IanF

Just sold my MY99 and plan was to buy a house.
However, may delay this and buy one of the above cars for the summer. It is intended to be a short term purchase and my main concern (as everyone elses probably) is depreciation.
I have found an Evo 6, Ralliart prepared with the UK warranty, 99/V, silver, fogs, cd changer, mats and pedal extensions for £27000.
Alternatively, I could go for an Impreza P1. I have been having some discussions with someone who is cancelling their order, so I may be able to get one through this route.
I am not really looking for advice on which of these two cars is better than the other, I would be happy with either one. Really, I am trying to work out how the secondhand market will treat these two cars over the coming months.
Any advice or help would be much appreciated in helping me to decide.
Regards
IanF

Bajie

P1. Purely as it is a limited edition car so shuld be snapped up when you resell.
Just to throw another choice in there's an STI VI for sale just down the road from me.
Brand new with a ribbon 32,995.

HUNTY

P1.

Will probably go down as the last great Impreza.
Values of the last Escort cossies and delta evo's seemed to hold up well.

A lot depends on the new Impreza (on other thread).

If it's overweight, ugly and goes all soft the P1's value will rocket.
If it's massively superior, as we hope, and still only £20 odd grand the P1 will look expensive.

Evo 6 is already out of date, the Makkinen has several upgrades and cosmetic tweeks and the evo 7 is rumoured to be out in 12 months.

Oh Sh*t, get the house, I've lost thousands on cars so clearly I have no idea.

James Neill

iTrader: (1)

Get a 205 GTi 1.9

James

GCollier

Bajie may well be right, with regard to the fact that it's called a limited edition keeping residuals high. This is my own gut feeling as well, when considering a brand-new example of each car. There are a couple of other points I'd also keep in mind though which may affect residuals:

1. Will P1 engines start going pop when they're run on 95RON fuel?
2. When will the new-shape impreza be released?
3. Year-old STi's seem to sell for around £20K. How big a price difference does there have to be to make someone take a second-hand grey over a P1?
4. I think at the end of the day there will be less Evo 6's in the UK than P1's, and so the Evo will be more exclusive.
5. The Evo you are considering has already done £5k of depreciating. I wouldn't think you'll lose more than another £1k in 6 months. The only Evo 6's I see advertised for under £25K seem to be non-Ralliart personal imports in white.

GCollier

I think the only differences in the Makinnen Evo 6 are cosmetic (red paintwork, different seats/dials and loads of stickers). I don't know whether Ralliart are importing them, but with the garish and brash looks of the car, you're probably appealing to a smaller market when you come to sell.

chrisp

EVO 6 wise you can get a new (grey import) for around 27K 'W' reg. There are a number of dealers offering these including Warrenders. Have a look on the autotrader site.


Park Lane have a 22B as well 38K 1998 S reg .

cheers

chrisp

Jonathan

Has to be the P1

Some points in reply to Mr Collier

1. If the engine goes bang, then its a warranty job. I think they might have it sorted for the VI and P1 - might eat my words in the months to come. In realtionship to the number of V's out there, the number of engine problems is still relativly small.

2. The new Impreza might get realeased at the same time as the EVO VII. Even then will it have 280bhp and be an official import - I doubt it and Ian said he only wants it for the summer.

3. Brand new STI VIs sell for 25k new now, but thats not stopped the P1 selling.

4. How many EVO VI's have Ralliart imported ? At least 750 isnt it (could be wrong), plus all the Greys. I'd bet at over a 1000. So more EVO's than P1's.

5. Grey import market seems more fickle than the UK cars. So what will an EVO VI be worth Nov time ?. Not just 1000ukp less. Does seem for such an exclusive car there are a lot of EVO VI's around. Still most seem to see the light

I dont think there will be a lot in it with depreciation. The P1 will be more exclusive, plus you get to meet and wave at other Scooby owners, and not have a major meet with Mr Bolton and his three Subaru jacket wearing mates. Additionally the car unlike the EVO is set up for the UK, sounds good. This eliminates the need to waste on a short term purchase new Suspension and a backbox.

The P1 IMHO will become like the Golf Anniversary editions the one to have in years to come.

At the end of it though it should be the car that sets your pulse racing that you buy.

Jonathan

PS The Makinnen has a new bumper as well.

TFyus

evo 6 EXTREME....limited edition total WAR BEAST.

the straight line power of a good cossie. the cornering capabilities beyond any standard subaru. the driver envolvement beyond any other car that is 4x4 that i know of.

Re-sale on the ltd edition sounds good. WHAT A BEAST THAT CAR LOOKS LIKE!!!!!

id have one over a cossie any day of the week unless it was car crushers black whale tail.

StevenRW proud rs owner

Nightmare

isnt it handy to have all this wonderful financial advice as well as car advice!!!

seeing as I can - heres my thruppence worth.

Both cars will lose money. guaranteed. I think though that the Evo will keep residual longer - just look at prices of the Evo V. Still very good. I have to say that the scoobs are losing out a little due to the 'Max Power' effect as discussed in another thread.

Houses. er...dont think they're 'as low as they're likely to be for a few years' Increases have slowed by several percent recently. It rather depends where you live as well. For example, in St Albans, house prices are still going up hugely, where as they've slowed a fair bit in Hampshire.

dot.com - stil fair few years 'gold rush' growth....but dont invest what you cant afford to lose!

wasnt that 'rocket science'

ha ha
Night

GCollier

Yep, to quote from the Times the other day "The time that every guy down the pub is investing in dot com companies is the time to get out." Some people are going to get badly burnt in the not too distant future.

My money is now going into established companies and blue chips, some of which are looking seriously undervalued.

Richard F

I work in Investment Banking (not rhyming slang) and I'm reasonably sure that the venture capital being poured into this .com stuff recently isn't going to continue. If you've got no profits, how are you going to repay the investment?

Whilst I do think that house prices are as low as they're gonna be for a while what I mean is that they're going to continue to rise (albeit more slowly). That's why I'd have said buy now if you're thinking about it. I simply don't believe you're going to see the massive fall of the early 90s. If you wait 6 months you just pay more. What's the point? Anyway, I guess at the end of the day it's whatever the poster wants that's more important. If you want a car get one, if not don't. I'd have thought you must have some idea which way you wanna go so do it.

See, I can do amateur psychology as well.

Shaun

Personally I would go for a EVO. As regards to the better car, I don't think anybody would disagree - especially if you have driven one!

Scooby's are good (I would'nt of brought one otherwise), but if you want the real cossie of the late 90's, go for the ***** out EVO.

As far as depreciation is concerned, there is obviously some people on this thread who have forgotten about the very, very, very limited run of 22B's. Just because the P1 may be classed as an exclusive run it does not mean it will hold it's value. The 22B is worth £10,000.00 less than when it was first released!!!!!!!!!!

GCollier

Jonathan,

I do appreciate that any engine failings would be a warranty job, but if widespread would be bound to influence residuals. This may be one reason why STI 5's seem to take such a depreciation hit.

I don't know how many cars Ralliart are bringing in, but I thought the figure was less than 500 (it certainly doesn't seem many, given the length of time they've kept me waiting). Bear in mind that IanF is considering a Ralliart car which will always be worth more than an import which is a darker shade of grey.

IanF said he would be happy with either car, and sought feelings on depreciation. So, why bother to mention about meets and waving at other subaru drivers? Neither affects residuals. Are you afraid that someone wants to be an individual and not a sheep? In fact, the way the impreza is heading, there are increasing numbers of owners I would rather NOT be associated with.

Gary.

sunilp

Buy a house first and then worry about cars.

Sunil the boring bean counter (but enough equity in his house to buy 5.5 P1's)

Reza

If the RB5 limited edition is anything to go by then the P1 should hold it's value quite well.

Richard F

Totally agree with Sunil. House prices are gonna continue to rise. I'd buy now when they're as low as they'll be for a while then if you want you can sell next year for a healthy profit (depending on where you are) and get a decent car then. After all, your house will probably cost more than a car so you would presumably want to reduce the outlay on that as much as possible. Short term car ownership is always a bad idea (I think) cos you get the depreciation and less time to enjoy the car. And you know you're only gonna have it for x months. Nope, go for the house.

GCollier

House prices continuing to rise? Yes, probably in the short term. I'm looking to move at the moment and a lot of estate agents I've spoken to think that prices (at least where I live in Kingston) are pretty much as high as they are going to go.

These things move in cycles. We are at a stage in some areas where it is considerably cheaper to rent a place than it is to buy. The price of some places have become so high, that it is nearly impossible for a lot of first time buyers to buy at all. If I was a first time buyer, I'd be very very careful about getting onto the property ladder at the moment.

DavidLewis

Put your money into a well chosen DOTCom company. When the value has trebled, sell very quickly, then buy the P1 the EVO AND a house

Richard F

I'd be REAL careful with a .com investment. I suspect the bubble will burst on that one very very soon...

IanF

Thanks for the advice everyone, and it is helpful to know people's view on the housing market.

I am in fact thinking that the Evo and P1, although affordable, may be a little too extravagant. I may opt for a neary new UK Impreza (God, I wish I hadn't sold mine!).

Still interested to hear people's views on the Evo and the P1 though.

With respect to the house, I am in the Thames Valley and everything is so expensive. I guess prices can't keep rising as quick as they have been, but I guess the question is will they fall?

I have a compnay Vectra V6 SRi which costs me nothing except for the taxable benefit. May be I should just be satisfied with that and not hanker after a 'supercar'

Regards
IanF

Jonathan

Shawn

You said anyone thats driven an EVO would go for one. Well I have and I havent gone for one. Some on the list went from a Scooby to an EVO and then back to a Scooby.

Its horses for courses. Both great cars with different personalities, good and bad points. For me its the P1. Still judging by the armed raid on Ralliart seems the safer car as well.

Jonathan

Nightmare

Ian,

NNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

fast cars good....
Vectras...bad

btw, with regards dot.coms... I wouldnt personally pay too much attention to everything being said in papers at the moment. The majority who write said columns are traditional brokers, who are losing a lot of business to internet based trading, and are desperate for people to come back to using them again.......only my opinion though

Adam M

I am going get blasted for this.

Buy the house, as above it appreciates, albeit more slowly.

Any brand new car will lose a load when you leave the showroom. Not woth it for six months.

Your house is more important. If you want to have, out 20K towards the house and buy a second hand caterham for th summer.

Or here it comes, 28K on the house and 2K ion aan old sapphire cosworth. They mayy not be the car that the subaru is but they are a lot cheaper and you can still go fast when it works, but only in a straight line.

Upto you ultimately, but the smart money would be on an appreciating commodity rather than a depreciating liability.

richards

Agree with Jonathan:

I owned an EVO6 for 5 months then swapped it for an STi5 Type-R V-Ltd because I didn't like the 'sitting-high-up-in-a-family-car-with-four-doors' feel of it!

(not to mention the soul-less engine note)

Then when I looked at an EVO6 last weekend (after 5 months of Impreza ownership) I 'wanted' to have one again but then when I drove it, I got that "family-car-feeling" again and hated it!

(not to mention the soul-less engine note)

So, I'd like the Impreza engine in the EVO body/chassis keeping it's excellent suspension and brakes. But most importantly, it's got to have the Impreza Type-R's diff lock control for the tail-happy antics!

Ian - about the car/house dilemma, buy the car if you're really obsessed by driving as you're only 'young' once, the reflexes are still good and what's the point of living if you can't enjoy yourself when you can, etc...

but, get the house now if all that's not important to you. The money that you lose when you sell the car is the price that you have to pay for enjoying your life.

To summarise:

1. If you put the money in the bank, then you lose nothing but you also gain nothing (much).

2. If you put the money into buying a car to enjoy yourself this summer then you gain enjoyment of your life.

3. If you put the money into buying a house then you get a roof over your head and as a bonus, that investment is also steadily growing, especially over the long term.

4. If you put the money into a couple of solid blue-chip shares now and take it out even in a few month's time, you'll most likely make a good 15% to 25% profit.

It's a difficult decision Ian but just go with what you want most out of life:

1. Security
2. Enjoying life to the full
3. Home comforts
4. Money

(with reference to the above decisions)

for me - it's all of the above!

Rich.

[This message has been edited by richards (edited 14-03-2000).]

AlexM

Move into a caravan and buy a Ferrari .

You will never loose money on property provided you don't pay way over the odds, and you can afford the mortgage. A car will always cost you shedloads of cash.

Of course, you know all of this already

Marc W

Spend the 2k you'd lose in depreciation on joining the Classic Car Club and spend the year swanning round in Ferraris, Porsches, Caterhams, Elises, Astons, etc.

I did.

Dropped a 996 back this morning. Awesome car.