GaryC

A friend of a colleague has just been 'had' for walking to his car, drunk, to get his house keys out of the car before getting a taxi home. Because he had his car keys on him, the ****** in blue (sorry, the police) have nicked him, and he is now facing a ban?? Even having explained the circumstances, his intentions of taxi-ing home, the fact that he had opened the passenger door, shown them the house keys in his glove box, and the fact that he was so drunk he wouldn't have found the car park entrance let alone driven out of it, he is being prosecuted.

What crazy country is this? Since when have the Police been elevated to GOD status??

DrEvil

Thats harsh.. i have been told in the past that if you have your car keys on you and look like you are about to get into the car in anyway you can be prosecuted... but hadnt heard of a working example of this.. nasty...

Hope he sorts it out soon, rgds, Alex

harj

This is shere stupidity on the plods behalf! , a guy I know is also in a similar predicement as he left his cigarettes in his mates car which was still open so he didn't have the keys on him, but the plod are trying to do him even though the car wasn't his and he didn't have any keys on him. The closest door to him was the drivers door of which he opened and the plod were sitting outside the pub waiting for real DD's not innocents!

Anyone who lives in or near leamington Spa, stay away from Saxon Mill as the plod are waiting there every night!!!

JohnS

iTrader: (1)

Unfortunately they can do this, as technically your friend was drunk in charge of a vehicle (he had the keys and had opened one of the doors).

There was a case in Aberdeen a few years ago, where one guy couldn't get a taxi home after an office Xmas party (out of town), decided to kip in the back of the car, and then walk to work next morning. Police woke him up in the middle of the night and he was successfully charged , even thoough he had absolutely no intention of even starting the car, let alone driving it!

Paul M

Sounds bloody tough, esp. since he'd opended the passenger door, definately worth a Not Guilty your honour

ChrisB

It's stories like this that get the Police a bad name / reputation.

Where was the car parked? If it was on private property (ie a pub car pack) do the Police have any rights to book him without him going onto the public road?

Utterly, utterly pathetic. A massive waste of tax payers money.

Chris.

robski

This is correct, but blatantly wrong!

I mean whats the difference between this and sitting in your own house having a couple of cans. Go to throw them in the bin outside, and on go the cuffs!

I must admit when I slept in my car (had had a few) after a party, I hid the keys just in case. Thought along the lines of "well I could drive the car officer but Ive lost the keys"

robski

logiclee

About ten or so years ago my Uncle went to fetch some CD's from the car and was arrested for being drunk in charge of a vehicle. He was found guilty as I'm sure your friend will, however he pleaded he needed his car as he is disabled and escaped with a large fine and a large number of penalty points.

No matter why you go to your car the offence is being "in charge" and intention to drive does not alter the charge
Sorry the story isn't good news.

Lee

hudster2

Surely they cannot do you if the car is on Private land. Doesn't the pub car park count as private land?

JoeyDeacon

A guy who used to work at my company was also convicted of being drunk in charge of a vehicle after he had decided to sleep in the back of his car after a night out. The police woke him up and convicted him in the middle of the night even though it took them 10 minutes to wake him up!!

My brother was convicted of drink driving about 2 years ago for being slightly over the limit (No excuses he knows he deserved it) but he got a 12 month ban and £190 fine which was considered pretty lenient. The real trouble he had was getting insurance afterwards as after LOTS of searching the best deal he could get was double what he was paying before his ban. Also remember that a ban for drink driving stays on your licence for 11 years!!

So basically your colleague is going to get a MINIMUM bad of 12 months and get shafted over car insurance for several years....

[Edited to say I didn't mean to have that smilie in the header]

[This message has been edited by JoeyDeacon (edited 20 December 2000).]

Jerome

The large problem with drink driving as an offence is that the Police get judged on their arrest leading to conviction rate (Stuart H, correct me if I'm wrong), and with D&D, it is a virtual guaranteed conviction on arrest. A friend of mine who was in the Met for a couple of years told me that if a Police Officer had a low arrest/conviction rate due to sickness etc., they would send him/her out on duty outside pubs/clubs and let them arrest the inevitable drink drivers. This seems to lead to the occasional over-zealous officer arresting an innocent as described in previous posts. I am totally against D&D, but in a few cases, innocent people are being convicted.

The worst case I heard of, was a guy who'd been drinking with his mate. His mate was sober and was doing the driving. On the way back from the pub, this guy was asleep in the passenger seat. His sober mate that was driving decided to stop at the cashpoint on the way home. He stopped and left the engine running whilst at the cash machine. Along come plod, see a guy in a car with the engine running and no driver and wake him up, breathalize him etc. As he was way way over the limit, he got a long ban an big fine. Ludicrous.

Another account tells of a guy who accepted a lift off an old friend he met in the pub. Old friend is sober, but - unbeknown to this guy - only has a provisional licence. Needless to say, car get pulled, it becomes apparent that the driver has a provisional, and the guy accepting a lift get 9 points and a huge fine for D&D.

Although these incidents are few and far between, they still shouldn't happen. For instance, a guy peering through the windows of a house wouldn't be done for burglary. Any observing Police Officer would wait until they broke in before any arrest. Why not at least wait until the guy puts the keys in the ignition, or evens starts the car before they arrest. Motoring offences are one of the few crimes that can lead to a convicition on the flimsiest evidence.

I'm not criticizing the Officers themselves, just the environment or policy that leads to this sort of over-zealousness.

Jerome.

[This message has been edited by Jerome (edited 20 December 2000).]

GCollier

Hmmmm commiserations for your friend.

It beats me how any police officer with an ounce of decency could see a guy done for this, and apply the letter of the law in such an indiscriminate way. It really leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Naunt

A question begs.....

As you can be charged with being drunk in charge of a car just by sitting in the passenger or back seat (apparently you have the ability to reach the hand brake and steering), then if I sit alone in a car before I have passed my test, then can I be prosecuted for driving without a license?

LOL !!

Andy Hall

How close do you actually have to be to your car to be charged with intent to drive. Presumably anyone who has drunk much over a pint and is carrying a set of car keys could be regarded as intending to drive whilst over the limit.
What do we have to do, call the local nick and ask permission, or ask a policeman to come round and get your keys out of the glovebox for you so you can get into your house, otherwise you die of exposure and it's all the polices fault (yea right). Sounds rediculous does'nt it, but then the law often is. Why can't they just sit and wait one minute and see if the guy actually sits in the drivers seat and starts the engine. If he does then he should be bl**dy well hung. Sorry to say it just smacks of another easy way of getting people off the road and keeping up the crime statistics without actually nicking criminals.

Andy

Hunk

Wow! The more i read about your laws the more i'm happy to live in a somewhat 'relaxed' country..

I like the Brits for there weird sense of humour.. but sometimes i wonder.. is it mad cow disease?

logiclee

Andy Hall,

You do not need to prove intent to drive. Having the car keys and being in or around the car (may need to be unlocked) is being drunk while in charge of a vehicle.

Lee

DavidRB

Holland relaxed?

New York's Murder rate - 13.3 per 100,000
Amsterdam's Murder rate - 38 per 100,000

Anyway, back on topic. This sucks, but it goes along with the simplified Gatso way of thinking, i.e. being drunk near a vehicle automatically leads to deaths. There should at least be some evidence that the car was about to be (or had recently been) driven.

pslewis

A very interesting question and a bad dilema if you are the one in the situation. I did the very same thing many times in my youth - party - drunk - sleep on back seat ... it is actually the best thing to do! and to think you can get prosecuted - well it beggars belief.

The question of the 'private land' is very relevant. If I am drinking in my house, say Xmas day, and go out to the car I cannot be prosecuted if it is on my driveway (but I can if it is on the kerb!!) - I could even drive it around my driveway all I like ... as I understand it I am NOT committing an offence. As would be my 12 year old driving in my grounds, its up to me entirely!

Or am I wrong?? can they do me for sleeping in my car, in my garage, whilst pi55ed and thrown out the marital home??? I really think not.

So? is a pub car park private? has the landlord given permission for the police to test on his land??

pete

Andy Hall

Good point Pete, I used to use a pub which was on a long straight road and the police used to sit behind the hedge in the car park and pick people off. The landlords wife used to go out and tell them to F off (as they were a bit of a customer deterant), I presume they didn't have any rights to be there, as they always left.

Andy

PS You must be really posh if you have grounds, I've only got a garden

pslewis

When does a garden become grounds??

Is it over, say? 5 Acres??

Anyway, have a good 'ole Xmas one and all - need to go and cut the tree from the grounds right now with the head gardener

pete

Nick

These are disgusting stories. It's just like a police state!

So I'm sitting at home, in front of my computer with a bottle of beer & the car keys in my pocket. How long before plod nicks me?

>Andy
Plod hides behind hedges in Russia also!

Nick

Just a thought.

My girlfriend has no driving licence. We walk towards my car & I give my car keys to her so she can get something out of the boot. Plod jumps out & nicks her for driving without insurance?

boomer

Gary,

get your colleagues friend to write to ALL the papers (local and national), his (her) MP, the ABD, Jack (psycopath) Straw, Tony Blur et al. Assuming the story is correct, THIS STINKS! The Police (wo)man who trumped up this charge doesn't deserve a pension

mb

MorayMackenzie

I keep my car key separate to the rest of my keys so i can leave it in a safe place if i go out to drink. It would be amusing to see what the police would do if they found you "drunk in charge" using the alarm remote to open the car and leaving the actual ignition key with a friend. It being your vehicle, breaking in or TWOCing wouldn't really hold water either... so that leaves wasting police time... can we prosecute the police for wasting our time?


Nick,

I doubt that would happen... she would need to be found actually driving the car for that...and she would need to be drunk to be "drunk in charge".

Moray

Gerg2

Warning: Entering EXTREME rant mode.

After just reading all that I am pi55ed off to no end.
I dont know what kind of country you guys live in but I've never heard of that over here and if some w@nk cop tried to nab me for that I'd be up for some kind of assault charge as well.

Its crap like this that ends up turning nice people into pr*cks in the heat of the moment....and dont tell me that if you challenged them while you were drunk you would'nt cop a flogging.

Totally unrealistic and unreasonable law.
F**kers ! ! ! !

Rant off.

Edited coz its hard to spell when your typing with clenched fists ! ! ! !

[This message has been edited by Gerg2 (edited 20 December 2000).]

Dream Weaver

You'd think the plods would be happy that you have had a kip in your car, or gone to get your house keys/taxi, than risk driving home. I DONT condone drink driving, it is terrible, but sometimes they go too far.

Just another ludicrous piece of unjust law from our once great country. I am just waiting for the new laws on smoking whilst driving - surely they cant be far off.

SimonM

Two words spring to mind... 'Jobsworth' and 'F@cking'. Not necessarily in that order.

SimonM

Stuart H

Gary,

A few questions if I may:
a)Was your friend required to provide a specimen of breath for analysis?
b)What was he charged with?
c)What was the lower reading achieved on the alcometer back at the police station (if he was arrested)?

Cheers

S

Neil Smalley

PC Plod. Go away Mr troll.

Stuart H

I have removed PC PLOD's "contribution" to this thread