Sub97

I know these threads seem to be taking over Other Marques recently, so sorry for another one!

I'm looking to change my CTR later in the year. I want something as fast if not faster, but a bit more grown up and classy inside and out. Tempted by a 335i or d or 645.

I'm not bothered by age on either, but would like to get something with <60k on it.

Anyone got any idea what sort of money I'd be looking at please? I know you can do a check on AutoTrader, but you can't get that good an idea of condition etc without looking at them in the flesh, and I'm not at that stage yet.

Equally, is a 330i that much slower than a 335i in the real world, and what sort of price difference do you think there is?

Thanks,

Steve

Matteeboy

Oldest you can go is 06 reg and a low spec model with 60k miles should be around £16-18k I reckon.

The engine depends on the kind of gearbox you like and whether you like turbos or not.

335i and 335d are both twin turbo and 335d is auto only. There are manual 335is around but they are VERY rare and often harder to sell.

i and d are similar performance wise (0.1s difference around Bruntingthorpe) - the i accelerates quicker but the d has more mid range punch.

The 330i is N/A so the power delivery is different - it's a slightly lighter can and there are more manuals about but it has a fair bit less torque than the 335i. However there are LOADS available so it'll be easier to get one for a good price. They have also been around longer. Much harder to tune though - the 335i and d can easily be mapped to silly power.

The 330i is a bit quicker than a CTR, a 335i or d are MUCH quicker ;-)

Which you get depends of whether you love easy, fast driving or prefer to work the engine. The petrols do sound better but the d still sounds suprisingly racey when pushed hard.

What shape would you consider?

All blend refinement and comfort with very impressive high speed composure extremely well.

nks

iTrader: (6)

This man talks sense^^^.

I have had the CTR and 330i back to back and the CTR is much quicker on a stint around the twisties but initial acceleration in the 330 leaves a CTR and from a standstill but the CTR claws back victory from 80-120.

I would personally not go for the 330i its slow, heavy and not a rewarding drive like the CTR. Go for a 335d with a re-map and enjoy the torque

hodgy0_2

good informative post Mattee, so where does the 335i fit in the range considering the M3

does the 335i take sales away from the M3?

Matteeboy

Hodgy - quite different cars really - M3 is much more "hardcore" - stiffer suspension, different shocks, bushes, quicker steering rack (I think), more "hardcore" gearbox, etc and a high revving 4.0L V8 vs twin turbo 3.0L straight 6.

Oddly both the 35i and M3 engines have the same torque but the M3 V8 is much revvier. 414bhp for the M3 vs 306bhp for the 35i engine but the latter is easier to drive in a more relaxed way thanks to the twin turbos.

Easy to map a 335i to M3 eating power and torque but it'll still be a "softer" car.

I should think the 35i has nicked a few sales from the M3 though - performance isn't a mile off and it's a lot cheaper to buy.

I do like the look of an M3 Coupe though. Perfect blend of aggression without going OTT.

The recent Evo test is quite interesting but can't find it - mapped 335i vs M3.

Sub97

Thanks very much for taking the time to write all of that Matteeboy.

I am after the latest shape 3 series, coupé variant.

I have had the CTR for 5 years this summer (started a family in the middle of that, which is why I've had to wait a while until swapping cars again!). I think I would rather save a bit longer and get something noticeably faster (335) than rush in and get a 330 and wish I'd waited once I'd got it...

Ideally, I would like a 335i I think, as like to work the engine (used to it with the CTR!). I would also prefer manual over automatic. Maybe that means I could get something a bit cheaper if they're the least popular...

Looking on Autotrader all the later shape 3 series coupés appear to be SEs. Are they more popular than the sports, or did they not come out as early?

Anyone recommend one over the other at all (coupe SE V coupe sport)?

mamoon2

In reference to the original post, my mate has just bought a 2006 330d. Very nice car but its not a 335d and I don't think it would satisfy me over a period of time. I don't think you would get bored of a 335d and if you did you could just re-map it.

With regards to the 335i v M3 debate, i'd personally prefer the softness of the 35i as stiff suspension can get right on my nerves sometimes. You can't beat comfort and power together and the 335d or the new 535d will defo be my next car when I get rid of the current motor.

Matteeboy

Sub - the Coupe SE is very well specced as standard - you get sports seats, M Sport suspension, angel eye xenons (I think) and some other goodies that SE saloons and estates don't get. TBH I think the Coupe looks better in SE form. The M Sport rear splitter hides the twin exhausts and looks a bit plasticky and I prefer the more robust looking SE wheels - beware the 230s which often come on Coupes though (19" five spoke that look great) - very prone to cracking.

Manual 335is are hard to find but they are one seriously good car.

Well worth changing to non run flats (which the M3/5/6 all have) - massive improvement in ride and the tramlining stops completely. Other than that, enjoy searching! Don't discount a sorted saloon though - which I reckon look better as M Sports.

john banks

I had thought that the 335i SE coupe was supposed to have less firm suspension than the Sport coupe but that might be US spec as I was reading their forums. SE apparently doesn't have as good oil cooling and the oil temp is marginal as stock, worth considering if you are tuning. Also the CO2 emissions for early vs late 335i cross the 225g/km threshold that approx doubles road tax. If it doesn't bother you it might affect the value of the car.

Matteeboy

Nope - UK spec SE coupe gets M Sport suspension as standard. It's an option (which I have) on SEs.

Not sure why the SE would have worse oil cooling?! Spoilers are a different shape but have pretty equal areas of air intake.

A small point - heard of a few issues with 335i engines (mostly in the US) - not heard of any on the 335d - I'm sure there have been some with issues but they seem pretty robust.

Terminator X

iTrader: (7)

It's a no brainer surely, the M3 is a V8

YouTube - Fifth Gear BMW M3 (E92)

TX.

john banks

Matteeboy, I think the coupe or saloon SE package in the US is 17s, approx 130mph speed limiter, softer suspension and no extra oil cooler. Sport is 18s, 155mph speed limiter, M-sport suspension and an oil cooler. There are other differences between auto and manual too. The oil cooler differences were not noted in sales literature. I suppose we can hope that UK 335is with 155mph limiters will have the extra oil cooler. Too long ago now to find the links, but the sport coupe 335i I tested had the oil cooler as I checked for the extra pipes at the top left of the engine bay. I think I was within £200 of doing a deal on it, but they wouldn't budge until I left and then they rang back an hour later, by then I'd had time to question it more too.

Sub97

Thanks for the feedback guys.

What is the difference between the SE and Sports spec then? If you get the sports seats and sports suspension on the SE? I always thought that and the body kit were the only differences anyway - plus wheels I suppose..

Matteeboy

Sub - off the top of my head the M Sport Coupe gets these over the SE:

M Sport interior including black headlining (which I don't like), M Sport steering wheel and gearshift ****, M Sports bodykit (front and rear spoiler plus slightly bigger sills), M Sport wheels (I prefer SE wheels which also don't fall to bits). That's it I think. The difference is tiny.

On a saloon or touring there are more differences:

"staggered" 18" wheels (225/35 rear, 225/40 front as opposed to 17" 225/45 all round), sports seats, the same interior tweaks, M Sport suspension, spoilers and M Sport sills.

In touring and coupe I prefer the SE. In saloon I prefer the M Sport.

Be careful with wheel size too - go too big and the ride really suffers. Got 17" star alloys on mine with non run flats and I'd think you'd struggle to get a better ride from a 3 series. Sports suspension helps on the corners (I have it) but the SE is still fairly firmly sprung - obviously the coupe has it anyway.

Sub97

Not much for 2k on list price then!

Was just checking, as with the previous 3 series and current 5 (which my brother has), there seemed to be a fair bit of difference in the SE and M Sport. Particularly the 5 series. I think the SE looks awful and the Sport looks really nice..

Matteeboy

Agreed - my inlaws had a 535d SE Touring and it looked pretty cr4p especially as it was the hideous "Barbara red!" A black M Sport 5er looks pretty good in Touring or Saloon form.

Sub97

Yeah, my brother went from a silver 530d SE to a dark blue (almost black) 530d M Sport. The difference, for what in effect is the same basic car, was amazing IMO.

Matteeboy

The M Sport on the 5er also helps hide/disguise/take attention away from those rather odd Dame Edna Everage lights too!

zip106

Yay. Carbon black with 19" 's is where it's at for the 5 er's.

Matteeboy

But it must NOT be these mingers:

zip106

Now come on Matt, what exactly is minging about those?
Hardly like some **** poor after market TSW's, now is it?

BMW never did any others any other 19" and they were the only option when new.



Buggers to clean though!

Matteeboy

Oops...!

They look like a kitchen device to me.