LG John

Last night was a great side by side comparision if you are on here mate and I appreciate you taking the time to play with a 406 although I suspect you got a little shock

For anyone that cares, myself and the above wrx driver (he had scoobysport tail but wasn't loud so guess just the bb) got the fortunate use of both lanes coming off a roundabout last night. I pulled into the left lane at 45mph with the foot to the boards and he was right up behind me. He crawled past by the top end of 3rd and for a little bit of 4th gear his momentum carried him through to 1-2 car lengths in front. After that I held the distance until we lifted (4wd drag was showing!).

He had the grunt to pass but nevertheless the pug did bloody well IMHO to keep a classic wrx at bay! Were the p-reg rexys the ones with 240bhp?? (or is it 260?)

MODS: Fine, its not 'regional meets' but I'm hardly cluttering the forum

RS Grant

What mods is your Pug running mate??

IIRC P-Reg WRX's run 256bhp as standard.

Cheers,
Grant

LG John

cat-back exhaust and thats it. 194bhp standard so with the zorst maybe 200bhp

RS Grant

How do you know the Scoob driver was really trying??
Maybe he had been sitting in traffic and was suffering from severe heatsoak??
Obviously you didnt go near any twisties in your little burn up....

You've got to consider these things before you post something like this on Scoobynet mate...... haha

What 1/4 mile does your Pug run??

Cheers,
Grant

LG John

Oh he was trying, it was flat out no questions. You must remember I had a classic scooby that ran 230bhp, then 275bhp and then 215bhp (give or take) so I know my scoobys. I've played with two other classics from 60+ in the pug (both with peeshooters) and there was NOTHING in it! People also tend not to acknowledge an event with a friendly flash if they weren't trying

Lol at 1/4m. Er, as it happens I have 1/4m'd my old v6 and it did a 15.1 on its first run. There was a bit too much wheelspin coming of the line (I could have improved on that throughout the day) and for the last 20m prior to crossing the line there was heavy engine braking as the engine...........well..........it blew up I expect with a better start and an engine that is willing to complete the bloody 1/4m it would get into the 14s. Just. Considering its not easy to get a 1450kg fwd v6 of the line you'll appreciate the grunt is mid-range and up

No traffic it was night, 5 degrees and we got stopped at the lights for all of 10s. Prior to that we'd been crusing at 70 for miles. I don't do twisties anymore, its just not fun!

ozzy

oh gawd, not another 1/4 miler

What is the world coming too [/walks off shaking his head]

Stefan

LG John

Not a fan of 1/4m racing ozzy? Its great fun and you don't have to worry about being pulled over

STI-R/A

Where In Scotland are you bud?

LG John

Edinburgh

STI-R/A

What 406 have you got? - Is it an Sri - 2.0 8v turbo? If its the v6 - How much power do they have?
A mate has a uk impreza with a panel filter + exhaust - runs high 14's all day...

Cheers.

LG John

406 V6 4-door saloon in a manual. Its the pre-2000 model with the 194bhp engine but may be around 200bhp with the cat-back.

If that is a classic scooby with an exhaust he really needs to try harder as classics should be mid-low 14s with a good launch. My scooby when modded was hitting 13.4 dead. The 406 is 6.9s to 60 by the book but its not easy to achieve that as the slightest hint of wheelspin and you've fooked it! 50+ is where she gets going Sure if I lobbed all the leather and electronic **** out she'd be quicker still but I like that stuff

STI-R/A

Cool!! I love street sleepers, theres a lad up here with a white 406 turbo and he's modded it like the one in the film TAXI - looks f**kin cool and surprises alot of folks!

It was the boys first time on the strip so im sure he could improve with some practice : )

Get some pics of your motor up mate : )

Cheers

ozzy

No, sorry not a fan. Can't see the point in it to be honest. Driving in a straightline just doesn't appeal to me and SN's getting obsessed with 1/4 mile times and BHP figures these days.

And before you ask, Pete Lewis hasn't been giving me tution on being grumpy Just a shame when someone else has been taken by the darkside

LG John

It really isn't much to look at. My old green v6 was in far nicer condition and had a classy subtle styling pack that lifted its looks above normal 406s. This one sadly isn't in as good condition but seems to drive well and be mechanically sound (touches wood). I will in due course post pictures of what is left of the engine of the old one as they would be interesting

Each to their own ozzy I find 1/4m appealing because it's thrilling but without the risk. You have to try extra special hard to crash whereas even on a track day you could get carried away and bang up your pride and joy. Also I like experiencing the respective differences between various cars/machines. Its good to see just how much a VTS humps a VTR and a Scooby a VTS and an 911 a scooby and so on.

The 15.1 wasn't my first time on the strip just the first (and only) run that day and the first time in the 406. Considering the start and more cruicially the end of that run 15.1 amazed me! I'd set the 14s as my target for the day and I really believe I could have done it if the car hadn't died. Don't have the guts or wallet to take my current pug up though!!

The real missed chance was that on the 1/4m day I planned a few 1 gear only runs! There were a few pants cars that day that were running in the 17-19s band and I really believe the 406 could beat those in 3rd gear only! She can pull off with just 2k rpm smoothly in 3rd from a standing start and within 2 seconds starts to make meaningful progress. Would have been funny

pugoetru

I had a v6 505 and it was quick with 170 hp a406 v6 should be fun with 194 std

505 was rear wheel drive no good on the twisties

LG John

Neither is the 406 any good in the twisties but with RWD I'd imagine the 505 would have been fun

kevinperth

you having a laugh here or what ,where is there any comparison between a 406 and a scoobie . tell you what , why dont you bring it down to knockhill for a track day . anybody can point there car in a straight line and even then a decently set up scooby would **** any 406 on the planet. just dont see what your trying to prove here.
is it that the scoob was pish ? or are you trying to say we should all trade them in and buy 406's

take it you had stripped out the meter,were carrying no passengers and taken off the roofsign when this jaunt had taken place

LG John

13.401 @ 104mph non-stripped, hot day - no my scooby was not 'pish'!

I'm a considered and reasonable person but tonight I'm in a bad mood so my response is simple. I'll bet anyone with a standard classic turbo 2000 £500 that from 60-130mph they cannot pull more than 10m (I would say 3m but I have to be sure as I'm laying 500 here!) on the pug. Money where your mouth is time!!! I'm in edinburgh and available at nights and weekends. I will of course check over you engine for mods and don't want any smart asses with a tek3 remap taking the ****!

I have no point, just talking about an enjoyable experience. There is no motive other than that and things were fine in this thread until you got arsey

RS Grant

Did you forget to add that your reason for editing was that you came to the conclusion that a 2k wager was too outrageous??

Are you pi$$ed tonight mate!?

Cheers,
Grant (Willing Spectator if this goes ahead.... lol )

LG John

No just in a REALLY bad mood!!!!!! I've had a standard classic and a modified one, I know what they can and can't do. I've played with several now in the pug and I know they go nowhere from 3rd gear onwards. Its just a fact, one that I never expected to debate but tonight I'm just not in the mood so I'm putting my money firmly where my mouth is.

RS Grant

No problem.. Well hope you find your challenge!! I'm glad I have neither a Scoob nor a spare 500sheets cause I would be tempted to do this purely for "the banter"

Cheers,
Grant

LG John

Got to love the banter That's half the reason I like cars, the banter So f£ck if I race a 911 Turbo in a VTS and get spanked senseless, its fun

Too many people take the humpf far too easily when they play with other cars on the road/track.

LG John

Bollocks to it, why not enter into the spirit of thanking a little more:

Thanks to the 360 Modena that spanked my impreza
Thanks to the M3 that destroyed my VTS
Thanks to the GT4s that took a raping from my scooby
Thanks to the 325 that I lashed in the 406
Thanks to the Leon that tried to keep up the other day.....

You guys all make it worthwhile

kevinperth

so what are you going to check the engine for? what do you expect to find there?
i would suspect that most folk on here wouldnt waste there time getting involved in street racing, let alone with a pug 406.
on a private road id gladly take up your offer just to see the look on your face but lets face it in the real world it aint going to happen .
Plus sinse you seem to be a subaru expert by knowing if the car is modified by lifting the bonnet that would exclude my car i would have thought (looks standard to me though) but hey , im no expert

what i would suggest is with the £500 you are betting that you use that to buy another saxo or maybe upgarde to a corsa,and if you have any change try buying your first razor blade. the reason i come to this conclusion is because this is a very childish thread.

is this what this place has come to these days?

is there not a website called edinburghtaxis.co.uk that would be interested in your car ?

ps. rs grant ,i heard your subaru went bang. you still got it? or what you driving now. ive bought myself another subaru (cossiekevperth), sold the cossie for a tidy profit. what has happened to this site these days

LG John

Kevin! Go away and return to the forum when you have something meaningful and constructive to say. Yes I could tell if an Impreza had been modified by looking under the hood and I'd have a good idea if the ECU had been reflashed if I was taken for a ride in it. As usual idiots like yourself jump on you high horse assuming that the lesser car (being the 406) is attacking the stature of your mighty Impreza. Grow up, that is the 'childish' thing in this thread. You don't often see a 911 driver spitting the dummy because an Impreza kept up.

Just to be 100% sure you heard it: I Saxo Boy, have owned and covered 30,000 miles in my own MY99 of which 20,000 of those were with a full scoobysport decat, a tek2.5 (JB) remap, and STI-V intercooler and a dawes for boost control (275bhp at 1.25 bar) and the remaining 10,000 miles were at the standard 215bhp. I Saxo Boy bought JB's old 406 v6 and following an unfortunate engine incident bought another 406

Maybe, and hey this really is a guess!! But JUST maybe I'm qualified to talk about the relative straight line difference between a classic scooby and a 406 giving I've done 60k miles between the two types of cars. Or am I wrong? I suppose you must know because well one is 'just' a 406 so can't be fast

LG John

The first thing I'd check for is the TD05 you were mentioning recently, then I might look for a boost control and I expect a larger intercooler might be easy to spot!!

kevinperth

haha. oh dear you take the bait easy .

bit disappointed that your car was only producing 275bhp. the one i had previous (my99) rollered 282bhp with a tec 2.5 and a magnex decat by john banks on a scoobynet rolling road day at star. but hey , as i said im no expert and you are , but the rollers never lie.id be asking for a refund mate ,you were done haha

anyway i feel no way threatened by your 406 in any way shape or form,why should i ? if you tried to race me id just let you go by and laugh at you !!!
i know the limits of my car and what it can and cant do ,and if i want to go any faster ill open the garage door and take the bike out.

just find it strange to be talking about 406's on a subaru website
i also find it strange that theres a very boy racer culture on here now with big talk of bhp's and 1/4 mile times,this was all great when crail first started and we all went down ,not now.people have twigged on that it isnt all about straight line . when i had my previous scooby ( you know the one with the same setup as your but with more bhp ) there was a subaru day at knockhill where all the cars with so called big bhp's were getting whipped by properly set up cars with realistic bhp's, proper suspension setups and more importantly the proper driver behind the wheel

and just one other thing to keep you going, since your able to tell the difference just looking at a turbo thats on the car,( i dont have a larger intercooler and just another point i dont have the td05 on or any other type of modified turbo (yet)), but if i did why would i need a boost controller if you get a proper remap done , i would have though ( and as i say im no expert) that the boost level settings on the remap would do the same job

so bearing all this in mind can you possibly tell me how you can tell the car is modified if the intercoller is the same , the turbos the same and it has no air filter on it just by popping the bonnet as you said you could do just a few posts ago.

LG John

282bhp + Star = Uh-huh, I might be wrong but isn't Star the one thats 'pub talk friendly?'

The 275bhp is an estimate based on what an MY99 with those mods usually produced. I didn't RR it as I didn't see the point given that you can get 260bhp one day and 290 the next at these places

Perhaps because I'm a long established member that has many friends here? Strange as it is I'm not the only one that's changed cars and hung around afterwards. You are just looking down your nose because I went backwards in the car chain for a while as opposed to forwards. I bet your tone would be VERY different if I'd got a skyline and was talking about a friendly run with a scooby.

Lets assume I check out the rear back-box and its the standard one, I look under the car and can see the centre cat, then I pop the bonnet: TDO4, check, standard intercooler, check, no form of mechanical boost control, check, big downpipe cat in place, check, standard filter box, check. With the exception of a remap there are no other mods that I can think of that would make the blindest bit of difference to the cars performance

Perhaps if you'd spent more time paying attention to scoobynet rather than picking fights you'd realise that there is a considerable following of members that agree that the dawes device holds boost better than the ECU. I would certainly agree with that: with the dawes it would get closer to target boost in the lower gears than with the ECU running the show (MUCH closer btw) and would vairy less with hot/cold. The car was probably a little smoother on ECU but the dawes gave a nice kick and the boost behaved itself. That is why you'd use a mechanical boost controller instead of using the ecu/2-port despite having a remap.

You'll also find many many many knowledgeable, well-brought up, (dare I say it) well off, and mature people that love 1/4m racing so its unfair to lable it a 'boy racer' activity. Besides it seperates the real bhp from the pub bhp! My lowly little 275bhp MY99 was matching an MY98 that was running over 300bhp simple because of the lag from his front mount/big turbo. Of course, he whapped the boost up another 0.4bar a few runs later but that is beside the point. My point is a print out from an inaccurate rolling road (that is at the end of the stationary in a building!) is no measure of a car!

PG

all very sad indeed

john banks

Since getting the Scooby, we've had a Peugeot, a Ford and most recently a Skoda has been ordered I used to have fun in the Peugeot with Scoobies (yes really, especially standard bugeyes), I'm sure the Skoda will be too. Just like an old Legacy Turbo is fun jousting with BMWs and hot hatches But it has to stay sensible, safe and respectful. I find a bit of inter-marque rivalry quite interesting.

I'm sure Kenny could pedal the 406 quite satisfactorily against many a Scooby from what I've seen of his driving He obviously pedalled the one I sold him hard enough to blow it up in short order <blush> but I think that happens with French cars when you drive them hard.

Kevin, the 406 didn't corner or stop at all well. It rode nicely to work, V6 sounded nice, and it had a surprising turn of speed. I first got it when the Scooby was standard, and I don't think it was any slower at high speed in a straight line.

I've been to Crail for one session, and did one quarter at TOTB II. Not really my scene either, but nice to try it once, although only the R1 guy with the helmet with the mohican stuff (I thought it was cool anyway ) would take me on