What is Aquamist used for...
08 July 2008, 03:51 PM
#1
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What is Aquamist used for...
Been seeing Aquamist systems more and more in tuned scoobies.
Saw one car running 50/50 water alcohol mix with a tank in the boot.
What are they used for and what are their benefits?
Saw one car running 50/50 water alcohol mix with a tank in the boot.
What are they used for and what are their benefits?
Last edited by SqeekyMclean; 08 July 2008 at 04:07 PM.
08 July 2008, 04:47 PM
#3
The methanol in the charge makes more energy available so BHP / torque increased 
Also as above, cools the charge so can run more boost and ignition advance without det.
Shaun (12 litres of methanol / water in the boot LOL)
Also as above, cools the charge so can run more boost and ignition advance without det.
Shaun (12 litres of methanol / water in the boot LOL)
08 July 2008, 04:47 PM
#4
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Taken from Aquamist's website mate:
"Introduction:
For those who wants a 3-D water injection MAP but do not want to spend the time-consuming task of mapping, this system is perfect for you.
The heart of the system is a newly developed controller that reads the PWM signal from the engine's fuel injector (including Peak and Hold type) and convert it to drive the High Speed Valve to deliver water, it draws less than 10ma from the pulsed line. This will enable the water injection to follow a fixed water/fuel ratio."
"Introduction:
For those who wants a 3-D water injection MAP but do not want to spend the time-consuming task of mapping, this system is perfect for you.
The heart of the system is a newly developed controller that reads the PWM signal from the engine's fuel injector (including Peak and Hold type) and convert it to drive the High Speed Valve to deliver water, it draws less than 10ma from the pulsed line. This will enable the water injection to follow a fixed water/fuel ratio."
08 July 2008, 05:32 PM
#6
sort of, it cools the charge air overall making it more dense when the air is too hot thats what det is,, its pre ignition causing hot spots ect ( det on pistons is shown my the pitted marks)
its a good thing for high power engines as they can run very hot and having a system that works when the charge air is too hot to cool it is a very good thing,, methanol is just another fuel like petrol and so when that sparks it explodes like fuel does, the mix of water helps the extra heat created
hope that makes sence,,,, im not very good at explaining things without seeming agressive or ignorant it seems
on cossies SECS monitors used to have water injection output function,,, im not sure if simon fitted the same systems to the PSION or what ever scoobie versions of the montors he made where called,,,,, if he did and your ecu can take it then its a good idea for,,,,,, well nothing as the actual monitor was VERY good to have in the car too
08 July 2008, 06:02 PM
#7
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Years ago, I was into Vauxhall 16V (XE's and LET's) engines and helped a mate do some "development" work on his Calibra Turbo.
We were testing different pistons in his engine. Don't ask me why. I thought it was a stupid way of doing it but he was paying for the parts so why not. And the ARP head studs made it fairly easy to whip the head off.
So anyway;
While we were doing it, he fitted an aquamist system. after he fitted it, we could actually see that the piston crowns were alot cleaner and they were particularly clean where the inlet charge came into the chamber. Like they'd been pressure washed.
If I hadn't seen it myself then I would be a bit skeptical. The calibra ran 401bhp on it's last run before it got broken up for bits and the engine sold.
You also get cooler in bore temperatures due to the latent heat removed when the water/meth turns from a liquid to a gas.
We were testing different pistons in his engine. Don't ask me why. I thought it was a stupid way of doing it but he was paying for the parts so why not. And the ARP head studs made it fairly easy to whip the head off.
So anyway;
While we were doing it, he fitted an aquamist system. after he fitted it, we could actually see that the piston crowns were alot cleaner and they were particularly clean where the inlet charge came into the chamber. Like they'd been pressure washed.
If I hadn't seen it myself then I would be a bit skeptical. The calibra ran 401bhp on it's last run before it got broken up for bits and the engine sold.
You also get cooler in bore temperatures due to the latent heat removed when the water/meth turns from a liquid to a gas.
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09 July 2008, 02:34 PM
#8
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I read Auqamist's website , just couldn't make heads or tails of it all
Where about is the water injection kit fitted in the engine bay?
Where about is the water injection kit fitted in the engine bay?
Last edited by SqeekyMclean; 09 July 2008 at 03:37 PM.
09 July 2008, 02:55 PM
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You would fit the injector in the plenum chamber.
Just after the throttle body. Or just before it.
I read some work Dave Vizard did about changing where the injector was so that the full cooling effect could be made the most of. I think the best gains were made when the injector was actually drilled into the compressor housing of the turbo as this is where the majority of the charge heating occurs.
It was very interesting but pretty heavy and indepth stuff. I just can't remember which book it was in
Just after the throttle body. Or just before it.
I read some work Dave Vizard did about changing where the injector was so that the full cooling effect could be made the most of. I think the best gains were made when the injector was actually drilled into the compressor housing of the turbo as this is where the majority of the charge heating occurs.
It was very interesting but pretty heavy and indepth stuff. I just can't remember which book it was in
09 July 2008, 03:12 PM
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You will need a remap as well, fitting the kit on it's own will reduce power. Water inj is the last thing you should be trying. There are plenty of other things to do before going down this route to help reduce det.
11 July 2008, 09:30 PM
#15
wtf,,, what is it with this site are remapping for everything
the water just cools the inlet temp a ever so slight bit,,, and i mean very very little
whats with the remapping,,,,, do you remap your car on every fill up or if it rains, when the sun comes out or if your stuck in traffic ???
it helps REDUCE the risk of pre ignition,, the water injectors need to be the right size anyway !!!,,,,, but ffs a remap for this christ
11 July 2008, 09:36 PM
#16
Ginge have a look at my spec under view my scooby, I am having and aquamist 2d system to runa a 50/50 water meth combo.
I will be upping the boost and running the car slightly leaner, in your opinion does this necessitate a remap or is it like pissing in the wind pointless!
Banny
I will be upping the boost and running the car slightly leaner, in your opinion does this necessitate a remap or is it like pissing in the wind pointless!
Banny
11 July 2008, 09:50 PM
#17
why would you wanna run your car leaner UNLESS remapping it to allow, i understand cars are faster when leaner,,, better on fuel but unless you got a proper gauge with a decent lambda gauge with data logging warning,,,, you are asking for trouble
personally i would fit it, get the fueling checked THEN decide whats needed,,,, running lean on purpose with no reall reason is about as smart as not locking your car when going shopping
personally i would fit it, get the fueling checked THEN decide whats needed,,,, running lean on purpose with no reall reason is about as smart as not locking your car when going shopping
11 July 2008, 09:58 PM
#19
remapping is for mods that affect the car,,, things that the ecus controls will be not aware of if that makes sence
cooling mods aint the same as the ecu has that controlled into it anyway,,,, you can also run different rad fan temps to control the engines temps without remapping to help control the fuel bills, some cars in winter can have fans come on too early and sometimes leave the ecu thinking its on cold start,,,,, look at london taxis on the winter and you will see them with a big cardboard diamond on the front grill to decrease airflow to help reduce fuel costs
hope that helps to understad a little
cooling mods aint the same as the ecu has that controlled into it anyway,,,, you can also run different rad fan temps to control the engines temps without remapping to help control the fuel bills, some cars in winter can have fans come on too early and sometimes leave the ecu thinking its on cold start,,,,, look at london taxis on the winter and you will see them with a big cardboard diamond on the front grill to decrease airflow to help reduce fuel costs
hope that helps to understad a little
11 July 2008, 10:01 PM
#20
The car at the moment is at 440bhp and 385lb/ft of torque, I am changing the intercooler core, adding the water/meth injection and also mapping in some NF octane booster to the vpower/methanol I already run.
This should allow me to run 2 bar boost and possibly get close to 500bhp, which would be nice. Not too concerned with the fuel costs, more the safety hence the water/meth injection.
Banny
This should allow me to run 2 bar boost and possibly get close to 500bhp, which would be nice. Not too concerned with the fuel costs, more the safety hence the water/meth injection.
Banny
11 July 2008, 10:42 PM
#21
Very restrained reply Banny LOL
Ginge
Aquamist water injection cools the charge a lot due to the latent heat of evaporation of water being so high....fitting water injection in isolation reduces BHP output !!
The poor ECU looking at the situation with information only from the MAF / MAP / air temp etc can't cope LOL
Hence the need for the re-map
Shaun
Ginge
Aquamist water injection cools the charge a lot due to the latent heat of evaporation of water being so high....fitting water injection in isolation reduces BHP output !!
The poor ECU looking at the situation with information only from the MAF / MAP / air temp etc can't cope LOL
Hence the need for the re-map
Shaun
11 July 2008, 11:18 PM
#22
Very restrained reply Banny LOL
Ginge
Aquamist water injection cools the charge a lot due to the latent heat of evaporation of water being so high....fitting water injection in isolation reduces BHP output !!
The poor ECU looking at the situation with information only from the MAF / MAP / air temp etc can't cope LOL
Hence the need for the re-map
Shaun
Ginge
Aquamist water injection cools the charge a lot due to the latent heat of evaporation of water being so high....fitting water injection in isolation reduces BHP output !!
The poor ECU looking at the situation with information only from the MAF / MAP / air temp etc can't cope LOL
Hence the need for the re-map
Shaun
no its doesnt, the water turns to vapor like petrol does. you aint even CLOSE to flooding the bores and the water will only be sprayed in at the temps the controller uses when its needed,,, its not llke a fuel injector but on when the charge temps EXCEED the amount prefered and help lower it hence the tanks for water injection are only a few litres at most
dense air INCREASED the amount of charged air to the engine when ignited hence a car runs slower when in hot weather or aint you noticed that high ACT's mean less power ???
understand what water injection is actually doing,,,, its cooling the charge air ONLY when its too hot,,, to help bring it back to normalish temps,, water wont even get inside the engine due to the temps of the charge air
remaps are needed with dramatic changes in the engine conditions,,, the cooler air cancels out the need for more fuel,,,, the extra fuel is to cool the charge air,,,, hence running lean leads to a hot engine, hot spots in a engine that leads to pre ignition,, pre ignition leads to more hot spots and then the cycle contunues till something gives in,, usually a tip of a plug or the pistion or both also
hope that explains a little more
11 July 2008, 11:23 PM
#23
thats ALL the ecu reads from to make the engine run though,,,, and based on the voltages sent our from each part it adjusts its tables to set what fuel and spark the engine has,,,, what the hell you think happens in a remap ???
they adjust the settings on a laptop cause the sensors aint good enough to adjust them,,,, they tweek the tables to control more fuel or less spark based on the way the engine THEN performs due to a turbo having a larger power band,,,, cam timing changing the way the power band comes in, adjust the ignition so the engine wont suffer from dead spots and get the MOST out of a engine for the most power based on the fueling ect
the sensors STILL have to control the tables based on weather changes ect,,,, 10mph in traffic is different to 140mph in winter remember,,,, think how a ECU thinks for a moment
11 July 2008, 11:30 PM
#25
no, the temp compressed air is high, you ever been into a steam room,,, ever wondered why you aint steamed alive ???
water MIST is the vapor,,, not actual boiling air but the hotter water becomes the thinner it becomes
seriously do you think that its water thats poored into the engine,, if the ACT aint high enoug the water injector wont be in use,,,,, its there to reduce when needed but will be back into air again when it hits the head
water MIST is the vapor,,, not actual boiling air but the hotter water becomes the thinner it becomes
seriously do you think that its water thats poored into the engine,, if the ACT aint high enoug the water injector wont be in use,,,,, its there to reduce when needed but will be back into air again when it hits the head
11 July 2008, 11:52 PM
#27
im confused what you are getting at ?
i cant see if your agreeing or not as i genuinly dont get it
hot air has some water sprayed on it the air will become cooler,,,,will have moisture but thin if that makes sence,,,,, water may boil at 100 degrees but it also get thinner closer to the temp if that makes sence
i cant see if your agreeing or not as i genuinly dont get it
hot air has some water sprayed on it the air will become cooler,,,,will have moisture but thin if that makes sence,,,,, water may boil at 100 degrees but it also get thinner closer to the temp if that makes sence
12 July 2008, 12:03 AM
#28
What happens is that when the fuel / air / water mix in the cylinder the water "droplets" break down into individual water molecules. This needs energy and it is taken from the surrounding environment.....the so called latent heat of evaporation. In the case of water the amount of energy needed is quite high so the environment cools...
Think of it as a "wind chill factor"........if you are wet and the wind is blowing then the water evaporates from your clothes and you feel colder. If you put some nail polish remover on your skin and you blow on it then it feels cold as it evaporates !!
it's the same phenomenon just inside the engine
Shaun
Think of it as a "wind chill factor"........if you are wet and the wind is blowing then the water evaporates from your clothes and you feel colder. If you put some nail polish remover on your skin and you blow on it then it feels cold as it evaporates !!
it's the same phenomenon just inside the engine
Shaun
12 July 2008, 03:50 PM
#29
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IF 10% METH ADDS APPROX 7% POWER OR TOURQUE, then howmuch does this water and meathanold add? has any one done it on here b4?and is it worth it. cause these kits cost a lot of money apparentley.