New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Warning- Long post alert!!

Hi all,

Just thought I'd share my remapping experience with you all, lest it might be of some interest to anyone who was thinking of having similar work done.

Background and car details:

I got my MY99 UK Turbo the best part of two years ago now. I've been very happy with it, but as is often the way, I started to crave more power! However, I didn't want to compromise the car's drivability or excellent reliability. I wanted more power and torque over as much of the car's rev range as possible and a bigger "shove in the back" under acceleration.

I didn't want to go for the PPP package, as I felt that something bespoke would generate bigger/safer gains and constitute better value for money.
So, I set about doing my homework on here by consulting a few experts -and owners who have similar modifications- and decided on the following specification:

Haywood and Scott Sports Cat DP (wrapped)
Haywood and Scott Decat centre section
Haywood and Scott Original Scooby design backbox
Ported and wrapped OEM headers
Samco turbo kit hoses
Simota Panel filter
VF35 Turbo
Walbro 255lph fuel pump, 3 port boost solenoid
Ecutek Remap

Now to get it fitted and mapped! But by who?

Well, there were two people in particular who were really excellent when it came to advice about modifying the car: David at APi and Bob Rawle. So, they would get the car!

A trip to APi

A bit of a nightmare of a journey involving queue after queue on the M25 gave me plenty of time to reflect on my decision. Did I really want to go through with this- I mean, it's already a quick and very usable performance car- what more did I want? Was I about to sacrifice reliability for gains that might not even be that apparent? The questions continued on the M40: Would my gearbox hold up, what effect would the modifications have on the car's longevity and, most importantly:

Where the hell was I??

I'd come off at the right junction, but driven straight past APi. Nice roads around this way, I remember thinking .....and then again, as I had to backtrack about 5 miles to find Churchlands farm.

I was greeted by David (nice to be able to put a face to him at last) and Nathan then sent to the reception for a cuppa (thanks Claire). I liked the buzz of the place, it's very obviously a busy workshop first and foremost, not just a showroom that just happens to have a garage out the back.

I was having quite a bit done, and I could see the place was busy, so didn't want to get under anyones feet. I decided to have a wander around the nearby village and seek out a nice pub to enjoy the sunshine and get something to eat. I can recommend the Shakespeare if you're ever in the vicinity of APi - lovely pub and great food!

Not long after getting back to APi, the work on my car was complete and I heard a familiar rumble coming from the garage. I looked up to see Adam driving my car around the block to check all was ok. Blimey, it sounded lovely!! You only realise just how good your car sounds when you're outside it!

Then it was just the matter of having a little go myself- I took it very easy prior to re-mapping; 'better safe than sorry', I thought! Everything felt fine for steady driving and it was obvious that the ECU was taking care of things for the time being. The only other thought that occurred to me was: "Doesn't heat wrap smell funny- kinda like a burned toasted sandwich made in a very old and greasy toaster". Don't ask me how I know that!!!

All that was left was for me to hand over the dosh to David and make good for my escape to Swindon! Thanks to his excellent prices, it turned out that paying David was to be a lot less painful than finding the hotel I'd booked in Swindon!! Having spent about 2 hours driving around the town centre, I tore up the useless AA directions and just got out the trusty Atlas!! Strangely enough, my navigation problems disappeared after that. Hmmmm . Enjoyed the well appointed DeVere hotel......(I wonder if that chain of hotels is what the most unfortunate Little Britain character is named after) and got a good nights sleep in anticipation of a busy next day.

Had several strange dreams about roundabouts!

Remap day arrives!

Woke up early and thought about hitting the hotel pool, had a cup of tea, decided that this was just a plain silly thing to do and went back to bed!

Woke up again just in time to wolf down a big fry up and hope that maybe Bob could extract a few extra pounds feet of torque to offset the few extra pounds of Bacon I'd just put on!

Finding Bob's was easy, thanks to the excellent directions given by Branco. Presumably, he didn't use the AA route finder!! I was greeted by Bob outside of his house and tried not to drool over his lovely Porsche too much!! At this point the temperature must have reached about 32 degrees. Bob was cool, calm and very professional as he installed my 3 port boost solenoid and set to work connecting his gear. I, on the other hand, was sweating bullets!

A moment of high tension followed as the re-flash (?) of the ECU took place and Bob uploaded the base map. It's alive, ALIVE!!!! So, now it's off to do the mapping. Bob explained what would happen and what was required of me. Holding different levels of boost, easy, surely??!?!?!

Erm, no, it's actually rather difficult at first!

As we headed out onto the dual carriageway, I will admit to being rather nervous, the traffic was steady as opposed to busy, but it could hardly be described as quiet! Oh good! Bob asked me to get 0.5 of boost on the gauge, I put my foot down fully expecting the response of my old car and it pretty much shot up to 1 bar straight away! Whoops! So, I over-corrected and then it went to 0, then 1, then 0, then.....well you get the idea! Maybe that Fry up wasn't such a hot idea!! Anyway, second attempt, an improvement, I wasn't chasing the needle anymore and managed to hold around 0.5. Bob then asked for 1.0 bar. Still very nervous I duly obliged, well at least I think it was close enough. "Come off at the next exit" said Bob, and we're going to park in a little side road so I can make adjustments. Now, in my defence, this is a very small side road, more of a track that happens to feature some tarmac, actually. As a result, I kinda nearly went past it! Sorry Bob! Anyway, after a small 'adjustment', I parked the car and Bob started to make his changes. It was only at that point I started to take in what had happened. Even on that 1st run, it was apparent that the car was transformed. I was having trouble taking in the changes as I'd been concentrating!

Off we go again, second run (having nearly taken the wrong exit on a roundabout- whoops- sorry Bob, again!!) More of the same holding boost increments, checking boost response etc... I think I was improving.....just! Back to another car park and time for Bob to do his magic! I remember thinking there was so much I wanted to ask him, but thought I should let him concentrate. Another run and further changes, and then the final run, including a blast through 3rd gear to get the power figures. Be warned, you will have to disclose your weight (your real weight, not the pretend one you give at medicals.....who ate all the pies?) for this to be calculated. Even though I was concentrating hard on the road, I remember thinking: blimey, this really is a BIG improvement! Then Bob gave me the news................I'm not telling you yet, I'll show you the graph at the end of the post!!

Then it was back to base and time for Bob to reclaim his gear. It had all gone very quickly, and Bob had made it look oh so easy! I got in a few questions as he was unplugging the wide-band, mainly about the implications of the map for the car's maintenance etc now that it was running a lot more power. Bob is the kind of person that instills utter confidence in you: you're left with the impression that he just knows these cars inside out and you can take what he says to the bank. I was worried about what the modifications and remap would do to the car, but after speaking to Bob, these concerns evaporated. Time to pay up, say goodbye and head to the nearest pub for a lemonade or two and the footie!

Well, we all know what happened next. Poor old England! To be honest though, I was so excited about getting to give the car a good run on the way home, I didn't care too much!

The drive home

Ah, the joys of the M4. To be honest, a motorway shouldn't be the best place to test out the extent of the improvements a remap has made to a car designed for sprinting, not cruising at high speed. However, so sweeping are the improvements to the car, it turned out to be a good initial venue. The car now has much improved punch at motorway speeds. It was certainly decent, but not outstanding, before. If you were at 70 mph and put your foot down with the TD04 you'd get a nice little surge, but it didn't feel "decisive". It does now!! The current set up makes for very easy progress on the motorway. Refinement has improved significantly too, probably thanks to the heat wrap on the DP and headers.The car also feels very smooth and unstressed at motorway speeds, like there is always quite a bit more to come. I found myself thinking about reaching for a non-existent 6th gear a few times because the shove available convinced me I was in a lower gear than 5th.

Anyway, I've not yet had the chance to comprehensively assess the car in its more natural environment yet, but I'll give you my initial impressions based on my exposure so far.

Performance:

Hard to describe the improvement, I think the best way of putting it is that it's moved the car up a league in the performance stakes! Compared to the TD04 set up, it's quite similar at low revs, more "beefy" for want of a better term and easier to potter around in. It takes only a brush of the throttle to get up to 30 swiftly. Keep pressing the throttle and the mini-surge that used to happen with the TD04 at about 2600rpm doesn't materialise, you just get a steady and smooth increase in thrust, at about 3000rpm the turbo is getting its wind and then shortly after the rush begins! This is the bit that does the business for us turbo enthusiasts and the car doesn't disappoint: suddenly someone has hit the fast forward button on the scenery! The car has a proper top end now. The TD04 was out of puff at about 5.5k, the VF just keeps going and doesn't even seem to tail off that much towards the red line! A rolling start through 1st and second gear left me in no doubt that the car was now capable of sub 5 seconds to 60 without the need to be totally brutal with it. More impressive, however, is the in gear increments: 30-70 is now dispatched at an alarming rate and there is oodles of torque for quick and safe overtaking without the need to change down.

It's now a seriously quick everyday car that would be decisive against all but similarly tuned vehicles and exotica.

Drivability

This is a concern for many TD04 owners who don't want a car with a high turbo threshold and lots of lag that makes for questionable everyday performance. They also don't want something that is rough and uncivilised at low speed. Perhaps the most surprising thing about my car now is how the significant increases in power have been achieved with improvements in drivability! Around town the car is now noticeably smoother than before and makes swift progress with less effort. The VF35 really chimes in a bit later in the rev range than the TD04, but the car seems happier and stronger off-boost, so getting to the point where the turbo really starts to spin is not an issue. When the turbo does kick in though, the difference between it and the TD04 are so pronounced as to render the slightly higher threshold redundant! Even when the turbo is boosting hard, the car remains silky smooth and not at all uncouth! The car sounded and felt a bit strained with the TD04, like it didn't really appreciate being pushed hard, it now feels completely comfortable.

Refinement.

Again, surprisingly, despite the power increases, this has improved! The sound in the car is now more muted, but the burble is more pronounced as the harshness seems to have gone completely, letting you appreciate the mellow rumble. The car was noticeably less boomy on the motorway and is quiet in the cabin around town. The noise from the outside is simply perfect. Loud enough to turn heads, but not OTT and has a lovely deep, bassy and smooth tone. It sounds potent, unfussed and classy, which is exactly what I was going for.

Economy

Too early to say at the moment, but I have a suspicion this is improved for gentle driving; if you light the turbo, well I'm guessing that it'll be slightly thirstier now.

Reliability

Again, too early to say, but David and Bob both insist it'll be fine and I trust them totally. This could, of course, be a placebo effect, but the car does feel 'happier', i.e. less stressed, smoother, less harsh, it sounds better etc....

Get to the figures!!!!

Ok, ok!! here's the thing you've all been waiting for.....cause I know how SN likes its power graphs and numbers. I'm usually much more interested in how the car feels "the bum dyno" than figures per se, but I'll admit it was good to have some for the car to quantify the gains after the remap- and the power graph is always interesting.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v683/ns04/cc60eb74.jpg

Thank you APi and BRD!! I think the graph speaks for itself as a glowing recommendation for your work!!


Concluding comments and acknowledgements/thanks

A massive thanks to David, Nathan and Adam at APi and Bob at BRD for their advice, workmanship and very reasonable prices. I would not hesitate to recommend both companies as the advice and service I got from both was 1st class. There was no pressure, no BS, they listened to what I wanted and told me exactly how to achieve it without spending a small fortune. The car now does exactly what they said it would and feels absolutely great, I'm really chuffed to bits - even at this early stage!

If you're thinking about having some work done on the car and a remap, you really should be talking to the above!

I'd also like to thank Andy Forrest for his advice and the Guys at Xtreme Scoobies (who know me and my car fairly well) for their input.

Questions?? ..................... No, you can't have the last 5 mins of your life back!!!

Ns04

RB5_245

Nice write up good to see someone happy with their car

WRX_Rich

iTrader: (5)

knew you would like it

2 top outfits you used, which is half tha battle

Neilo

ditto Richs comment, they are both weapons of choice for my car too Glad your happy, join the party that are!

lunar tick

iTrader: (2)

Very enjoyable write up - thanks for taking the time to share your experiences

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

lol and how right you were!

Echo the sentiments about chosing the right place to have your work done and the right mapper- it's critical! APi and Bob made it all look very routine and easy- always a good sign of people at the top of their game.

Lunar Tick. You're welcome!

Ns04

SirFozzalot

Good write-up and an interesting read.

StudentScooby

Carnt make out the figures on my plasma

SirFozzalot

319 BHP
316 ft lbs

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

319bhp and 316lbs ft torque.

But the headline figures are less informative than the shape of the power curves when it comes to the way the car drives.

Like I said, it's nice to have the figures post remap, and I include them as I know people will be interested, but the bum dyno is always the most important when it comes to genuine satisfaction with the car and it's spot on!!

Ns04

APIDavid

iTrader: (4)

Good Luck NS04 !! Thanks for the praise - said it before though - ' Jest doin' our job.' l'll pass it on to the staff.

David APi Impreza / APi Engines
www.apiengines.com

PS it helps to have the graph because that is an upgrade we recommend for most late model UK / Euro turbo cars and the customers' always ask what it'll do after the work.

GazTheHat

Nice write up. It brought back flashes of my tuning experiences recently. (Time for more?!? )

Made me laugh about the heatwrap. No-one told me about that either, it is a weird smell.

Funny, when i was mapping with AndyF, it seems like all my driving skills went out the window too. I think it was half nerves and half excitement. I missed 5th and into 3rd, was not with-it really. I did the opposite though, kept pestering him with questions. Turned round occassionally to see he had the detcans on, so didn't hear me.

But changed that on the drive home.

Enjoy!!

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Glad the graph helps, David. I was almost temped to save my fingers some effort and just post the following\; Api + Bob Rawle = *insert power graph here* A picture paints a thousand words as they say!

Thanks again!!

All the best,

Paul

IN THE STICKS

Good write up , thanks

Trout

iTrader: (1)

I think it is an Andy Forrest thing - he did the same on one of his drag runs on Sunday - still got a 10.4s run though!!

NS04 - what happened after 6,000rpm. Did the rollers start to slip or your boost control go awry? It is very spiky!

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

I drove like a Grandad between the runs mate!! My brain was a bit fried from all the driving the day before and negotiating all the roundabouts of Swindon using guesswork to find our hotel meant my navigational skills were shot to bits! Poor Bob kept having to remind me which exits to take! It was also very hot (no aircon during the mapping) and of course, the car felt very different! I was also pretty nervous!! So I have a whole raft of excuses for being crap!!

That said, 4 runs was all it took to get the car right in Bob's eyes. I suspect that's down to his considerable skill rather than my driving though!!!

Ns04

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Hi mate,

Those figures were taken from the software (Delta Dyno is it??) on Bob's laptop mate during a 3rd gear run, so no slipping rollers- although that would sound great . I strongly suspect that one of two things happened after 6000 rpm:

1) Bob called the run off satisfied with the info he'd got. I wasn't checking the revs, as you can probably appreciate- a full throttle run in 3rd in a Classic with the best part of 320 bhp and similar torque means you keep your eyes on the road.....especially when you're not used to it!!
2) I chickened out!

The car pulls right the way to the redline very smoothly, so it's definately an artefact of some kind!

Ns04

KJD Mk1

iTrader: (3)

An excellent write up, API also breathed life into mine although Pavlo did the mapping.
Enjoy

rigga

iTrader: (4)

Excellent write up..... have used API before for work,and wouldnt hesitate to do so again,great bunch of guys....Bob's work has been greatly documented,and its fair to say he's quite good at what he does to say the least..... your impresions are very smilar to my own very recently,again my00 but with a front entry converted TD05 and apexi power fc..... the difference is amazing,and i would concur with all of your post mod thoughts..... deff how the car should have been in the first place.... thought i would miss the divability the td04 had with early spool etc..... but as you say all the other benefits of the turbo change far outweigh that,its a beast now,cant think what some of the really "big power " cars would be like to drive.... congrats...... now where do you stop?

out of interest what boost figures did Bob settle at ? just to compare your results to mine,as with the apexi i wasnt able to get a delta dash print off ike yours..... mine peaks and holds at 1.3 bar

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Hi Mate,

Glad you're happy with your car too.

I'm going from memory here, I think Bob said it was set to peak at 1.35bar, settling down to 1.3bar and tailing off to 1.2bar at the top.

I think the car is fine power wise now, it's plenty quick enough!

Also, I'm getting to the stage where the law of diminshing returns starts to operate I think: i.e. I could pay a whole lot more dough for not much more performance! The experts I've consulted all seem to be saying that the car is fine at this level, and I don't want to push the car too far! I may go for a FMIC at some point to further negate the greater heat generated under the bonnet- as I understand it, not strictly necessary for my purposes but desireable....that's about it TBH.

Next modifications will focus on further improving the handling.

Ns04

jasonius

iTrader: (1)

rigga: lol ..!

NS04, so gald you're impressed..!

lol, I know the 'side' road/track you mean, some nice views though.. did you go down the long straight single carriageway NSL road (ie left out of the above 'side' road)..? Great piece of road.

I'm going to have to take the plunge with my VF35 now you've allayed my fears about lag compared to TD04. Anywhere near those figures of yours would be great.. Are you on std injectors BTW (440's..???)

David/Bob I'll be intouch for date's soon..

J

PS told you to practice holding 0.5-1.0bar lol..!

Trout

iTrader: (1)

Like your foot trembling on the throttle

Harty2000

Enjoyed reading that
How much did it all cost if you dont mind saying?
I would love extra power out of mine, but is there a certain milage its not safe to start messing with it, mine is on 108k miles?

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

I would argue that the VF35 turbo suits the UK model even better than the TD04 in terms of everyday drivability- you do have to wait a few hundred more rpm for it to spool (threshold) but the difference in lag (delay in repsonse to throttle) is barely noticable and when on boost the turbo delivers much more solid thrust and holds it!

Yes, I'm on the std injectors, apparently they are perfectly adequate for my power levels- I seem to recall a passing comment from Bob that the IDCs were fine. I was also advised to stick with the std FPR.

We did all the mapping on the dual carriageway. I would have liked to have practiced, but I don't have a boost gauge, just the all important Knocklink. I will get oil temp, pressure and Boost gauges as soon as the bank balance recovers though! Don't think I'll be going for Defi's though- Too pricey. Scoobyword seems to do a good offer.

Ns04

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

I don't know what you're talking about!!!

Ns04

GazTheHat

We all say that! Then lOOk what happens....

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Hi mate,

Very much depends on what car you have Euro/jap WRX/Sti, what modifications you already have on the car, whether you buy parts new/second hand, participate in group buys etc...Have a word with David and Bob; they're the experts and can advise best

Ns04

cw42

iTrader: (1)

Excellent write up, and brings back memories of bob mapping my old my99. Enjoy the car, it'll only get faster as the weather gets colder

DannyBoy007

iTrader: (7)

Spotted your car in the de vere Saturday morning, Had a wedding in the evening and was dropping off my mates Focus, He thought it was mine when we first pulled in.

I have pretty much the same mods, VF28 with a FMIC being the only differance, mine got 317 BHP on Powerstation rollers but the torque seemed low with 265lb. So much better but worth getting on the rollers to see proper power figures as they might not be as high as you think or worked out from a calculation.

Also had lots of work done by API and Bob, both fantastic to deal with.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

My first spot on SN!! Sorry I didn't see you mate - hope you had fun at the Wedding!

Regarding the accuracy of the figures, I guess that depends what RR you compare them to. Some may say more, others less, at the end of the day the debate can rage on and on and -I presume- without using an engine dyno, not resolved. The car certain feels stronger to the order of the gains stated on the readout and TBH that's good enough for me. FWIW, I believe Andy forrest obtained v similar figures on project WRX between the delta dyno and Dastek's RR (which seems to be regarded as a good un).

Ns04