scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

Right,

So ive been looking for a nice m3 for a while, around 16k, taking my time. Was a big toss up between that and a tvr. the tvr lost after lots of research.

Now i was driving to work today and was behind a gorgous 02 porsche. Quick look on piston heads and u can pick up a 99 c2 911 with 50-70k on the clock for a similar price.

Wonder if anyone has experiance of the two?

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

Porsche : Porsche 911 996 Carrera 2s Tiptronic,54k Turbo Styling for example

http://pistonheads.com/sales/1461744.htm
http://pistonheads.com/sales/1469108.htm +CSL rims
http://pistonheads.com/sales/1438337.htm for example

stilover

1998 911's never had 320bhp. More like 286bhp. That 911 looks a bit odd to me. C4S front bumper, GT3 alloys. To me it doesn't look right, and his write up looks a little desperate. 100% rear wheel drive? to most C2's secretly have 4WD?

Do you need more than 2 seats? If so, M3.

The 911 is higher milage than the M3's, and thus more could go wrong with the 911. Porsche parts wil be expensive.

Both will cost about the same to run and insure.

Come selling on time, the 911 will have even greater miles, and could put people off.

Out of the 2 options? I'd say M3.

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

yeah above urls just examples

I think id get a much better m3 for the money than the 911. perhaps still stick to m3 plan then when i grow up a bit get a 911 when i can afford a 20k+ example.

RobEvo5

iTrader: (9)

My brother has a 996 as daily commute car, and a couple of my mates have E46 M3's. Last year we went to le-man with these along with some other cars, and we all chop and change passenger and sometime driver seats along the way.

996 nice car, but basic interior and a bit clunky, goes pretty well with 286bhp but very linear and doesn't feel quick at all. However it does cover ground quickly and capable of 160+ MPH. Its a nice car but its all about the badge IMO. The E46 M3 is a far better car in every respect IMO, and a fair bit quicker both in stright line and in the twisties and the cabin is a very nice place to be.

Thats said perhaps I'm a wanabe snob, but I would stil have a 996, as its not all about speed and handling for me these days.

Also note the 996 had engine issues, get yourself on the forums. When/if the engines go, they generally can't be rebuilt, they need replacement engines which is serious wonga.!

stilover

E46 M3's have engine issues too. Think it's the Valves or somethink.

zip106

Yes they can.
Hartech in Bolton can rebuild one with strengthened internals for way less than a secondhand engine with no history with it.
Even if the nikasil liners have cracked/crumbled, they can still rebuild.

If you're going to buy what was essentially a £70k - £80k car when new, you shouldn't expect to run it with the bills of a £10k Fiesta.

Anyway, the first of the 996's in 1998 had 300 bhp as standard.

Jimpreza

I think it's the VANOS that goes mate and can be expensive.

Matteeboy

Isn't VANOS trouble more of an E36 M3 issue?

RobEvo5

iTrader: (9)

Vanos issues are only with the E36 and Doctor vanos can sort these now for sensible money.

The E46 is pretty much bullet proof. The early ones did have a big end issue, but this was covered under a factory BMW recall. Rear springs break on all of them, but apart from that bullet proof cars and engines.

996 engine was the weakest of the lot. The earlier 993 aircooled 911's are a much nicer car IMO, looks similar easier and strong to up keep. But the 993's demand a premium price.

1001

not a problem on E46's just make sure the 1200mile running in service has been done and if its pre 2003 the the engine upgrade has been done... bottom end re-call....

billythekid

I am a big porsche guy, but at that money I would have to question the purchase myself.

For starters, the 996 is the "worst" 911.

Of all the P cars you can buy the 996 would be quite low down my list - unless it was a GT3 or turbo.

If I was buying a 996 I would be putting £25k into the car.

The 3.6 engine is known for being a tad ropey. Dont get me wrong 99% of cars will be fine - but if they go - they go big time.

What ever 996 you get I would have a £3k slush fund on hand.

993 prices reflect this. All but the dregs are over £25k. And a nice one will set you back £30k. Lots and lots of 996s below these prices.

I think a better option would be a 2.7 987. A bad time to buy (spring) as the prices are firm, but if you put an extra £2k onto your budget you could do it quite easily.

I think it would be more reliable, probably 99% as quick in the real world and will be cheaper to run.

I had a Boxster before my 911 and I really enjoyed it.

Having thought about a 911 for a couple of years the decision I made in the end was that you cant go "cheap" on these cars. And now I have been running one for a while I can tell you thats about the case.

I think the Boxster would give you the best bang for your buck.

HTH

Brun

Regardless of how bad the 996 might be, i couldn't even think about a boxster as an alternative.
The box may be a fantastic car in it's own right, but if you are considering a 911 to start with then it just won't cut it

Trout

iTrader: (1)

I have owned a 993 C2 and I think it exemplifies the problem with the standard 911s - which is exactly what is said above.

The basic aspirated 911 (993 and 996) are just so capable, linear and are powered well within their limits that they can feel less than exciting. They are very quick though, deceptively so and will cover huge distances in great comfort.

A 993 is a better long term prospect, but will cost a lot more. I sold one nearly five years ago now and I am sure it would be worth more now than when I sold it. It had had seven owners in seven years (and I owned it for two) and still sold easily at advertised price. A 996 would struggle.

Running costs are about the same or even slightly less than the BMW - unless something goes badly wrong. Porsche parts are eye wateringly expensive - I speak from experience!

The Boxster is a good buy, but a completely different car. Evo did a test a couple of years ago and almost all drivers were quicker on track in a Boxster than an 911 - but all wanted to own the 911!

Timwinner

iTrader: (3)

911 everytime, as above now I won a porsche can confirm the spares are pricey but an M3 at 17k now is an old bmw worth 4k at best in 10 years time, A 996 at 17k now is a 996 at more or less the same money in 10 years time.

A BMW might have more gadgets etc but the feeling of owning and driving a Porsche is like nothing else.
If you were looking at a 10k 996 I would question why it was so cheap and over look it but if the money is right 996 have just about bottomed out, some are saying they bottomed out a year or two ago and they are on the way back up, and 911 history shows this is always the case, for me it would be the Porsche every time.

An M3 can go past me and I will think wideboy or 318 with an Mtec kit, If a 911 goes past you know its a 911.

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

Just popped on 911 forum for more advice.

Just found out my workmate has one lol.

RS Grant

Whats a decent Porsche UK Forum to use, something along the lines of Scoobynet/Passionford would be brilliant. I wouldn't mind doing a bit of reading up on them either, just out of interest more than any immediate desire to buy one.


Cheers,
Grant

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

911uk.com seems fairly decent. Only one ive looked at. still reading up myself.

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

Well.

Thought i would post an update.

Test drove a couple 991 c2's on the weekend. And i can fairly say i can ruel them out. Their just not pokey enough, dated inside, and bad driving position for someone 6'1 which surprised me. IMO the m3 beats it hands down in alot of areas.

So 911 rueled out!

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

oh and my scooby will be for sale by the end of the day

RobEvo5

iTrader: (9)

Exactly what I found. Was very dissapointed with both the 964 I owned and a later 996 I drove. They are all about the badge and turning heads IMO. As a car there are far better cars out there for allot less money as well.

AsianGunner

iTrader: (7)

Very good thread, sorry for bring up an oldies, well not that old, I'm pretty much heading for the exact same situation as Scoobyc.

Scoobyc did you end up getting the M3? i'm going to go down the same route as you and go for test drives etc.

I too am 6'1 and am now worried after reading your line about the seating position :-( mentally im setting myself as getting a porsche just because i love them so much and its one of them things i just want to do in my life

Terminator X

iTrader: (7)

If you can afford a 911 you'd be not to IMHO.

TX.

Edit - argh, thread brought back from the dead!

MMT WRX

I'm in a similar position although I'm holding out for a turbo which has a totally different engine. I've driven both 996 turbo and a 997 C2 and can easily fit in both and I'm 6' 2". Imo the turbo is a different animal altogether than either the 996/997 C2/4's. Where the turbo feels like a rocket the n/a 997 feels quite sluggish.
Also the engine issues mentioned earlier affects the n/a 997 and Boxster, just as much as the 996 as I think they are essentially the same engines.
If you go to the Hartech site you'll find plenty of information.

AsianGunner

iTrader: (7)

Cheers MMT, yeah i'm looking around on 996 forums and they are loaded with info. Hartech is very well regarded.

You lucky bugger being able to go for a Turbo...
My budget will probably be just about enough to cover my for a decent 996.

I can't wait to get a test drive in either a 996 or 997, any idea's of good places to go down in the south east....

Stealth

iTrader: (4)

I had to make the same decision two months ago, and I ended up going for the M3, it had more toys, the interior is far nicer, car is more reliable and IMHO looks prettier... well more aggressive!

The Porsche was cheaper to insure and cheaper to service amazingly!!

The Porsche Tip box is very lazy, not for people that like to drive and the front end feels light....

M3 all day long chap

AsianGunner

iTrader: (7)

Cheers Tony, i got some really bad news about my scoob, after all the joy of finally getting the car exactly how i wanted it, its all ended horribly...... i'll drop ya a PM

Stealth

iTrader: (4)

Oh mate nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, what on earth happened?!?! Drop me a pm fella!

You are more than welcome to have a blast in my //M before you buy one if you like

MMT WRX

These seem to be the most respected Porsche dealers. Also, pop over to Pistonheads and have a look at the specific Porsche forum and have a look at the classifieds.

Pistonheads Porsche forum

Pistonheads classified

http://www.used-porsche.co.uk/

http://www.jzmporsche.com/

http://www.rsjsportscars.co.uk/

http://www.portiacraft.com/default.asp

http://www.911virgin.com/

http://www.paragon.gb.com/

HTH
Mick

Edit: Ive picked you one Makes the M3 look a bit girly

zip106

You can't beat a bit of Pork.

Well, turbo'd Pork anyway.

I was very close this week to chopping mine in for a 997tt, but after looking into it I realised that for an extra £35k I wasn't going to get an extra £35k worth of car.

You won't be able to run it on a tight budget (not saying that was your intention) - I'd say you should put aside £1500 - £2k for repairs/running/servicing in your first 18 months.
As MMT says , do your homework on these and if you get a good one, not much can touch it for the feel good factor.

Oh, I'm 6' 4" and have absolutely no problem fitting.

Good luck