The Chief

Ever since i got rid of my Scooby i've hankered after a car that is cheaper to run, arguably sharper handling and quick. I change my mind almost on a weekly basis to what i want but have always liked the Civic Type R but peoples views on lack of torque have really put me off.

Following on from the other thread i pulled out an old Autocar the other night and was taken by surprise reading the peformance figures of these.

Ok i dont really take much notice of 0-60 times but 30-70 through the gears and 50-70 in top i think (for me) is important.

Anyway have a butchers and see what you think, i've compared a few comparable cars to the civic although not 300bhp+ Scoobs and Evo's as they are in a different league and not comparable to a hot hatch.

................ 30-70mph 50-70 in top

Civic Type R 6.0 secs 8.9 secs
Audi S3 (old) 6.2 secs 7.7 secs
Bmw 330Ci 6.1 secs 8.3 secs
Nissan 350z 5.4 secs 8.2 secs
Boxster 2.7 5.9 secs 8.5 secs
Octavia vrs 6.3 secs 9.1 secs
Clio 255 5.8 secs 8.4 secs
Subaru WRX 5.8 secs 9.6 secs

So i think the CTR squares up quite nicely, only the 350z trounces it through gears 30-70mph and even though it is second last in the 50-70 in top it doesn't do too badly especially where i'm comparing the CTR with big engines or turbocharged cars, admittedly the WRX wouldn't be even getting going but neither is the Civic.

Thought i'd share this info.

Thinking of a test drive

Harryr34

iTrader: (9)

My last car was a ctr, i wouldn't call it gutless! A very fun drive but have a look at the integra dc5 as it has an lsd, recaros and imo is better looking - they have dropped in price alot recently!

djmisio85

Which civic type R are we talking about? the hatch, or the new sedan?

The new sedan type R is amazing

Also Harryr34, the DC5 looks great just a shame the performance doesnt quite match its looks......or any other type R's.....

RS Grant

My sister has an 06 EP3 CTR and its not gutless at all IMO, definitely worth a drive if you haven't already, a simple induction and exhaust combination transforms it from being quiet and boring sounding to a more purposeful sounding machine.

If you can insure a DC5 Integra for reasonable money and dont mind the drawbacks of space in the Coupe over the Civic hatch... then go for it, as said, the LSD, Recaros and extra oomph make it better value for money... plus it isn't as common on the roads as the Civic.


Cheers,
Grant

Harryr34

iTrader: (9)

I had an 04 ep3, the dc5 is no slouch! Having driven both, If insurance is reasonable i would recommend it over an ep3!

The Chief

These figures are for the early 'bread van' shape

richs2891

Its the one thing that always make me laugh on Scoobynet the blinkered views of many people - ie MX-5 are hairdressers cars etc and Honda CTR's have no torque - compared to a turbo car yes they are a little lacking but compared to a NA engine they probably have the most in the 2.0 litre class.
Any before anyone asks I've owned a MX-5 and enjoyed it - great car to drive, had a CTR (bread van type) as well as the scoobies !
But would try and either go for a DC5 or a CTR with a limited slip diff as makes the world of differance.

Not having a go at you Chief - just a general rant at those who havent even bothered to drive the cars.

Richard

The Chief

No worries mate.

I've been guilty of that, i used to slag off Porsche Boxsters, hairdressers cars blah, blah, i laughed at my mate when he bought one, then i drove it and soon shut up!

billythekid

I had a CTR for a couple of years and its fine, IMHO. I did not spend much time below 6000rpm anyway!

mrtheedge2u2

I dont think that view is soley down to scoobynet..... i think it is a view held world wide

The Chief

Lol

Yeah i think you cant be lazy with this sort of car, you have to take it by the scruff of the neck and thrash it within an inch of its life

172sport

iTrader: (6)

A mates just had his supercharged, hows 313bhp grab you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Devildog

Good info

I've been saying the same for years

Harryr34

iTrader: (9)

I was looking for a 98 spec JDM DC2 as i wanted to have a forged engine built and have it turbo charged A friend owned a turbo Integra a little while back and it was awesome would still like to do that one day but i don't think i'll have the cash for a while

I couldn't find a decent example hence me buying a Impreza which i am very happy with

Robert Rosario

Had one myself for two years and loved it. Honda reliability, cheap and polite dealer network, quick, predictable, very practical, great car.

Although mine was red, I do like the "cosmic" grey, which is a bit Rodney Trotter, but looks fantastic when clean!

davedipster

I had a CTR new when they came out, milano red lovely car. Kept it for 2 years cos to be honest I found it rather gutless and tiresome after a while. When carrying 2/3 passengers it was embarrassingly slow!

Dipster

lozgti

I've never seen one going anywhere slowly

zip106

I also had one for about 18 months a few years ago.
Build quality was superb, dealers good and servicing fairly cheap.
I did find I was constantly ragging it to get the full potential but to be honest, the only down side for me was the poor steering feel.
Horrible electro assisted power steering.

phil_wrx

iTrader: (2)

straight into the central reservation in the wet silly power on front wheel drive

cwt

iTrader: (19)

I have a Scoob which i love in Everyway.
My partner drives a civic type r and i have been driving it this week love it no worries about warming up cooling down det diff,s special fuel and all that.
Very light car feels such an occasion when i drive it steering feel off dead centre is great, the scoob grips very well but i find the civic grips and handles well too.
We took it out to the ring last month and found it great for every reason and got there on a tank of fuel.
My thoughts any way.

cwt.

webby v7 slipperwagon

iTrader: (2)

I've had an Accord type r and found it nothing special untill i got into the top end screemer rev band and then fantastic and what a sound but, still a very short band to be in. Flogged it bought a civic 2002 type r and found it much better but after a while very tiresome car. Having to sit at the top of the rev range all the time is great on a track, but how many tracks do you drive everyday. It's a fantastic engine, not sure about the box and the high driving position and the on the edge handling. But really how often do you exploit that. Great car but, too much hard work having to work it hard to get the best out of it. If you like constant frenetic driving then great, but i think you'll soon tire of it.But if you are determend to get one, buy an integra instead, same crazy power band, but a very special car, and i dont think you'll tire of one.

ScoobyJawa

Theres plenty of 300+ bhp Focus ST's around and the new RS coming, they have no problems putting the power down (once you're out of first anyway!! )

markymark34

a 300bhp Focus does have difficulty putting the power down! not just in first in second and third as well.
New RS has an advanced front suspension setup to attempt to get round the problem. A 300bhp+ type r must be close to undrivable (on a twisty road anyway)

51st state

weres this one going chef

if your looking at another car there are 2 cars in that list that are miles ahead on cheap fun and reliablility
honda civic and octavia vrs

the rest are highest tax band or reliability isn't as good(some slightly overrated)
and you've missed out the honda integra or a bwm M3(e36)

if you want to be the fastest thing off the lights buy a drag car

172sport

iTrader: (6)

It should be progressive given the supercharger, no nasty turbo lag there, time will tell though with bad weather now here. lol

ScoobyJawa

Ok so I'm around 275bhp and its no issue at all, others over on FocusSTOC.com have 300 or above and say they have no probs. Also Quaiffe LSD makes a massive difference. 300bhp and FWD is not an issue if its been done correctly.

The Chief

Howard - I've discounted the Octavia, i want something a bit sharper round the twisties, not really want a saloon thats slower than the Honda.

Besides after my history with turbo cars i need something a bit more bullet proof!

rickya

iTrader: (18)

I had a 350z Gt before my Spec C & Iv regulary borrowed my cousins 2004 CTR. Theres no comparison IMO between the CTR & 350z, the 350z is leagues ahead in terms of power; torque; driveability & slightly better in terms of handling. Not to mention how much fun the RWD chasis is on the zed compared to the slightly understeering FWD CTR. Im not even gona start on the fact that you have to keep the revs above 7k all the time while trying to drive fast in the CTR. Apologies to CTR owners & fans!

Though I do think the Integra DC5 is a different kettle of fish

The Chief

I've drove neither so cant comment, but certain cars feel faster than they are i.e. Scoobs, i'm going off Autocars test results plus i was comparing cars that in peoples eyes would think are miles faster, at the end of the day a 350z is a big lusty V6 Coupe and a CTR is a hot hatch, i thought it would destroy the CTR and in fact it may - like i said i'm going off Autocars figures not seat of the pants experiences.

rickya

iTrader: (18)

In Feb this year my mate with his DC5 (some suspension mods) & me in my 350z Gt went to Donnington. I consider myself to be a good driver & he is probably of similar abilities to myself. But on Donningtons twisty circuit I was being outbraked into corners & outhandled through the corners by his DC5.

It really depends what you are looking for, if your not doing too many trackdays & want a comfortable cruiser you cant go far wrong with the 350z. I also recall getting better mpg in my 350z than in my cousins CTR!