How do you thrash yours?
12 April 2011, 04:21 PM
#1
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How do you thrash yours?
When i had my skyline i was nearly home from my daily drive before the engine was warm enough to give some stick.
The WRX is sooo diff prob a mile in drive it shows engine warm but im holding back 3 miles+ before even going 3,000rpm
How about you guys how long from cold start untill give it some beans?
The WRX is sooo diff prob a mile in drive it shows engine warm but im holding back 3 miles+ before even going 3,000rpm
How about you guys how long from cold start untill give it some beans?
12 April 2011, 04:27 PM
#3
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and if you dont have an oil temp gauge how does one know .
ive always waited for the temp to be in the middle before i thrape it never actually thought that it wasnt the oil
Whats the general rule then if your cars warm on the meter when does the oil catch up ?
I remember my Honda Type R if u tharped it from start the VTEC mever kicked in Only when the temp had moved to near centre did she come alive ( company car before anyone moans at me thraping
)
ive always waited for the temp to be in the middle before i thrape it never actually thought that it wasnt the oil
Whats the general rule then if your cars warm on the meter when does the oil catch up ?
I remember my Honda Type R if u tharped it from start the VTEC mever kicked in Only when the temp had moved to near centre did she come alive ( company car before anyone moans at me thraping
)
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12 April 2011, 05:50 PM
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I have been pondering this myself, as I don't have any aftermarket gauges telling me when the oil is warm enough either!! however, compared to every other car I have owned, the water temp does shoot up to normal ultra quickly (great on cold mornings with the heater!!).
I guess the only answer is if your not prepared to by an oil temp gauge, you are just going to have to get a feel for it. every car will be different. I have found that if I put my foot down when the oil isn't fully warmed, the car doesn't deliver anywhere near as much pull as when I have been driving for a while (although, I have only put my foot down once or twice (to overtake) when I don't think it was fully warmed). from my experience 5 miles on a warm day for the engine oil to warm through, and about 10 miles on a cold day.
but as I said, this is just my car, and yours might be a bit different.
I guess the only answer is if your not prepared to by an oil temp gauge, you are just going to have to get a feel for it. every car will be different. I have found that if I put my foot down when the oil isn't fully warmed, the car doesn't deliver anywhere near as much pull as when I have been driving for a while (although, I have only put my foot down once or twice (to overtake) when I don't think it was fully warmed). from my experience 5 miles on a warm day for the engine oil to warm through, and about 10 miles on a cold day.
but as I said, this is just my car, and yours might be a bit different.
12 April 2011, 07:07 PM
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Question:
Car is transported to track on a trailor,ready for a good day out
Do you:
A. Turn the engine on and leave it till the oil temp is up, possibly 10 mins
B. Drive it for 5 mins on track at sunday speed
C. Take your slot and go like a bat out of hell for the first few laps
Just wondered with all this talk of warming up...!
Car is transported to track on a trailor,ready for a good day out
Do you:
A. Turn the engine on and leave it till the oil temp is up, possibly 10 mins
B. Drive it for 5 mins on track at sunday speed
C. Take your slot and go like a bat out of hell for the first few laps
Just wondered with all this talk of warming up...!
12 April 2011, 08:06 PM
#14
Question:
Car is transported to track on a trailor,ready for a good day out
Do you:
A. Turn the engine on and leave it till the oil temp is up, possibly 10 mins
B. Drive it for 5 mins on track at sunday speed
C. Take your slot and go like a bat out of hell for the first few laps
Just wondered with all this talk of warming up...!
Car is transported to track on a trailor,ready for a good day out
Do you:
A. Turn the engine on and leave it till the oil temp is up, possibly 10 mins
B. Drive it for 5 mins on track at sunday speed
C. Take your slot and go like a bat out of hell for the first few laps
Just wondered with all this talk of warming up...!
A and then B for a lap or so.
12 April 2011, 08:11 PM
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always c. whats the point in wasting time on track?! i mean, of course, you are gonna have to rebuild your engine fairly regularly (probably costing a couple of grand), but hey, its only money right???
12 April 2011, 08:17 PM
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Why is the water temperature guage referred to as either "sh*tty" or "useless" within this thread?
I've always found mine perfectly acceptable for reading the water temperature. Anyone that thinks that represents the oil temperature is misguided, but that isn't really the fault of the temperature guage surely?
I've always found mine perfectly acceptable for reading the water temperature. Anyone that thinks that represents the oil temperature is misguided, but that isn't really the fault of the temperature guage surely?
12 April 2011, 08:36 PM
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If you use a lighter oil like a 5-40 instead of a 15-50 it should warm up quicker. Scoob engine only holds 4 liters, doesnt take long for a hot running engine like a scoobs to heat up 4 liters. I can heat up 4 liters in the chip pan in a few minuites.
12 April 2011, 08:51 PM
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I wait until my oil temp gauge is around 85-90degs usually takes around 10-15 mins, i never go on coolant temps as the gauge is half way after 1 to 2 miles yet the oil temp gauge has hardly moved.
12 April 2011, 08:51 PM
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I run 5-30 helix oil, and have oil pressure/temp gauges and the oil usually takes 15-20 minutes to get to 80' - water temp can be hit in half that time and I've found I've had to physically drive the car to get the oil temp moving & was initially shocked how much longer it took to warm up over water temp.
Also oil seems to retain its temperature far longer than water as well, obviously noticed this during the past few days with the hotter weather, where water temp was showing cold oil was between 50-60'c at least an hour after car had been run.
Also oil seems to retain its temperature far longer than water as well, obviously noticed this during the past few days with the hotter weather, where water temp was showing cold oil was between 50-60'c at least an hour after car had been run.
12 April 2011, 08:52 PM
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10 miles to warm up? WTF! 
5 to 10 mins driving moderately should be ok by my book. 70 deg water temp should be ok.
Need to drive to warm up box and diffs not just leave it idling.
Oil temp can lag more 'cos of where the after-market sensor is.
No need to over-think it too much.
5 to 10 mins driving moderately should be ok by my book. 70 deg water temp should be ok.
Need to drive to warm up box and diffs not just leave it idling.
Oil temp can lag more 'cos of where the after-market sensor is.
No need to over-think it too much.
12 April 2011, 08:59 PM
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Your not going to like this guys, but i never let mine warm up i just get in it give it 2mins for the oil to circulate from cold and let the piston crowns start to expand then i just drive away, but i do however allow it to cool before switching it off.
12 April 2011, 09:06 PM
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10 miles to warm up? WTF!
5 to 10 mins driving moderately should be ok by my book. 70 deg water temp should be ok.
Need to drive to warm up box and diffs not just leave it idling.
Oil temp can lag more 'cos of where the after-market sensor is.
No need to over-think it too much.
5 to 10 mins driving moderately should be ok by my book. 70 deg water temp should be ok.
Need to drive to warm up box and diffs not just leave it idling.
Oil temp can lag more 'cos of where the after-market sensor is.
No need to over-think it too much.
Yeah it's not just the engine that needs warming up, but you can see why so many engines/boxes get slaughtered by only going by water temp that everything is up to temperature.
Also at track days, 5 hard laps then say 15 minute break then out again, oil will probably have broken down by the end of the day - how many owners then oil change when they get home?
12 April 2011, 09:15 PM
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I think this is why mines still in good health, i change oils and filters once every two months regardless and if i do a track day i change the oils before racing and then change them again afterwards just to be on the safe side.
12 April 2011, 09:32 PM
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But how many owners out there are actually using a high grade true synthetic oil, as i've read many times people will quite happily skimp on oil to save a few pennies.
Heres an exert from some research done by car junky on oil breakdown:
Today's engines are expected to put out more power from a smaller size and with less oil than engines of the past. Therefore, the engines run much hotter than they used to. That puts an increased burden on the oil.
Even the best petroleum oils will have flash points only as high as 390 and 440 degrees F. Some actually have flashpoints as low as 350 degrees. For today's hot running engines, this is not nearly enough protection. Just about any synthetic you come across will have a flashpoint over 440 degrees. Premium synthetics can have flashpoints over 450 degrees with some even reaching as high as 500 degrees. That's a big difference.
As a result, I think that it's quite obvious that these high- tech oils offer a substantial benefit when it comes to potential breakdown due to burn-off. Nevertheless, even though synthetics are MUCH less prone to burn-off than are petroleum oils, there is still some burn-off during extremely high temperature operation.
Thus, it becomes important to discuss the manner in which petroleum and synthetic oils burn off. As a refined product, petroleum oil molecules are of varying sizes. Thus, as a petroleum oil heats up, the smaller, lighter molecules begin to burn off first.
Since the ash content in many petroleum oils is higher than synthetics, deposits and sludge are left behind to coat the inside of your engine. Detergent and dispersant additives are used to keep these deposits to a minimum, but only so much can be done. Unless you're changing a petroleum oil every 2,000 to 3,000 miles some deposits are going to be left behind.
In addition, as smaller particles burn off, the larger, heavier molecules are all that is left to protect the engine. Unfortunately, these larger particles do not flow nearly as well and tend to blanket the components of your engine which only exacerbates the heat problem.
Synthetic oils, on the other hand, because they are not purified, but rather designed within a lab for lubrication purposes, are comprised of molecules of uniform size and shape. Therefore, even if a synthetic oil does burn a little, the remaining oil has the nearly the same chemical characteristics that it had before the burn off. There are no smaller molecules to burn-off and no heavier molecules to leave behind.
Moreover, many synthetics have very low ash content and little if any impurity. As a result, if oil burn-off does occur, there is little or no ash left behind to leave sludge and deposits on engine surfaces. Obviously, this leads to a cleaner burning, more fuel efficient engine.
Heres an exert from some research done by car junky on oil breakdown:
Today's engines are expected to put out more power from a smaller size and with less oil than engines of the past. Therefore, the engines run much hotter than they used to. That puts an increased burden on the oil.
Even the best petroleum oils will have flash points only as high as 390 and 440 degrees F. Some actually have flashpoints as low as 350 degrees. For today's hot running engines, this is not nearly enough protection. Just about any synthetic you come across will have a flashpoint over 440 degrees. Premium synthetics can have flashpoints over 450 degrees with some even reaching as high as 500 degrees. That's a big difference.
As a result, I think that it's quite obvious that these high- tech oils offer a substantial benefit when it comes to potential breakdown due to burn-off. Nevertheless, even though synthetics are MUCH less prone to burn-off than are petroleum oils, there is still some burn-off during extremely high temperature operation.
Thus, it becomes important to discuss the manner in which petroleum and synthetic oils burn off. As a refined product, petroleum oil molecules are of varying sizes. Thus, as a petroleum oil heats up, the smaller, lighter molecules begin to burn off first.
Since the ash content in many petroleum oils is higher than synthetics, deposits and sludge are left behind to coat the inside of your engine. Detergent and dispersant additives are used to keep these deposits to a minimum, but only so much can be done. Unless you're changing a petroleum oil every 2,000 to 3,000 miles some deposits are going to be left behind.
In addition, as smaller particles burn off, the larger, heavier molecules are all that is left to protect the engine. Unfortunately, these larger particles do not flow nearly as well and tend to blanket the components of your engine which only exacerbates the heat problem.
Synthetic oils, on the other hand, because they are not purified, but rather designed within a lab for lubrication purposes, are comprised of molecules of uniform size and shape. Therefore, even if a synthetic oil does burn a little, the remaining oil has the nearly the same chemical characteristics that it had before the burn off. There are no smaller molecules to burn-off and no heavier molecules to leave behind.
Moreover, many synthetics have very low ash content and little if any impurity. As a result, if oil burn-off does occur, there is little or no ash left behind to leave sludge and deposits on engine surfaces. Obviously, this leads to a cleaner burning, more fuel efficient engine.
12 April 2011, 09:38 PM
#27
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Well I wouldn't call Shell Helix a top oil and everyone seems to run it as some gold standard.
I guess you gotta see how hot your oil temps get when thinking about changing after a few laps.
I guess you gotta see how hot your oil temps get when thinking about changing after a few laps.
12 April 2011, 09:46 PM
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I'm not saying it is, and also for record my wrx is a street car not track
What i was saying earlier was not only is cold temps an issue and not just with oil but oveheating (flashpoint) caused when tracking can be as well.
Letting an engine warm up, when using synthetic oil is not so much letting the oil get to temp to do it's stuff because as i'm sure you know it's synthetic so it doesn't need to, but it's to get the engine and it's internal components up to temp and that they are then running at their correct tolerances.
What i was saying earlier was not only is cold temps an issue and not just with oil but oveheating (flashpoint) caused when tracking can be as well.
Letting an engine warm up, when using synthetic oil is not so much letting the oil get to temp to do it's stuff because as i'm sure you know it's synthetic so it doesn't need to, but it's to get the engine and it's internal components up to temp and that they are then running at their correct tolerances.
12 April 2011, 09:47 PM
#29
I always used to consider my water temp gauge an indicator of whether to open her up or not. That is until I got a scoob with an oil temp gauge.
Water would be up to normal in 5 mins but oil would take another ~7. My 5 mile commute would just see temps up to 'working/thrash' temp.
I used to switch on for 10 mins on winter/frosty mornings but realised this is not good - something about the heads not getting warm...
Water would be up to normal in 5 mins but oil would take another ~7. My 5 mile commute would just see temps up to 'working/thrash' temp.
I used to switch on for 10 mins on winter/frosty mornings but realised this is not good - something about the heads not getting warm...
12 April 2011, 09:51 PM
#30
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Letting an engine warm up, when using synthetic oil is not so much letting the oil get to temp to do it's stuff because as i'm sure you know it's synthetic so it doesn't need to, but it's to get the engine and it's internal components up to temp and that they are then running at their correct tolerances.
(I think)
