typer320

if this has been posted then sorry
The world's top rally drivers - including Richard Burns, Colin McCrae and Carlos Sainz - are facing being banned from driving on roads in the UK after being caught speeding.

The big names were all driving between competition stages during the British leg of the world championships last year when they were clocked by speed cameras, a court has heard.
Some 20 big names competing in the rally were caught breaking the 30mph limit while making their way along country roads to the next stage of the rally in the Neath area on November 14 last year.
Others those caught on camera were Finn Tommi Makinen, four times world champion and German Armin Schwarz, a former European champion.
Only Schwarz pleaded guilty to five charges of speeding at Port Talbot Magistrates court.
Richard Burns, who was reigning world champion when he took part in last year's rally, and former world champion Colin McRae, along with 17 others, were represented at the court by solicitor Paul Trotman.
He told the court: "Some of my clients face disqualification and would be making out a case for not being disqualified on the grounds that they would suffer exceptional hardship."
Magistrates adjourned the case to November 10, when many of those accused will be in the country for the 2003 event.
A spokesman for the sport's governing body, the FIA, insisted that a ban would not stop drivers competing in events.

NACRO

Of course only the brits will get banned- the rest will get to keep their licences as a British court can't take away a licence held in a foreign country. I live in France and am getting myself a French licence for that reason if no other.

Turbohot

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2003350448,00.html

johnfelstead

according to Motor Sports Association rules (the governing body of British motorsport) Rule K7.1(a) A competitor must, if driving in the event, hold a current valid driving licence apropriate to the vehicle.

If a british driver gets banned they are not entitled to compete in any British motorsport event governed by the MSA and must return their competition licence until the ban is over.

Colin McRae has been banned before and competed on a foreign driving licence and non UK ASN licence.

Wales Rally GB needs to have a word with the Police if it doesnt want to lose yet more fans from the event, last year it was hard work to not be done for speeding, this proves how draconian it was.

Twigster

HAH!!! Like S. Wales police have the intelligence or wherewithall to promote a sporting event which can make Wales a lot of money through travelling fans and sponsorship when they can make thousands of pounds from speeding fines!! I don't think they care that Newport has alomst as much violent crime comitted as it does people living there, or that drug addiction is on the rise!! If you come to watch it, for the love of god have a good camera detector and a translator to help understand the signs, as they are going to be after everyone!!
It makes me ashamed that I am Welsh to be associated with them. The worst is the fact that up until two or three years ago the police were so much more respected.

johnfelstead

The next fancy gizzmo on a WRC car wont be performance related, it will be a pre programmed GPS speedo/speed governor. Bet you they have that for next year and the gravel crew will be noting the speed traps/ temp speed limits, not the ice on the stages.

ex-webby

Come on guys.

Are we saying it's ok to speed on the public roads, especially when they're at their busiest?

Cheers

Simon

JohnD

iTrader: (5)

How fast were these guys going to actually face a ban?
JohnD

WRX Wannabe

I think EVERYONE has gone over the speed limit

Without knowing what SPEEDS they were doing i dont think it would be fair to comment on this.

Just remember these guys can do stuff in their cars that only we can dream about

Also the cars will be far better than a standard road car for stopping with better discs and pads

Event though i dont condone speeding

ChrisB

As amazing as WRC cars are, they can't defy the laws of physics.

Mungo

Simon, as I'm sure you are aware, the traffic in South Wales when the rally's on is shocking. If competitors are getting stuck in this and having to put their foot down so as not to be late on the road sections that are clear, is that really fair? I'm not condoning speeding, but can you imagine what a team boss would say to his driver who was late into service becuase he'd stuck to the speed limit? Maybe it's the organisers who are to blame for being unrealistic about the traffic conditions.

ex-webby

OK, now we're just speculating.

We have no idea what the details of all this are. Maybe there's a lot more to it than meets the eye.

Until we do have those details, how can we blame, the police, the competitors, the organisers, the traffic, etc, etc.

All will become clear in time no doubt.

Cheers

Simon

PeterUK300

iTrader: (1)

So if they do let them off. Will they do the same for joe public that got caught by these camara's.....

No thought not...........

greasemonkey

Mungo wrote... Not really sure that's an issue. The rally route is deliberately planned to keep competing cars as far away from major spectator roads as far as geography allows. There would have been very few occasions on last year's rally when competitors would have been confronted with queues. Maybe the A40 on Saturday between the Epynt stages and service in Sennybridge, but that'd probably be it.

As Simon says, the exact circumstances of these prosecutions remains unclear. We all know that the local Feds flooded the area with speed vans for the weekend, and by the sound of things they're fleecing, oops, treating the competitors the same way as the public, which, depending on your point of view, is either ridiculous or only right.

If nothing else, the publicity these high-profile prosecutions will attract will bring the policy operated by the police over rally weekend into the spotlight. The cops will no doubt say that the competitors act as an example to the everyday motorists and thus they've even more responsibility to obey the law on the road.

I only hope that none of the drivers involved was going fast enough to give the "Speed Kills" evangelists extra ammunition. If, OTOH, they were all done doing only a handful of mph over the prevailing limit, it's likely to show the policy up for what it primarily was - a revenue-raising exercise.

T5NYW

iTrader: (4)

Hidden cameras and Spec type you could travel at 80mph on a safe motorway and pass enough cameras to end up banned 10 times over before the First notice comes through the post


If a deterent, you should know instantly, so you mend you ways and so you know where "the money traps" I mean Road hazards are.

Tony

D Noble

He He ,this post reminds me of some drivers at the rac a good few years ago, i think it may have been dai llewellyn( i may be wrong) who was late for a stage, and acually broke the speed limit on the grass on the central reservation!

on a more serious note,most drives drive like loonys on road sections,suppose they are still pumped up with addrenalin, but i always make sure i pull in and let them past well before they come up to me,cos id rather they didnt overtake me on a blind bend!!

should make it easily as the road time is calculated at 30mph,giving them ages as long as there are not too many delays

regards
dave

donutman

if any of the divers are reading this, try this linkhttp://www.safespeed.org.uk/unsigned.html

[Edited by donutman - 7/31/2003 12:05:39 AM]

greasemonkey

Probably a bit late for that seeing as the alleged offences took place last November, and cases have already been heard in court.

Andy Gough

Perhaps if the Police did an effective job, liased with the MSA plonkers, then the drivers would not have to spped.

Fact is, if you try and compress a WRC round into an area so small, then traffic congestion is bound to be awful.

F.F.Sake MSA, FIA,PLOD get real.

greasemonkey

Traffic congestion wasn't a problem for the crews Andy, period. There's more than one road in South Wales y'know

Couldn't agree more with the sentiments about the local constabulary getting real though. The policy as enforced last year was ridiculous.

[Edited by greasemonkey - 7/31/2003 12:29:50 AM]

KungFuMonkey

The organisers of events, usually leave ample time between check points on road sections (i.e stage end to service) hence the reason when cars do have problems, the driveres usually have enough spare time to try and effect some repairs.

Go to most events and all the cars (Barring problems) sit for a good 20+ mins outside a time control.

Jono

Scoob99

iTrader: (1)

Could it be they all had a dodgy currey the night before and needed the loo

Mungo

KungFuMonkey - for any other event, I'd probably agree, but not in this case.
Anyway, it is wrong to speculate, but Scoobynet can't help jumping to conclusions!!
It was a bit like a few years ago when Makinen was stopped by the police for leaving a stage in an unroadworthy car - it only had 3 wheels after he'd ripped one of the rears off on a rock (and on a Mickey-Mouse stage!). Miserable plod prevented him from continuing. I'm sure he'd have been safer with 3 wheels than most people with 4.

KungFuMonkey

the makinen wheel thing was a bit of a bugger for him, especially as later on in the event one plod "escorted" a three wheeled car to service!!!

Discression!

JonDBM

Last year I was on one part of the M4 where there had been a crash and about 4 WRC cars went down the hard shoulder as it was complete standstill. I just laughed at it, but maybe the police didnt see the funny side.

Jon.

Phil Hammond

From memory, wasn't the makinen issue to do with the fact that he had a motorway section to deal with. Whilst the other was in deepest darkest Wales!

As with others though, I feel it is likely that 'double standards' will occur with this case as, it would appear reading this, has happened in the past.

Why, if they are found guilty, should the Brit drivers suffer adversely for having a UK licence?
And if you get banned surely you shouldn't be allowed to carry on driving on a foreign licence?

Jonto

This country has gone mad, plain and simple !

greasemonkey

There was plenty of time on the road sections on the Q as well, unless (due to international timing) a car lost loads of time in a stage - making the subsequent road section shorter.

Not guessing/speculating on this BTW. As mentioned, the only point at which queues built up on a single carriageway was on the A40 on Saturday.

GM

Colin used to have a Finnish driving licence so when he lost his UK licence the last time he could still drive everywhere except the UK. It would surprise me if others hadn't done something similar!

Aintbroke dontfix

Jonto is right, this Country has gone mad. The police recently got a right old flea in the ear from a judge and the 10 year sting case thrown out for using underhanded, sneaky methods to catch money laundering drug dealers. They must only use this method for really hard core criminals like speeding motorists then!!!