Carnut

last post.

In this day and age with the Internet being what it is and the papers on a slow decline is there any real reason for press regulations?

All the press need to do is spread a rumour through the Internet and then publish a story based on the findings from the net.

It happens already, a story builds momentum on the net or Facebook and the bbc or whoever put it in the news.

jonc

But you on the other hand then accuse most people in this country, ie. "ordinary people", of not giving a **** about anyone but themselves and happy in condoning paedophilia and, with me also as an ordinary person of this country, you associate me to scum. So there is a dichotomy here; you are the first to criticise the people of this country, and yet allude to caring about the reporting of ordinary people through a government backed press regulation, you even mention the plight of those affected by the Hillsborough disaster to try and support your argument and yet quite openly, in other threads, call all football fans nothing more than brainless violent tribal thugs.

Carnut

I hate to jump on jonc's wagon but I do agree with what he has said, the evidence is there for all to read and although it may not be a true reflection it does justify a certain amount of confusion on our side.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

So the 'I support the state' dig didn't work, the 'I support luvvies' dig didn't work so now you are trying the 'I support football fans' tack.

FYI I have never said ALL football fans are brainless violent tribal thugs, but I have said football is the ONLY sport that attracts those types which is true. That said most of the families of the victims weren't at the game themselves so your point is moot anyway.

At the end of the day the press have wrecked thousands of people's lives, many of those incidents are well documented in Leveson if you care to read it. They are facts not conjecture. Personally I think that is wrong and want them brought to account and stopped from doing the same thing to anyone else.

You, on the other hand, unless I am mistaken, are coming across with the view that they should be left to get on with it and therefore I can only surmise you think they way they behave is broadly acceptable in the name of the 'freedom of the press'. In my book the lack of condemnation of their behaviour is basically an indicator of tacit support for their practices and frankly that doesn't make you someone I want to have much to do with. Sorry, but that's how I see it.

In conclusion I will NOT be changing my views on the press and I doubt you will either therefore continued exchanges on this subject are largely futile except of course in the scope of the SN NSR points scoring system of cyber oneupmanship that pervades this forum more than most!

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Maybe you just need to try a little harder to understand eh?

PS when people state 'I hate to....' they actually mean the opposite. It's one of the most pathetic spineless figures of speech people use to try and pretend to soften a verbal blow. Man up and just say you agree with him and think I'm a ****! I couldn't care less!

jonc

I think you've missed my point again. My point isn't about Hacked Off, and more to do with the dichotomous personality of your SNet persona.....never mind...

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

No I have missed nothing. I get your point, it's just not the one being discussed. You seem to think because I don't like a lot about many of the British people I can't have an argument with the way the press treat them which is clearly nonsense and somewhat illogical.

Carnut

I certainly don't think that your a **** and would rather you wouldn't put such words as it were in my mouth. To be honest for alot of the time I respect what you have to say and try to take on board what you say. I think both you and jonc have been putting across a good argument and in some way I am in the middle. But either way I think your morel compass if you like is pointing in the right direction.

But if you could be so kind as to read my post one more time you will see that I did say I DO AGREE WITH JONC. When I said that "I hate to" I was referring to the fact that I was jumping on jonc's wagon, or in other words, using his words for my argument, hence being a bit lazy perhaps.

Now maybe you could "man up" and apologise.

Martin2005

It's encouraging that you've suddenly developed a liking for government enquiries

I agree with much of Leverson and what you say on this subject, the difficulty I have though is that we already have law that supposed to deal with much of the misbehaviour that Hacked Off rightly complain about. What we really need is those laws enforced, not press controlled by government.

neil-h

There are plenty of direct action groups out there that you could go an get involved in, then try and extol their virtues to others so as to encourage more to join in. Mass concensus is a powerful thing.

See that wasn't so difficult was it. Then again internet whinging is easier so it might be worth sticking with it.

jonc

To me it is illogical that your altruism for the British people and the way they are portrayed by redtop tabliod papers goes against how you frequently negatively portray and crticise the British people at any given opportunity, and on most occaisions quite harshly, on this forum using the same redtop tabloid tactics with unfair sweeping generalisations and condemnation, simplistic arguements and distorted facts all of which, you as a fully paid up member of Hacked Off claims to campaign against. As a British person, this is my bone of contention.

On the topic of Hacked Off, compared to the the freedom of expression that you so clearly enjoy on this forum, the press both nationally and internationally and quite possibly social media networks such as Twitter and Facebook and also bloggers like Guido Fawkes could mean punitive punishment and pentalties for articles, news, comment and gossip they publish aimed primarily at the UK audience if they have not signed up to the new regulator pushed by a bunch of elite celebtity lobbyists. I agree with you that the press should be independently regulated but not as a result of a state sponsored charter stitched up by a handful of politicians and lobbyists from Hacked Off, I just think there is more to Hacked Off's agenda than just curtailing the reporting and victomising of individuals in the press.

Carnut

I wouldn't bother anymore, its not going the way he would like it to have gone so has stated to insult people then crawed back under his rock, at least hes not asked for the thread to be taken down.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

While I may criticise many of the UK population I don't publish deliberate lies about people in order to make money and I don't invade people's private lives to my own end. Thus far I have not driven anyone to suicide in order to sell a few papers and I have not hacked the phone of a dead girl. Your comparing me to the press is a very very cheap shot and is not very pleasant frankly.

So what is Hacked Off's agenda then. You can't say something like that without having some evidence so let's have it. By the way I think the press have done just a little bit more than victimise a few individuals

Oh and the only reason the press may end up regulated by a state sponsored charter is because your favourite PM backed out of his promise. You keep blaming hacked Off for something Cameron has done, but then you won't hear a bad word said against him so no surprise there.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Sorry, but you are like that fat kid that hangs around with the school bully ... always harping and cajoling from the sidelines rather than actually doing anything yourself.

I am debating with jonc, if you have something worthwhile to add (as in over and above metaphorically patting your new bestest chum on the back) go for it. if not then why bother posting?

Carnut

You keep selectively reading my posts, I have made my own points and have mentioned that I respect both you and jonc. I can only come to the conclusion that this is a division tactic so you don't need to apologise for your huge insults that were incorrect.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Apologise for what huge insults?

Carnut

Is I've said before, whats the point?

I agree that the press are ruining lives and that they lie through their teeth but what can you do?

Giving them a few rules to follow will only make them get more creative.

Carnut

Insinuating that I am spineless and pathetic and should man up, not to mention putting words such a **** in my mouth.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

In that post I think you were being pathetic. Think you need to be a bit more thick skinned frankly! If you are still unhappy hit the RTM button and tell the mods

Carnut

You said that I was pathetic because I wouldn't just say that I "did agree" which I did,
and was hiding behind me saying "I hate to" but you read my post wrong.

But what the hell is up with you. I am fair and pay you respect, I make my own opinions and points.

You talk about a better class of person and government and speak of the press treating people better but your no better than them. You are a foul man that deserves no respect and would rather push your own agenda instead of trying to have a balanced open minded discussion.

P.s not relevant in this case but where is the RTM button?

JTaylor

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Aye, exactly

Carnut

Maybe the people that are affected by the press should be a bit more THICK SKINNED as you put it.

Carnut

Well come on then you are the one that started the name calling and insults. If you want it to stay on topic and not get boring then engage.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Oh dear, I think you are having a little bit of a hissy fit

There's a slight difference to having your life destroyed and getting upset by ... well frankly not a lot.... on a car forum! I think you need to get some perspective here

As for your "I agree that the press are ruining lives and that they lie through their teeth but what can you do?" comment I think you'll find that is just abut the attitude to everything in the UK which is why we are where we are frankly! What we could have done is implement Leveson's recommendations, but that was a bit too hard for the politicians of course!

jonc

Based on many of your past postings, I would have thought cheap shots and unpleasentries was your thing!

Here's a couple of articals published by those who have a similar political stand point as yourself.
What’s left of press freedom?
That’s enough on Hacked Off, Eds

Also judging by your comments above and others previously, your whole argument for regulation of the press points to just that as you only ever seem to hightlight the victimisation of individuals in the press to support your argument.

I can quite categorically state that I have no favourites when it comes to politicians, they're all a loathsome bunch, just that some are more loathsome than others. In the same vain, why don't you read what your "favourite" political figure head, Nigel Farage who incidentally has also been subject to phone hacking, has to say about the the Royal Charter.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Yes articles by the press denouncing Hacked Off ... who'd have thought it eh?

I really can't believe people are so easily sucked in. Hacked Off are evil, it must be true because I read it in the papers

At the end of the day whether they have an agenda or not if it gets the press brought under control it's fine by me. The press bang on about the so called freedom of the press, well with freedom comes responsibility and they blew it over and over so now they need to be dealt with!

Devildog

I think you're a **** Chris but I agree with you on this one, the press all being w4nkers, football fans and the greater public at large

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Carnut

f1_fan you agree with devil