Anyone with experience of Road Traffic law please help.
27 May 2002, 03:51 PM
#1
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Moderators - Posted in general to get best response quickly. Appreciate it if you would leave it here for a little while.
Mate of mine was stopped on the new Northern link road in Swindon. the limit for the road is 40 mph, but the road is all dual carriageway. He has been reported for doing 70mph
The summons has come through, in three parts.
1. Titled Wiltshire Magistrates court - Summons
Summoned to appear bla bla bla to answer the charge - did drive a vehicle at a speed eceeding 70mph in regulation 3 of the motorways traffic speed limit regulation 1974. Contrary sect 17 of the RT Regulation act 1984.
2. Statement of Facts - Please of guilty in absence.
Speeding - Exceed 70 miles per hour - m\way
3.Statement of witness (completed by PC)
......Speed in excess of 40mph speed limit.... checked the speed of vehicle by means of......The speed recorded on the display meter was 70mph.
Now surely the charge is incorrect because he wasn't exceeding 70mph on a motorway, but exceeding 40mph through a 40mph limit as the statement of witness says. Can he get it thrown out of court for technical inaccuracy?
Mate of mine was stopped on the new Northern link road in Swindon. the limit for the road is 40 mph, but the road is all dual carriageway. He has been reported for doing 70mph
The summons has come through, in three parts.
1. Titled Wiltshire Magistrates court - Summons
Summoned to appear bla bla bla to answer the charge - did drive a vehicle at a speed eceeding 70mph in regulation 3 of the motorways traffic speed limit regulation 1974. Contrary sect 17 of the RT Regulation act 1984.
2. Statement of Facts - Please of guilty in absence.
Speeding - Exceed 70 miles per hour - m\way
3.Statement of witness (completed by PC)
......Speed in excess of 40mph speed limit.... checked the speed of vehicle by means of......The speed recorded on the display meter was 70mph.
Now surely the charge is incorrect because he wasn't exceeding 70mph on a motorway, but exceeding 40mph through a 40mph limit as the statement of witness says. Can he get it thrown out of court for technical inaccuracy?
27 May 2002, 04:07 PM
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Sounds incorrect and also it would be worth finding out what the "display meter" was, if it was the standard car speedometer then it sounds like he may be able to get it thrown out on two technicalities.....
Best thing to do is get some legal advice from a solicitor which specialises in Motor offences. There is a guy lots of people on here recommend but I've no idea what his name is.....
Matt
Best thing to do is get some legal advice from a solicitor which specialises in Motor offences. There is a guy lots of people on here recommend but I've no idea what his name is.....
Matt
27 May 2002, 04:49 PM
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MattW,
I would hazard a guess that something was going on in Swindon at the time? Some event? The regulation he's been charged under can re-classify certain roads at certain times. Find out and may be able to enlighten.
I would hazard a guess that something was going on in Swindon at the time? Some event? The regulation he's been charged under can re-classify certain roads at certain times. Find out and may be able to enlighten.
27 May 2002, 04:53 PM
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If everybody got off because there was a small error on the summons I don't think anybody would ever be convicted. I think if you read the small print there is something about you needing to contact them if there are any mistakes otherwise you are basically agreeing to what is written.
On a positive note, if you plead guilty by post which is the cheapest way of dealing with it, then the only information the magistrate will see is what is written on the summons ie >70mph on a motorway which is £60 and three points. If you kick up a fuss about the details you will no doubt be questiond at some point and if it emerges that it was >70 mph in a 40 limit then thats pretty much an instant ban!!!
Oh - looks like I didn't read it properly, the 40mph bit is mentioned on the witness statement.
[Edited by Boost II - 28/05/2002 12:17:05]
On a positive note, if you plead guilty by post which is the cheapest way of dealing with it, then the only information the magistrate will see is what is written on the summons ie >70mph on a motorway which is £60 and three points. If you kick up a fuss about the details you will no doubt be questiond at some point and if it emerges that it was >70 mph in a 40 limit then thats pretty much an instant ban!!!
Oh - looks like I didn't read it properly, the 40mph bit is mentioned on the witness statement.
[Edited by Boost II - 28/05/2002 12:17:05]
27 May 2002, 07:43 PM
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Boost,
If everybody argued the technicallity in court, most would get off and after a while, they would have to start getting better with the admin as they would be loosing too much money. Unfortunately, most people don't bother to fight it so they loose.
LTI 20/20 is a Laser gun - I would recommend a chat with a Motor solicitor....
Matt
[Edited by mutant_matt - 27/05/2002 19:46:09]
If everybody got off because there was a small error on the summons I don't think anybody would ever be convicted
LTI 20/20 is a Laser gun - I would recommend a chat with a Motor solicitor....
Matt
[Edited by mutant_matt - 27/05/2002 19:46:09]
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27 May 2002, 10:14 PM
#8
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The solicitor referred to is:
Mr Andreas Serghis of Andreas Serghis
171 Edward Street,Brighton DX: 94301 Brighton
East Sussex, Telephone: (01273) 626762
Fax: (01273) 676717
Mr Andreas Serghis of Andreas Serghis
171 Edward Street,Brighton DX: 94301 Brighton
East Sussex, Telephone: (01273) 626762
Fax: (01273) 676717
28 May 2002, 12:16 AM
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I once got done for 70 in a 40 
- you can't plead guilty by post and hope it'll go away and accept the fine / points - read the small print on the summons. my case was adjourned as I wasn't there (thought I didn't need to be) and after a lot of toing & froing between police / court, found I had to be there. made case that I needed car for work (80 mile commute) and was given max 6 points & fine rather than ban (might work out better in long run as insurers wouldn't have touched me with a barge pole 
for even having a one day ban
good luck
Apple
- you can't plead guilty by post and hope it'll go away and accept the fine / points - read the small print on the summons. my case was adjourned as I wasn't there (thought I didn't need to be) and after a lot of toing & froing between police / court, found I had to be there. made case that I needed car for work (80 mile commute) and was given max 6 points & fine rather than ban (might work out better in long run as insurers wouldn't have touched me with a barge pole for even having a one day bangood luck
Apple
28 May 2002, 08:58 AM
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Thanks for the replies Guys. Unfortunately taking 6 points will give hime a ban under totting up. As he can walk to work I suspect this is highly likeley.
Spoke to a magistrate colleague, and although he didn't say what the outcome might be, he said a solicitor would be money well spent. Aslo that he viewed the offence as worse than 100 on a motorway. I suspect most of us would agree with that.
Dave T-S - Cheers for those details, I'll pass on to him.
Spoke to a magistrate colleague, and although he didn't say what the outcome might be, he said a solicitor would be money well spent. Aslo that he viewed the offence as worse than 100 on a motorway. I suspect most of us would agree with that.
Dave T-S - Cheers for those details, I'll pass on to him.
28 May 2002, 12:17 PM
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No offence code. just says in words along the lines below.
Summoned to appear bla bla bla to answer the charge - did drive a vehicle at a speed exceeding 70mph in regulation 3 of the motorways traffic speed limit regulation 1974. Contrary sect 17 of the Road Traffic Regulation act 1984
Summoned to appear bla bla bla to answer the charge - did drive a vehicle at a speed exceeding 70mph in regulation 3 of the motorways traffic speed limit regulation 1974. Contrary sect 17 of the Road Traffic Regulation act 1984
28 May 2002, 12:49 PM
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Whereabouts on the road? If he's looking for real technicalities, then it may be worth checking that the section of road he was on has been officially adopted - if not, then IIRC it isn't a highway.
It has to be one of the stupidest speed limits posted yet. 3 lane dual carriageway @ 40mph with no real pedestrian access. Must admit I've been waiting for the cash-generation-camera to appear on it as almost no-one sticks to the limit......
It has to be one of the stupidest speed limits posted yet. 3 lane dual carriageway @ 40mph with no real pedestrian access. Must admit I've been waiting for the cash-generation-camera to appear on it as almost no-one sticks to the limit......
14 June 2002, 09:38 AM
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For anyone that's interested. here's the result.
Appparantly the CPS have 6 months from the date of offence 'to get it right'. Therefore if the court date was over 6 months from the date of offence he could have pleaded not guilty and the case thrown out.
Anyway....he got credit for pointing out their mistake and for pleading guilty, got a £315 fine, 6 points and a 6 month ban under totting up.
Appparantly the CPS have 6 months from the date of offence 'to get it right'. Therefore if the court date was over 6 months from the date of offence he could have pleaded not guilty and the case thrown out.
Anyway....he got credit for pointing out their mistake and for pleading guilty, got a £315 fine, 6 points and a 6 month ban under totting up.
14 June 2002, 12:07 PM
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Make sure the radar gun had been checked by the police the morning of operation - to make sure it was functioning properly. They have to record this in a log, if this wasn't done, then your mate could get off
14 June 2002, 11:01 PM
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Scarey though!
Makes you think next time you are driving along a motorway at 85mph under a bridge that has a "safety van" on it
Four of them means walking for half a year!!!
mb
Makes you think next time you are driving along a motorway at 85mph under a bridge that has a "safety van" on it
Four of them means walking for half a year!!!
mb
14 June 2002, 11:19 PM
#21
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Maybe now he will stop speeding???
Anyone who gets banned under the totting up scheme deserves it, for gods sake you should be a good little boy until the risk has passed!!
I witnessed an accident the other day, young lad-fast car-speeding, slammed straight into the back of slow moving traffic .... I gave him a piece of my mind - someones child could have been walking along the path upon which he ended up. That child would have been DEAD!!!
I am not being a killjoy, I love my Impreza ands its fast - but come on, grow up - take the points as a warning (I have when I have got them for speeding) and slow down or face a ban!!
Simple really!!
Pete
[Edited by pslewis - 6/14/2002 11:19:47 PM]
Anyone who gets banned under the totting up scheme deserves it, for gods sake you should be a good little boy until the risk has passed!!
I witnessed an accident the other day, young lad-fast car-speeding, slammed straight into the back of slow moving traffic .... I gave him a piece of my mind - someones child could have been walking along the path upon which he ended up. That child would have been DEAD!!!
I am not being a killjoy, I love my Impreza ands its fast - but come on, grow up - take the points as a warning (I have when I have got them for speeding) and slow down or face a ban!!
Simple really!!
Pete
[Edited by pslewis - 6/14/2002 11:19:47 PM]
14 June 2002, 11:48 PM
#23
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So?? the motorist who continues speeding despite warnings and fines and points, then due to that speed, kills a child - they should be let-off while we catch the shoplifter who has knicked an easter egg from woolies????????????????????
Do me a bl00dy favour!!
To continue speeding when you have been caught is probably the most stupidest crime available - I cant believe that its so simple and people just dont seem to get it?????????????
Pete
Do me a bl00dy favour!!
To continue speeding when you have been caught is probably the most stupidest crime available - I cant believe that its so simple and people just dont seem to get it?????????????
Pete
15 June 2002, 12:13 AM
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agree with you Pete. I 've been there, bought the T-shirt. When I think back I realise what a T!T I've been. I need my license day to day, my company and more importantly my family relies on me being able to drive for my job. No license - no income.
I used to speed (outragiously) and still do on occasions ,85 m'way but never more.
No lectures on speed kills, coffee pot/black and all that, but, in today's world there is a heavy price to pay for pushing the boundries in this fair and pleasant land.
The UK no longer accepts speeding on the public high way. If you must go f@ckin mental - take it to the track - go to Germany for a holiday or take your chances & pay the price.
I've been banned twice, very nearly three times (not proud), but I've learnt my lesson and think I'm a better driver for the experience (strange but true).
I used to speed (outragiously) and still do on occasions ,85 m'way but never more.
No lectures on speed kills, coffee pot/black and all that, but, in today's world there is a heavy price to pay for pushing the boundries in this fair and pleasant land.
The UK no longer accepts speeding on the public high way. If you must go f@ckin mental - take it to the track - go to Germany for a holiday or take your chances & pay the price.
I've been banned twice, very nearly three times (not proud), but I've learnt my lesson and think I'm a better driver for the experience (strange but true).
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