More P1 problems..................................
19 December 2000, 04:08 PM
#1
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Have spoken to IM and they assured me that the brake problems I have been encountering(along with all of you others with upgrade brakes) will be sorted. New front wheels ,new front bumper and lip spoiler with armourfend on. Me thinks great.
Until I cleaned it today only to discover that the impossible to remove rusty brake dust has now decided to adhere itself to the sides of the car aswell!
Thats with only one week since I last washed and waxed it. It seems that the longer you leave the brake problem the worse its gonna get. If you are reading this Prodrive you will I hope already be aware of my complaint via IM so I would be VERY interested in your comments.
I can only say that I am at my witts end with this car and wish I had never bought the thing.On a car that has only covered 7300 miles in 6 months suppose to entertain the idea of a re-spray............I dont think so.
Until I cleaned it today only to discover that the impossible to remove rusty brake dust has now decided to adhere itself to the sides of the car aswell!
Thats with only one week since I last washed and waxed it. It seems that the longer you leave the brake problem the worse its gonna get. If you are reading this Prodrive you will I hope already be aware of my complaint via IM so I would be VERY interested in your comments.
I can only say that I am at my witts end with this car and wish I had never bought the thing.On a car that has only covered 7300 miles in 6 months suppose to entertain the idea of a re-spray............I dont think so.
19 December 2000, 05:33 PM
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Arron,
Do you have the Alcon caliper upgrade? and is it the pads supplied with them that's causing the problems, because I have AP 6 pots and AP pads on my P1 and they don't seem to be too bad although the brake dust can be a bugger to shift if left on too long.
Do you have the Alcon caliper upgrade? and is it the pads supplied with them that's causing the problems, because I have AP 6 pots and AP pads on my P1 and they don't seem to be too bad although the brake dust can be a bugger to shift if left on too long.
19 December 2000, 05:36 PM
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Yes sickening isnt it. I have just removed one set of wheels as my dealer said they were imposible to clean. I have asked my dealer what to do they say get in touch with Prodrive but on another thread, Prodrive say get in touch with your dealer. I would like to know If I should have my brake pads changed to another sort before I also get these problems with my paintwork and new P1 wheels.
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19 December 2000, 07:27 PM
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Bob, who did you buy your car from?
...
Right
. So complain to the dealer. It's their problem, not Prodrive's. It's up to the dealer, or more likely IM, to complain to Prodrive if they think their choice of brake pads is wrong.
This car was rushed out in a big hurry
.
...
Right
. So complain to the dealer. It's their problem, not Prodrive's. It's up to the dealer, or more likely IM, to complain to Prodrive if they think their choice of brake pads is wrong.This car was rushed out in a big hurry
.
19 December 2000, 10:27 PM
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Why is it the dealers or IMs problem and not Prodrives?, the kit was developed by Prodrive and bought to the market when Prodrive was happy for it to be done so and surely after all the fuss they make about their other products, then this kit too would have had to "pass stringent quality standards to be the only kit with IM approval" and have all the stamps and badges?......yeah right.........
19 December 2000, 11:47 PM
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1. Arron - get a clay bar from WoW Mark Underwood and the sides of your car will be good as new in 10 seconds.Mine were the same as yours but his clay bar is a miracle, just lifts it all away in a few seconds, no harm done.
2. We know there is a problem with the pads on the Alcon/Prodrive set up.Much discussion on a thread a few weeks ago. Basically the Ds3000 are not for road use apparantly, and will eat your discs and bugger your wheels. My discs/pads were changed after 7000 miles -the grooves had disappeared after mainly motorway use and were certainly not abused.I now have DS2000 and the problem seems to have gone although I havn't done that many miles since the change. Seems to have cured the droning noise under high speed braking too. Wheels still on backorder.
3. If anyone has a problem, which probably is everyone with this brake setup fitted since about July ?, just go to your dealer, tell them you want new discs/wheels and the pads changed to DS2000.
That is what I did and within a couple of days it was sorted.
4. To be fair to Mike, he was involved in sorting out my problem and I must thank him for his quick response and personal delivery of the parts to my dealer (I think he was going there anyway but he took the trouble nonetheless). I have also queried some other things with him in the past about my P1 and always found him to be very helpful.
5. Despite having a few problems with my car, I think it is firkin fantastic, don't give a monkey's whatsit how much it is worth now and wouldn't change it for anything else.
Just my two pence worth
Russell
2. We know there is a problem with the pads on the Alcon/Prodrive set up.Much discussion on a thread a few weeks ago. Basically the Ds3000 are not for road use apparantly, and will eat your discs and bugger your wheels. My discs/pads were changed after 7000 miles -the grooves had disappeared after mainly motorway use and were certainly not abused.I now have DS2000 and the problem seems to have gone although I havn't done that many miles since the change. Seems to have cured the droning noise under high speed braking too. Wheels still on backorder.
3. If anyone has a problem, which probably is everyone with this brake setup fitted since about July ?, just go to your dealer, tell them you want new discs/wheels and the pads changed to DS2000.
That is what I did and within a couple of days it was sorted.
4. To be fair to Mike, he was involved in sorting out my problem and I must thank him for his quick response and personal delivery of the parts to my dealer (I think he was going there anyway but he took the trouble nonetheless). I have also queried some other things with him in the past about my P1 and always found him to be very helpful.
5. Despite having a few problems with my car, I think it is firkin fantastic, don't give a monkey's whatsit how much it is worth now and wouldn't change it for anything else.
Just my two pence worth
Russell
20 December 2000, 12:06 AM
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Sunil, it's the dealer's problem because they sold Bob the car and so they have to sort it out for him. Bob has no relationship with Prodrive. The fact that Prodrive developed bits of the car and decided what brake pads to use is not relevant to Bob in terms of getting his problem fixed.
20 December 2000, 12:35 AM
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Arron,
Did IM give you any indication when the improved items will be available? I'm fed up to the back teeth with trying to clean my wheels and sometimes wish that I had never seen the damned brakes. When I spoke to Mike Wood about poor cold performance a short while after having them fitted in July I got the impression that I should have DS2000's instead of the DS3000's that were supplied with the original kits. I have never checked this but I'm now noticing a worrying lip round the edges of the discs showing how much they are wearing
. I'll be checking soon and measuring the disc thickness at the same time.
If I was Prodrive I would be extremely worried about how quickly the cachet of their name is going down the tube.....
Raymond.
Did IM give you any indication when the improved items will be available? I'm fed up to the back teeth with trying to clean my wheels and sometimes wish that I had never seen the damned brakes. When I spoke to Mike Wood about poor cold performance a short while after having them fitted in July I got the impression that I should have DS2000's instead of the DS3000's that were supplied with the original kits. I have never checked this but I'm now noticing a worrying lip round the edges of the discs showing how much they are wearing
. I'll be checking soon and measuring the disc thickness at the same time.If I was Prodrive I would be extremely worried about how quickly the cachet of their name is going down the tube.....
Raymond.
20 December 2000, 10:05 AM
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Russell I hear what your saying but the problem is I SHOULDNT HAVE TO BE DOIN IT OK.
I do have some bars as i tried them on the wheels.Didnt touch em.
IM will now be sorting my car and if it isnt dealt with soon the whole world is gonna know about it!
I do have some bars as i tried them on the wheels.Didnt touch em.
IM will now be sorting my car and if it isnt dealt with soon the whole world is gonna know about it!
20 December 2000, 10:11 AM
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Just out of interest Aaron, have you forwarded this problem to AutoExpress.
If you have details of ALL problems encountered [to me it sounds like you have], I think your problems may be dealt with a little more urgency if IM get magazines asking a few uncomfortable questions.
If you have details of ALL problems encountered [to me it sounds like you have], I think your problems may be dealt with a little more urgency if IM get magazines asking a few uncomfortable questions.
20 December 2000, 09:52 PM
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DavidG,
Bob can buy his car from Mars if he wants, however Bob purchases an APPROVED PRODRIVE/ALCON BRAKE KIT. This kit is approved by IM, fitted in accordance with manufacturers instructions and used as specified under the terms and conditons as also as reasonably exzpected and still directly causes damage to Bobs wheels and Bodywork.........and you still think that Prodrive (I.E THE MANUFACTURER( are not accountable........WHY???????????
Bob can buy his car from Mars if he wants, however Bob purchases an APPROVED PRODRIVE/ALCON BRAKE KIT. This kit is approved by IM, fitted in accordance with manufacturers instructions and used as specified under the terms and conditons as also as reasonably exzpected and still directly causes damage to Bobs wheels and Bodywork.........and you still think that Prodrive (I.E THE MANUFACTURER( are not accountable........WHY???????????
21 December 2000, 12:17 AM
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Sunil, if Bob, or Aaron or anyone else, has a problem with their car, their recourse is to their dealer who sold them their car. If the dealer has to pay out to repair or replace any parts, then they in turn may have a claim against Prodrive (most likely via IM or Subaru UK) for recommending or supplying parts that weren't suitable.
The brakes were indeed sold on the basis that they were a Prodrive-recommended upgrade. However, that doesn't give Bob or Aaron any claim against Prodrive. What it may do is have an effect on Prodrive's reputation because the brakes they recommended have turned out to be (allegedly
) unsuitable for road use. But that's a different story.
If you found that your tyres were faulty, who would you go back to, your dealer or Bridgestone?
The brakes were indeed sold on the basis that they were a Prodrive-recommended upgrade. However, that doesn't give Bob or Aaron any claim against Prodrive. What it may do is have an effect on Prodrive's reputation because the brakes they recommended have turned out to be (allegedly
) unsuitable for road use. But that's a different story.If you found that your tyres were faulty, who would you go back to, your dealer or Bridgestone?
21 December 2000, 09:19 AM
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As has been stated many times with both the brake kits and all other Prodrive products supplied for Subaru road cars, please contact your dealer if you are unhappy. That's who you bought them from and they are there to keep you happy.
Aaron
Which dealer have you spoken to. As far as I am aware I have had no request for parts to replace the ones fitted to your car.
Regards
Mike
Aaron
Which dealer have you spoken to. As far as I am aware I have had no request for parts to replace the ones fitted to your car.
Regards
Mike
21 December 2000, 10:06 AM
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Mike seems about par for the course!
I bought the car from SGT and to be quite honest theres no way I`m going back there again.
The car is serviced now at my local dealer Welch Group in Cambridge.
It was serviced there the other day and loads of bits and bobs were placed on back order.
It was the next day when I washed it that I noticed the contamination to the body work.
I spoke to the guys at Welch`s again and expressed my concerns and was told that it needs inspecting by a regional manager. I told them if they dont get their fingers out we`ll be looking at a permanent BROWN car.
As far as I`m concerned it isn`t THEIR problem. I didn`t even buy the car from them for Christ`s sake.
When my car had it`s first service I complained about the brakes and was told that they would be fine...WRONG.
I want it sorting ...
I bought the car from SGT and to be quite honest theres no way I`m going back there again.
The car is serviced now at my local dealer Welch Group in Cambridge.
It was serviced there the other day and loads of bits and bobs were placed on back order.
It was the next day when I washed it that I noticed the contamination to the body work.
I spoke to the guys at Welch`s again and expressed my concerns and was told that it needs inspecting by a regional manager. I told them if they dont get their fingers out we`ll be looking at a permanent BROWN car.
As far as I`m concerned it isn`t THEIR problem. I didn`t even buy the car from them for Christ`s sake.
When my car had it`s first service I complained about the brakes and was told that they would be fine...WRONG.
I want it sorting ...
21 December 2000, 10:41 AM
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Why is it that Prodrive are happy to explain their high costs, due to exhaustive testing, R & D, quialty of components etc, then when there is a problem, refer it to a Dealer.
Surely this is purely their problem, as it was developed, tested etc, exclusively by them?
What will the dealers know - would've thought a clearer picture would be gained by talking to Prodrive direct?
Surely this is purely their problem, as it was developed, tested etc, exclusively by them?
What will the dealers know - would've thought a clearer picture would be gained by talking to Prodrive direct?
21 December 2000, 11:18 AM
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Craig/Aaron
We are not making your dealer responsible for your problems. They didn't manufacture the car either, but they do deal with the problems that you encounter with your car. This is the proper way to do it, via your nearest retailer. We are not asking them to come up with a solution, merely handle your concerns in a satisfactory manner.
Prodrive, Alcon, Subaru UK and their dealers are not making this difficult or running away from any issue. We are merely handling it in a similar way to any other issue that you would have with the cars we drive.
I hope this is now clear.
Mike
We are not making your dealer responsible for your problems. They didn't manufacture the car either, but they do deal with the problems that you encounter with your car. This is the proper way to do it, via your nearest retailer. We are not asking them to come up with a solution, merely handle your concerns in a satisfactory manner.
Prodrive, Alcon, Subaru UK and their dealers are not making this difficult or running away from any issue. We are merely handling it in a similar way to any other issue that you would have with the cars we drive.
I hope this is now clear.
Mike
21 December 2000, 11:25 AM
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I wonder how you would react Mike if you spent £34K on a car and in 6 months of ownership its been one thing after another, mainly due to poor R&D.
Lets face it the paintwork is crap, the overall quality is crap and in all fairness it isnt the car that we all expected it to be.
If my car looks like it does now after this ammount of time what the hell is it going to be like in 3 years time when I try and sell it?
Lets face it the paintwork is crap, the overall quality is crap and in all fairness it isnt the car that we all expected it to be.
If my car looks like it does now after this ammount of time what the hell is it going to be like in 3 years time when I try and sell it?
21 December 2000, 01:18 PM
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David, i wouldnt go back to Bridgestone as i have P Zeros by Pirelli and, i am so fanatical, i would go right back to the bloody rubber plant plantation and sort it out right at the start of the Supply Chain 
21 December 2000, 03:32 PM
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Aaron, I don't know if you've already done this, but it might be an idea if you put all of your problems/complaints in writing to the dealer and suggest in the letter that they speak to IM/Prodrive (or whoever) and give you an answer and plan for resolution within 14 days.
You might like to send it recorded delivery and also include a copy to IM's customer service manager.
It seems like you have some valid complaints, but I can also see Mike's point about them needing to be dealt with through the correct method - if you're not getting help through the dealer network then putting everything in writing does tend to 'clarify' the situation.
Hope you get it sorted soon.
You might like to send it recorded delivery and also include a copy to IM's customer service manager.
It seems like you have some valid complaints, but I can also see Mike's point about them needing to be dealt with through the correct method - if you're not getting help through the dealer network then putting everything in writing does tend to 'clarify' the situation.
Hope you get it sorted soon.