Steve Whitehorn

iTrader: (13)

Hello all
To date I have always owned 4door Scoobs.
Now wagons inherinetly arnīt quite as tight as a standard 4 door and tend to not handle quite as well as the 4 door in the stock form.

Seeing as kids will be along at somepoint - my next scoob will probably be a wagon.

So what kind of mods has anyone done to improve the handling of a classic wagon? If you fit ARB etc will this make it as good to drive as a 4 door?

Just wanted to hear a few thoughts from peeps that might have owned both or spent some money on improving their wagons to get them feeling tighter and more drivable.

Thanks
Steve

Mother Theresa

I don't have a classic wagon but on the newage the suspension is identical. Anything you can do to one you can do to the other; the only downside is that a rear strut-brace will interfere with the luggage but I just tape a spanner to mine to undo the bar when it needs to come out. The ride improves with modifications just like the 4 door so drop-links, ARB, springs and shocks all help. There is not that extra bulkhead so it is inherently slightly less stiff so a strut-brace may be more beneficial than in a 4 door but I think you would need to be a professional driver to tell the difference.

WHEELSHOP0_0

I used to have a classic wagon and it had coilovers on which I changed to prodrive springs and shocks as they were too hard(and one leaked). It also had strut braces front (upper and lower) rear upper only,Whiteline arb's and droplinks with 18" prodrive alloys and geometery set by TSL it comfortably outhandled my STi type "R" well with me driving anyway.
Progressive and predictable is better than ulimate handling and then uncatchable in my opinion anyway.
Fast wagons are the way to go.

Steve Whitehorn

iTrader: (13)

Thanks for the replies.


[QUOTE=WHEELSHOP0_0]
Progressive and predictable is better than ulimate handling and then uncatchable in my opinion anyway.
QUOTE]

Agree completely.

Thanks for that its given me an idea of what need to be done. And also good to hear it from the īthe horses mouthī as it were - from some one who has actually done the mods and compared it to a non wagon.

Steve

911

Can't see why the Wagon cannot be every bit as good as the Saloon!
Graham

hmhaga

Sure you can! Google Video

Mocom Racing

iTrader: (2)

Might be worth searching on DocJock, Mo or PTMW - they always managed to surprise a saloon or two at the odd trackday with their lowly powered wagons

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

Here's my rear strut brace with some quick release bolts, self acquired. Certainly helps with the handling. I have also fitted STi Shocks and Eibach springs, drop's it about 35mm. The track of a newage wagon is different to the saloon so the STi ARB's I had did not fit properly!!!



Much more "purposeful stance".

Butty

iTrader: (2)

BD,
The STi rear ARB will fit a newage wagon if combined with the cheaper whiteline links.




Its a very cost effective mod and will finish your suspension changes off perfectly.

Nick

Fizz

iTrader: (1)

that bar does not look centrel to me... the one is on the inside and the other on the outside at a very dubios angle.. don't be surprised if you have to change the bushes regular!!!

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

Ditto above. I would be a bit concerned to bodge it up like that. Kids and dog etc. Wouldn't want one of those to give way.

Tracking must be pants!!!

Butty

iTrader: (2)

That's the whole point in using the thin wire link bars to get the STi ARB to work - bushes are fine after 25k miles.
If you're concenred about leaning link bars & bushes then have a look at the plastic ones on your newage wagon - you'll see them both leaning in as the bar isn't wide enough.
As for tracking, the ARB setting has no impact on tracking settings.

Nick

Ricky

Oh you certainly can my friend !

Just fit Powerstation's stage 3 T25 spec suspension and I think you will be amazed with the results. I was.

A very happy wagon owner !!!!

Ricky !

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

Forgive my ignorance but if there is more strain/angle on one track rod then that side will not be aligned properly?

As you said the cheaper ones fit!!!

But, if you want to put up with incorrect fitting then it's you choice, especially if the strain causes an accident/broken components then who am I to judge.

Mother Theresa

I'm a bit surprised looking at that ARB / drop-link combo. My white line 22mm just slotted straight in.

911

Me too!
Not sure that bar is the right one?
On the point of alignment though:

My correct Sti v3 bars will find a position that suits the geometry, and the bar will 'float' to a comfortable position and this is NOT symetrical in the chassis. I now fit a short length of hose and clamp around the bar next to both pivot bushes on the chassis to keep the bar symetrical to the chassis.
I doubt that the apparent mis-alignment really makes much difference, but the engineer in me saya all should be equal to the centre line.

Mind you, 25k miles can't be wrong!
Graham

silent running

Stick a rear strut brace on the wagon and you're pretty much there. The rest is the same as the saloon.

I just fitted a rear strut brace on mine, and I must say I noticed a difference straight away - the rattles and creaks from the rear have totally gone!

Big Sky WRX

Well there are a few differences wagon to sedan w/ the new age. The biggest difference is track- the sedan enjoys ~ a 20mm wider track than the wagon (the wagon shares the same track as the classic). This is accomplished w/ longer front control arms and longer lateral links in the rear. The biggest advantage w/ this wider track is the ability to fit wider tires/wheels.

The sedan also receives spherical sway links up front, the wagon the standard plastic/rubber dog bones.

The sedan gets aluminum front control arms, the wagon stamped steel.

Sedan is much more reinforced between the rear strut towers than the wagon.

The sedan (depending on the market) gets a 20mm rear sway bar, the wagon 17mm.

The sedan (depending on market) is ~ 80 lbs lighter. The wagon does enjoy a slighter better weight ratio

Having said that- with the right tweaking a wagon can run w/ sedan all day long.

Tweaking a wagon is no different than tweaking a sedan (except that sedans enjoy a better aftermarket selection than the wagon)- upgrade rubber, upgrade springs/dampers, upgrade sway bars, upgrade bushings, optimize alignment.

A few things that might prove helpful for wagon owners:
-while sedan struts "fit" on the wagon you'll lose ~ .7 degrees of neg camber- that's a pretty significant hit.
-sedan springs will lower the wagon ~ 8mm more in the rear than on the sedan- this can give rise to a "saggy" look in the rear- especially on springs that lower equally front/rear
-front sway bars are different- sedan bar is ~ 20mm longer- many companies don't make a wagon specific front sway bar (Whiteline does) and you end up w/ sway links that look this \ / instead of this | |
-many classic parts fit the new age wagon- namely front control arms which are available in aluminum from the classic STi's-the front bushing is slightly narrowier, but two hardened washers fix that ; lateral links are also the same length so an uprated lateral link that fits the classic will fit the new age wagon ie STi's aftermarket spherical set
-rolling the rear fender lips of the wagon will allow fitment of some pretty decent width tires
-as someone pointed out a rear strut brace DOES make a difference w/ a wagon

Steve Whitehorn

iTrader: (13)

Thanks guys
Interesting Reading
Steve

silent running

So in other words, if you want a wagon, get a classic, not a newage. Good reading there though. Cheers

Big Sky WRX

If you want a lighter platform- sedan or wagon- get a classic

911

And if you intend to really tune the car buy an Sti RA or more sensibly, a Type R.
God, I wish I had!
Graham

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Tell that to Steven Darley

new boy

PMSL!!!

ads...