BrettC

Hi All

Some of you may remember that about 6 weeks ago I went to the dark side and bought an Evo IV. Anyway, as much as I love how the car goes, stops, and changes direction I just can't live with its lairy looks. (Yes, perhaps I am getting on a bit).

After 6 weeks and after spending about £2000 on the car since purchasing it I have already sold it. It just was not for me. An expensive car buying mistake but don't get me wrong, what a great car to drive.

What I am after is something the does everything that the Evo could but to look at it you would never know.

My budget is a maximum of £8000.

Cars I have considered already:

Subaru legacy RSK B4
BMW Alpina
Honda's type R.

I've also considered a scooby Sti wagon, but it is still a bit of a theft magnet.
Also considered Saab Aeros and spending a bit on it but it will never be like the evo.

Have considered an integrale, audi quattro, but getting a bit old now.

The car does not have to be practical at all as it will just be for fun. 2 seats is not a problem. So would consider a lotus Elise (just in budget) although is this also very showy, im not sure?!

Anyone think of anything else? (remember its also got to handle well hence blowing out the saab idea)

thanks all

Brett

Brendan Hughes

The ultimate sleeper usually has an engine transplant (and thus often brakes, drivetrain etc as well). Disads are crazy insurance costs and usually amateur handling. Could you live with that, or do you just want something where you can remap the turbo/SC?

Impreza with Sport bonnet and FMIC might be OK.

alloy

How about a MR2 or E36 M3?

Andy M3

I would have this little number - not sure whether it is too in your face

http://www.petrolheads.co.uk/sales/60216.htm

Or my mate is selling his unbelievably mint Volvo V70R manual. This is the one with all the spec and a standard LSD [2wd]. In addition it has undergone some engine modification in 2005 and is producing 265 WHP and 400 nm.

http://www.volvot5.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=7061

BrettC

Thanks guys

Brendan: had sort of considered a hybrid but like you say the insurances costs were crazy. Would consider something that can just have replacement ECU etc but nothing external.

alloy: E36 M3...am I completely out of touch, or going to far the other way after evo IV ownership but I would never have said an M3 was a sleeper. Do you disagree?

Admittedly this is probably an odd question to post on SN. But I just got fed up going out for a late night drive in the Evo, not driving fast or even particularly enjoying the car just a cruise, no music blaring out or anything, yet it was still like a red rag to anyone remotely in a bad mood or young lads in saxos with tinted windows wanting to race me all the time.


.......scoots off to get pipe and slippers.

Brendan Hughes

Talking of which - an old Merc, the big two-seater cruisers circa early 90s? Can't you get one of them with a 5 litre engine?

Reffro

C36/C43 AMG might suit.

alloy

I agree not the most discreet , but with a debadge it is more subtle than any evo or scoob and still retains an entertaining amount of performance whilst being in your price bracket just a suggestion

BrettC

Andy M3

E30 M3.....interesting!! I actually do think it is in your face but not in the same way as the evo. What are they like to drive? They are under 200bhp arent they?

Appreciate how good volvos are but I'm a Saab fan! Sounds pretty awesome though.

BrettC

Sorry guys, no mercs and no autos. How awkward am I being???

alloy: Don't get me wrong mate, I love M3s (who wouldn't).

Would an M3 not provoke the same sort of response from some people as the Evo did though?

Andy Tang

iTrader: (3)

The only problem is that the only people who would appreciate it or think it's discrete is another Subaru (probably only Impreza turbo) owner. To anyone else, it's "one of those Subarus".

BrettC

Nat21

Ohh, I forgot about the saloon without the rear spoiler. mmm very interesting...could a good one be within my budget though?

I was looking at M3s before I bought the evo and I failed to find a really nice car hence going down the evo route.

alloy

I was thinking of the saloon M3 in dark green
There is one round where i live and it doesn't stick out at all, just looks like every other bmw to the average person.

Jamescsti

VOlvo V70 T5 is the way forward I think?

BrettC

alloy

sorry mate, the image of an m3 to me is the coupe with the spoiler and front splitter etc. I completely forgot about the saloon.

Are the saloons just as good as the coupe? or are they a little heavier, slower more body roll etc?

I still really like scooby wagons but they still have a bad press like most scoobs nowadays.

Would a non-evo m3 be a fair match for a mitsy evo? I would have thought the mitsy evo would definately have the edge point to point cross country but would it be by a lot?

BrettC

jamescsti

Can't do volvo. Like I said, good cars but I would get a Saab 9-5 Aero first.

alloy

I don't know a great deal about their handling capacity, but rwd and a fair bit of grunt should make for a sporty drive with a little tail action. I would have thought the evo would have the edge point to point, but i should imagine that the M3 wouldn't be too far behind. A chip would see a few extra horses and liven up responsiveness

I quick example http://www.redevom3.co.uk/productssimple0.html Even with the boot spoiler, it doesn't scream attention!

Andy M3

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member...65_17_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member...65_18_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member...65_19_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member...65_20_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member...65_21_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member...65_22_full.jpg

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member...65_23_full.jpg

This was my baby. It was a regular M3 with 200hp in 1985. I had it on the rollers to ensure all was well and managed 198hp. The car itself is awesome to drive, like nothing else you have driven. The whole car feels like a road going racer. The dogleg gearbox and long 1st gear means it isn't the fastest of the traffic lights, but once up into 2nd it is quick enough - 15-15.5 sec 1/4 mile and I had mine up to 250 KMH on the clock. Fuel consumption is good at 25-29 mpg and midrange torque is good for such a highly strung 4 pot.

The LHD doesn't take much getting used to, but naturally causes problems when over taking, but I managed to keep mine on the road.

Handling wise it is very good, but I had a tank slapper moment in it once, but it is quite controllable - just don't slick the tyres on it

The issues with buying them are where it came from - UK is best, but mine was a German which is fine. US versions were not great and I think there was a Cypriot version !?!? Either way stick to German / UK model.

The timing chain needs replacing at circa 100k and this costs thousands of pounds. Budget £2k-£3k. If the just has not been done - adjust the price accordingly. £6k as cheap as the reasonable ones get. £8 - £10k for a nice M3 are a reasonable Evo. A 2.5 Evo sport will be £15k +.

The rest is obvious. Look out for rust, accident damage. The only other major issue is the steering rack - which is a £500+ job to replace. They wear out if the car has had a hard time. Engine / gearbox are usually reliable, but sound a bit rough.

They do have a LSD as standard, but not leather or electrics !!!

I do not regret anything about the car - it was fantastic, and cost £900 fully comp for me and my Mrs when I was 22 y/o.

P.S PM me your email if you want a phone vid clip of me doing a 0-1?? run - sounds brilliant.

Brendan Hughes

E30 M3s are supposed to be a track car of choice on SN, so I'd imagine they're fantastic drivers' cars, even if they don't wipe the floor with modern machinery in the performance stakes. Do you want to go fast, or just to feel fast?

Wouldn't call it a sleeper though. Saloon E36 M3 would be good for that.

BrettC

Andy M3

That looks one very well cared for m3 mate. Looks great.

I love the idea of one I'm just concerned about the age of the car now as well as the associated high maintenance costs. I know you don't get something for nothing but the age is bothering me a bit.

I might have a look around though to see whats about.

Not sure the E30 is for me, but I would still love to see the video clip. If its no bother please email it to me. You have PM.

cheers

brett

BrettC

BH

I would imagine the E30 M3 is awesome on track like you said.

I'm having a look around for a E36 M3 saloon.

As for 'go fast or feel you are going fast'....I think the key to this is either so long as its fun.

scoobynutta555

The simplest option has already been mentioned. For evo like performance and sleep looks just get an older sti, slot in a FMIC, slap on a plain bonnet, get rid of any extra skirting trim spoilers etc, downgrade any exterior "performance" extras to non turbo items such as exhaust alloys etc.

Isnt there an Impreza turbo that comes with no skirts and rear spoiler anyway? An old RA or something, they were all in white IIRC.

You would end up with something that looks and sounds identical to the most base crappy Impreza you could ever find. Yet with less weight and bog standard looks you'd stealth your way past anything.

It's something I've been thinking about doing sometime in the future

BrettC

Any idea of the cost involved for doing this? Bear in mind that most of it I would have to get done professionally.

Brendan Hughes

The amount of Jap imports around and the crap market, I'd look to see if someone hasn't done it already and is selling

BrettC

good point.

chris singleton

Friend of mine who's well known on here did exactly this - old Type RA, no rear wing or tarty bits but with approx 500 odd BHP on tap Awesome bit of kit

chris singleton

Forgot to say, he sold it last year and was within your budget, I think you'll be had pressed to find another as most people go for the big spoiler look.

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

What about one of the old C-Class Merc Cosworths????

BrettC

Chris. I know mate, there must be something wrong with me not wanting the car to have lairy looks. That RA sounded perfect!

BD, not a big fan of mercs mate. thanks for the suggestion though.