indulging me.

Who set-up the posts in the first place? Augustine of Hippo argued that Genesis was to be interpreted as true-myth back in the 4th century! The ancients never intended the creation myth to be accepted as scientific fact, the concept didn't even exist. You claim to understand the contextualisation position, but seem put out that it supports a rational worldview.

Who are "they"? A shady cartel with some special agenda? What the men in the video have done is follow the evidence and you don't like it because it renders your caricature of the Christian inaccurate.

You wouldn't have more respect, you would have more ammunition.

ZANY

Clarkson must be an atheist as he don't give a **** and has all the fun top guy full stop
Religion law politics are all here to control the weak while the strong will always ask why

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Easy tiger, did we get out of the wrong side of bed today.

As usual you're over thinking the reading on my giveash1tometer but fyi I do actually think it is akin to what you say (the lady does protesteth too much ) about cartels with special agendas, after all the church has spent century's spreading the word, if that's not proof of an agenda, I don't know what is.

As for scientific fact, I'm not sure they were even aware of science per se, and most likely unable to comprehend the concept at the time or what significance it would have in the future, maybe because they were too busy with their agenda of the time.

JTaylor

My patience is wearing a little thin. Apologies.

You've not uncovered a conspiracy here, Ditch. As already quoted on this very thread, Jesus said in Mark 6:16 "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation". It's exoteric, an agenda in plain sight!