Matteeboy

We've put the van on the market as we need a chunk of cash for a rather dull investment (yawn) - thinking of something roomy but fairly cheap and the Outback estate seems to be going for very little money used. I'm thinking well under £10k but nearer £5k.

I've done a quick search and there are some cracking examples for sale but the engine is clearly vital - the 3.0R, while fast, is just bonkers on tax and the M135i is our fast car; I'd have to go pre 2006 for one of these as I refuse to pay £480 in RFL! It's also very thirsty and not actually very quick.
The 2.5 petrol engine seems unpopular but cracking VFM - tax isn't too bad (£250ish) and I imagine it's bulletproof?
The diesel isn't as appealing but it's clearly great on fuel and low on emissions - but I don't want ANY diesel emissions rubbish ruining a car - are they reliable too? They are also a lot more to buy.

Any thoughts? The wife is not mad keen on the Forester TBH.

MOTORS S GT

iTrader: (2)

I had a Outback 2.5 auto petrol for years, did over 200,000 miles, towing rally cars on trailers etc, only issue is it did head gaskets at 125,000 miles, no big issue as they can be done without removing the engine.
Diesels suffer from crank failure, fairly common fault on early models, steer clear of them.
They do come with leather, heated seats etc, worth checking if the auto box has had the oil & filter changed frequently.
Otherwise a fairly bombproof car, & tows anything well, will do high twenties around town, low thirties on a run.

Matteeboy

Cheers for that; I'm a bit anti diesel anyway so I'd rather have something powered by the correct fuel.
Will see how we get on with the van sale (2011 VW California 180 4motion on 23.4k miles in case anyone's looking!); this should do the job without depressing us too much.

pacenote

The legacy estate is a great car and a good workhorse.

The 2.5 NA engine is a good reliable lump and I would recommend one of those over, say, a 2.0L petrol as those are pretty slow and thirsty.
Late 2009 Diesel's are ok and free from the crank issue mentioned in the post above. I had a 58 plate diesel that unfortunately had the crank issue.

Matteeboy

Cheers for that; useful info.

pflowers

How about a forester STI?

Matteeboy

It needs to be subtle; not a big fan of them either.

pflowers

I had a legacy 2.5 SE tourer for a while back in 2004, a nice car, if a little underpowered. Mine was a four speed auto which wasn't great. I think they changed to 5 speed later on, but I would still get the manual.

Personally I would choose a forester over an outback ( I've also owned a 2.5XT forester ) but if you need plenty of space above anything else then the outback is definitely a better option.

Matteeboy

It needs to be quite "different" from the M135i; so a big boot (so we can take it camping and/or fling a bike in the back), 4x4 (which the Forester clearly is too) and fairly comfy for long trips.

I think the Forester is just a bit small inside and the turbo'd ones are pretty thirsty. I won't totally discount them though as I do see the appeal.

Matteeboy

I have a feeling we might buy one then flog the van in Spring; awesome VFM!
I'm quite excited to be fully non diesel again and I can FINALLY use this forum (been here many years) with some conviction.
Weirdly, Outback prices seem to be keener than Legacy Estate ones.

Matteeboy

Okay, any chance of some pointers?

The 2.5 appeals because basically, it's unnappealing to most and so dirt cheap. A very cheap manual has come up on a 56 plate with 75k miles; it has the sunroof and leather but no nav.
However the diesel is hard to ignore; it's quicker, thrifty and cheap to tax but expensive to buy; especially as the advice above says it must be 2009 or later. However a few have come up that have a sunroof, xenons (anyone know what spec you need to get these?), etc. I'd also prefer a manual; is the auto hateful or not too bad?
I think the 3.0/3.6 is overkill as we have a quick car that's far less thirsty.

Did they get Bluetooth at some stage? How bad is the early nav?

Any expert advice welcomed. It appears to be a cracking used buy and I do trust them on reliability.

pacenote

The car I had was a Generation IV 2.0D R Estate (manual) The R trim level is the basic but mine came with electric pack ( electric/ heated seats/ front windscreen). Zenon headlamps were a standard fitment.

IIRC the RE trim level came with twin sunroofs and Leather and the REn had the added satnav. Can't comment on how good the nav is. Can't comment on the auto either as prefer manual because of the towing that I do.

The Generation V car was produced from mid 2009 and probably got over here in 2010. Trim levels are from S to SE navplus.

I have not driven a Gen V car but my Gen IV had a great chassis ( as you would expect from an AWD Subaru ) and with the diesel engine was capable of covering ground surprisingly quickly. However, because of the known issues with the diesel engine affecting cars built between 2007 and Feb 2009 and caused by an assembly fault during manufacture ( which mine succumbed to ! ) I would have to recommend a Gen V if going for the diesel.

Matteeboy

Cheers pacenote.

I'm checking out a 75k mile 56 plate 2.5 SE (estate) tomorrow - with a manual box. It's such a good price, I can't ignore it. Full sunroof, leather, climate, etc. Hopefully I'll be driving it home tomorrow - fingers crossed!

Time for some bargain motoring for a while!

pacenote

Sounds good

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

Loads of bargain OE parts here - impartsb46 on eBay (IM UK indisguise)

Matteeboy

Ideal; cheers!

hedgecutter

iTrader: (5)

Pacenote/Matteeboy....My gen iv Legacy Ren diesel was plated 10, so there were still a few around when the gen v came out. It`s a shame about the crank/bearing problems because it was a great drive, and a much nicer place to be than the gen v, which was slower, and didn't have frameless windows. Neither of them are that big, pretty similar to the Forester, and my family out-grew it.

Matteeboy

The latest (gen V?) does look pretty errmmm un-pretty. What were the designers thinking?!

Mad mission tomorrow - the van (2011 VW California 180 4motion) is going in for a roof corrosion issue (under warranty) in Westbury, a three hour drive . I then catch the train to Chepstow (2 hours) and get picked up by the dealer. I then hopefully buy the Outback and drive home in it. If it's too dodgy, I have to somehow get home on the train - a rather epic trip. Fingers crossed it's all okay!

LSherratt

iTrader: (1)

Good luck with it. I'm surprised to hear you're selling your VW though. I always thought that it was such a cool camper . You will miss it!

Matteeboy

Bought.

pflowers

Looking forward to the report and pictures

Matteeboy

Sadly it's gone dark but here's the dealer ad;

http://www.aeroautomotive.co.uk/showcar.php?id=1029

I'll give it some tlc and get some pics up ASAP.

Gave it quite a thrashing on our local roads home as well as the M5 and A30; definitely a competent chassis and a drivetrain that almost asks for bad conditions!

The engines nice; okay it's not exactly a road burner but it sounds good and the power delivery is totally linear. Pulls well low down too which surprised me.

It's incredibly light and airy; I do like frameless windows too!

Range said 400 miles when I filled up; definitely not a very frugal machine but then I won't be shelling out for DPFs, DMFs, EGR valves, etc every five minutes.

The bad points are; it has new front tyres but they are rather low rent; I'll match them up with the Yoko Geolanders shortly.
The rear seats have had a hard life; I should be able to rejuvenate them a bit (I have a garage full of detailing kit!).

Other than that, it all looks pretty straight, it's just had an oil/filter change, new MOT, new battery, the exhaust looked fine, the bushes felt solid, all electrics work, the sunroof is epic. Feel like I've got a real bargain (but ready to be told I was ripped off!!)! thanks hugely for your pointers all!

MOTORS S GT

iTrader: (2)

Glad you like it, quick warning about the Yoko geolanders, they are ok if fitted all round, in fact are very good, but if you pair them with a lesser budget tyre, say on the rear you end up with a oversteering monster on lift off into corners or roundabouts, the opposite if fitted the other way round, they understeer like hell.
My Outback was fantastic in snow, it was auto with the centre diff lock button.

Matteeboy

Cheers for that - maybe I'll match them up pronto.
Mine has a low range lever - no idea how it works but it looks fun!

pflowers

I get great satisfaction from buying a good used car, someone else has taken a big hit on the depreciation and with a bit of TLC you can improve the car and probably lose little if any money. In my experience, buy a good one and it should be just as reliable as any of the latest models.

This is something you just don't get buying new.

Matteeboy

The amount of warranty work our expensive new van has needed has disillusioned me a little. Probably £15Ks worth, probably been in for a total of three months in three years.

Touch wood, the BMW has been fine at a year old but it's now worth about four quid.

pflowers

I have a theory that if a car had made it as far as say 5 years 60k then all of the warranty / teething problems will have be resolved. Any car in the last 10-12 years should be good for 200k, so you only have consumables / brakes / clutch etc to worry about - which would apply to a new one too.

Plus there are plenty of specialists around who will do a much better job than a main dealer for much less money, these can be safely used without worrying about warranty claims.

pflowers

Oh go on then, I will give you a fiver to take it off your hands

Seriously though when you are ready to change it, please let me know - a well specced M135i is right up my street

Sad Weevil

iTrader: (1)

Most non turbo Subarus have this, I've got it on my '98 Forester. Low range is just that - gives you same 5 speeds, but lower ratio. Great for mud plugging and steep hill starts. You can change from high to low and back on the move, with a bit of coordination you can go from 1st low to 5th high through all 10 gears if you're a sad ex-trucker like me....
I had a '02 Outback H6 auto for a couple of years and 40,000 miles, it was 100% reliable, comfortable, practical, and very able in all conditions. The performance in deep snow with winter tyres was staggeringly good, and drove brilliantly on unmade roads. I only sold it as I had a severe classic impreza itch to scratch
Have you got the hill holder?

Matteeboy

Great info all; much appreciated.
After over 10,000 posts, it's about time I actually bought a Subaru.
The missus absolutely loves it; a lot tobe said for not worrying too much about a car!