bls1

Hi all, 2004 blob-eye STi with standard suspension except for rear camber bolts fitted. I took the car in for 4-wheel alignment on a decent Hunter machine and had some issues.

1. The guy reckoned the rear toe eccentric bolts were seized so couldn't adjust toe, but set the camber (using new eccentric bolts that I fitted) to negative 1 degree 25 minutes and left the toe at 1.1mm toe OUT (negative toe) one side and 1.6mm toe OUT the other. I loosened the camber bolts at home but they already seem to be maximum negative toe in, I can't get past about 1mm toe out either side, when what I want is a bit of toe in. I can't rule out that the suspension is bent from damage from previous owner, but seems odd its identical both sides. So, question is, does my camber adjustment affect the toe ? Do I need to find some compromise e.g. going to zero camber could get me a touch of negative toe ? Or am I an idiot and there is more to adjusting toe than just rotating those inboard eccentric bolts on rear lateral arm ? I can get even more toe OUT no problem, so its not a problem of seized toe bolts. Rear toe-out just sounds like a recipe for 'interesting' on-limit handling.

2. The guy reckoned the front strut bolts were seized so couldn't adjust front camber. He set the front toe-in at 0.8mm each side, with camber unchanged about zero each side. I was then able to adjust the camber at home (the bolts were just tight), and set it to max negative camber which I should think is approx 1 degree 15 minutes or so based on what others say. However, approximately measuring the front toe-in it seems I now have toe-out. Does that sound sensible ? My approx measurement is tape measure under the car, measuring distance between tyre treads on left & right wheel tyres, ahead of and behind the hub ; I know, a bit crappy. I wasn't expecting the camber adjustment to affect toe too much. If you guys confirm that increased negative camber WILL give toe out, I will get toe properly adjusted again.

Thanks a lot in advance

172sport

iTrader: (6)

Sounds like he couldnt be bothered, take it elsewhere.

bls1

You are definately right , however I don't want to get it there to be told they can't get enough rear toe-in, without knowing first whether it could be necessary to back off the camber a bit.

In fact its not even like the camber is crazy, I think its just around e.g. Prodrive settings. So I'm really asking has anyone else had the same problems not being able to get rear toe in after adjusting the camber ? Does the rear camber even affect the toe , or are they more-or-less independent ?

I know if I took it to a dedicated Subaru specialist with plenty of alignment experience, they would have the answer but I don't think I have one close enough to me to warrant the journey just yet.

Thanks

172sport

iTrader: (6)

They are indepedently adjustable so no worries there.

If it where mine I would be making sure everything is free and copper slipped beforehand though.

Good luck

Fuzz

If the rear camber is 1 degree 25 mins this approximately standard so if you cannot get the toe within spec with these measurements, something is bent, or you have fitted some crap suspension.

stockcar

you should always adjust the height (if adjustable) & camber first and then adjust the toe to suit as it can effect the final settings............

ideally you want around 1.3deg rear camber and probs 0.75-1.0deg front and should be easily achieved normally

alyn

p.s. no offence but with a simple tape measure there is no way you can accuratley set it, without also using a "string computer" , etc.......

bls1

Just to close this down, I did the job properly and replaced rear toe eccentric bolt & nut on one side, and went to (a different) place for re-checking 4 wheel alignment.
Now, I can't tell if there was some inaccuracy in 1 or other of the places that may impact before & after results but ....

The rear toe-in was remedied by angle-grinding the old one off and fitting a new eccentric nut & bolt. It was possible to turn the nut & bolt together, a bit, but not loosen the nut on the bolt. It looked like it was set for max toe-in but still giving toe-out, so was obviously not doing its job somehow.

The front tracking (toe) did seem a little bit impacted by adjusting the front camber.

So thanks for your advice and this is what I've learnt :
- don't muck about with trying to turn seized nut/bolt assemblies on rear toe - just get it out and get a nice new one in.
- front camber adjustment does change the front toe/tracking
- just setting front camber to max negative, makes it about 1.25 degrees , which seems pretty much in line with what's recommended
- bear in mind alignment machines talk in degrees and minutes , 60 minutes in an hour! So 0.06 degrees can actually mean one tenth of a degree, and 1.45 degrees can mean one & three quarters.

Now its time to get out there and enjoy all wheels facing the right way!