J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Which one would get your vote ?

I am currently leaning towards the Focus but the Astra is hard to ignore with 240 bhp and the Golf (based on tradition) may not have the most power or the biggest wow factor but is probably the best long term place to put your money, Volkswagen do the all round package quite well (Mk1 and MK2 Golfs I mean).

The Focus is the cheapest, starting at 17,495 which is mega value, the Astra starts at 18,495 and the Golf 19,995.

There's always the Leon Cupra R, Civic Type R I suppose but they are old news nowadays however good they may be.The Mini Cooper S is too small and trendy to be a proper hot hatch, plus it only has 170-ish bhp. Audi's are too expensive and grown up, Alfa's fall apart and depreciate horrendously, Fiat dont do anything worth a w4nk these days, neither do Nissan or Toyota, Subarus are well covered on here so I will leave them out.

Its all good news though, Hot hatch entry level is now 200 bhp !

davyboy

Focus ST in the bright metallic Orange.

MR CTR

Well I currently own a Civic Type R but as soon as I've worked for Ford for six months (car sales) I'll be getting an ST 3 Focus (£19,500 list price) because with the staff discount I can pick one up for £14,500!!!! Now that IS a bargain! Even without that discount I would still probably go for one because it just has that classic old fast ford feel about it.


Not sure about the mad orange colour though. I'm thinking imperial blue or even rally slag white. Can't wait till I get one in my show room. Bit better to look at than 1.25 Fiestas. Should make a nice 5 cylinder burble too.

R1916v

What would I choose, tough one.

I did test a Megane 225 cup that was actually bloody good, I was expecting a soft hatch with a bit of poke but it was really really good to drive and went pretty quick as well. Handling though was very nice, and the nice brembo 4 pots

Whatever I'd chosen it'd need to not handle like a boat and have a nice blower on it

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Forgot about the 5 cyl bit and the Megane, is that engine an evolution of the unit found in the T5 ?

scoobyjimbo

[QUOTE=J4CKO]Which one would get your vote ?

Astra without a doubt... I never thought i was say this but i have reasons.
I have driven the golf at a vw demo day, nice car, good build quality, not bad in terms of pace, but then i drove the astra the other day on a vuax demo day i was blown away, i have owned a civic type r and this astra blows that away and with the price it is the bargain of the century and now the astra even looks the part. It handles well and i threw it around donnington and it handled like a dream, it has so much power and it just keeps coming, i was impressed. I cant speak for the ford but i have had a focus rs for a few days and i was impressed with it but always thought that it wasnt the finished article, the new st might well be that car but i dont like the look of the new focus. I reckon vaux have at last found themselves a performance icon, go have a go you wont be disapointed IMHO
J

Stryder

Go for the Astra VXR. I think there is nothing better looking in the hot hatch market, and in terms of performance, it's in a different league. I reckon it would out last a Focus, and out run a Golf, so it's the perfect go between.

Check the Jam Jar website, and all the other online car markets, as I have seen the VXR being advertised for around £17400 otr.

slim_boy_fat

Focus.....

Mr_Wid

I should think it will be a volvo engine, wasnt there a rumour that the next focus rs is going to have the v70/s60 R engine in? Thats a lot of power for a little car!!

I'd go for the golf btw

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Focus meself, think they have the legs on the competition.
Astra has a little too much power, would hate to see what its like in the wet, the golf..... well its a vw, need i say more? (german reliability lol)

Tony

john banks

I would consider a heavily discounted Focus or a new Octavia vRS if I had to get something new at this budget, but the appeal of a 3-3.2 litre six and something putting at least some of the torque to the rear wheels would get my vote... how about a used 330ci sport or Golf R32?

s70rjw

iTrader: (2)

Its the same engine as in the V50 T5 Sounds nice..

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

I also forgot the Clio Sport, old one is a bit rough and ready in this company but the new one is due and its a bit bigger and has 200 bhp. I remember being impressed with an XR3i with its 105 bhp and when the 16 valve Astra appeared with 150, Wow. And lets not forget Peugeot, some of the best hatches ever, but not nowadays, they have dropped of the map, the 206 is a non event, the 106 is an ancient crumbly biscuit tin (however good it may have been) and as far as I know the hottest the 306 gets is a normal 2.0 . Citroen are in a very similar situation, wheres the properly fast C4 ?
if you are going to name a car after an explosive, it needs a little bit more than 138 bhp, its a shame because its a real looker, with the right wheels and a bit of tweaking it could be a winner.


I can see the appeal of the R32 but doesnt the new Golf get a better write up, the BMW is a lovely car, rear drive and all that but not a hot hatch, plus they are so common and have a bit of an image problem.

There is a certain appeal in getting a brand new car, one that hasnt been ruined by some other pillock, especially true when turbo's are involved because not everyone (apart from car geeks) lets them warm up and cool down so when you buy one at 4 years old its got a good chance of being worn out.

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

And now theres this !

http://www.autocar.co.uk/news_article.asp?na_id=217135

Patt@firstime

Astra gets my vote

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Does anyone not think the Astra looks a bit over the top, I do like it but perhaps I am getting older and its a bit Max Power, the Golf is a bit too subtle, I think the Focus should look good in colours other than the Easyjet Orange the press one is in.

Ill take all three and then drive one dependant on what my mood is like.

logiclee

I'd go for the Focus.

Haven't seen the trim specs for the Focus yet but £17500 gets you the base model upto £20k for the top spec.

If you want a bit more space and understated looks the the new Octavia vRS gets you the Golf running gear, a bigger boot, loads of kit and all for £17500.

Cheers
Lee

goodfella31

Astra torque steers like a bitch - looks a bit OTT for me but each to their own.

The ford looks good and would get my vote out of the three choices.

I currently have a megane 225 Trophy and its a great motor, not too OTT looking and bloody quick easy live/beat the 3 you have named....

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

"Astra torque steers like a bitch "

Have you had a go in one, anything else about it, must admit to liking the Megane.

P1Fanatic

So did you test drive one or just watch Top Gear to make that claim?

Simon.

Mike123

Actually, in real life no it doesn't. I've driven one and it's pretty good. Looks might be OTT for you - 5 doors of the Golf GTi was the deciding factor in the end though with small kids to cram in the back. Astra was considerably quicker though.

matlow

Anything with around 200BHP and front wheel drive is going to torque steer to some degree, traction control and fancy abbreviations can mask this to a degree though.

To be honest (ref topgear) how often do you do a foot to the floor launch with your hands on your knees??

and as for the megane being understated.......your kidding right?

Tobisausage

No it does'nt, what Clarkeson said on topgear is utter rubbish.

The car is aimed at the enthusiast and so Lotus left the slight torque steer in, take it out and it would ruin the rest of the cars dynamics and handling at speed. An enthuisast knows how to deal with the slight torque that it has, Lotus know what they are doing.

The focus RS also had torque steer but the same goes for this, remove it and it messes up the rest of the handling at speed.

People who are complaining about torque steer need to buy a 1.0 polo and jog on.

Edit: Meganne Cup is an awesome car and the Golf is over-rated, no idea on what the ST is like, it's all hype at the moment.

Cabinet Enforcer

Official "launch" of the focus ST is in 3 days time, so I guess there will be magazines with reviews next week. The "2005 focus" section of the forums at www.ffoc.co.uk has a fair bit of info about option packs, pricing etc etc.

On paper the ST looks a better proposition than the golf or astra, the golf is beggining to look underpowered and overpriced, and the astra will not have the residuals, and the price advantage it had over the golf now seems inconsequential. Also the tuning aftermarket for the ST is going to be huge, the package appears to be somewhat understressed as standard

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Autocars Best drivers car report said that they got no torque steer from the Astra.

Anyway you say it like its a bad thing, I quite like a bit, all part of the fun !

goodfella31

only going on what a good mate of mine said when he test drove it - don't shoot the messenger !!!

anyhow i agree that if you can drive a car then torque steer isn't really that much of a problem - only when on twisty narrow roads does it become a real problem.

"and as for the megane being understated.......your kidding right?"

all i can say is drive one and then see.

ive had Lotus 111S, MCS with Hartge tune, Honda S2000 and compared to some of the hype around these , yes i'd say it is underated !

Ian_S

and where did he test drive it? seeing as there are only the press cars in the country and no dealers have them yet?

Mike123

Only place I know is a special invitation day at a racetrack - invited because of fleet sales.

gregjd

I've been mulling this choice over too..

I dismissed the Astra because of the badge (sorry).

Money was burning a hole in my pocket too much to wait for the ST Focus (plus I had a niggling doubt about residuals)

Almost ordered a Golf but when modestly specced up (and even through an importer) I thought it was too expensive to be justifiable..

In the end I've just bought a late 2004 (facelift) Cooper S Works.. 210bhp, grey with black roof, chili pack, only done 4000 miles, very subtle looking. £16,750. Yes I know they have a slightly girly image but it is technically the wife's car anyway! Terrific fun to drive, residuals should be fairly good (even with a new one on the way soon), insurance was surprisingly cheap too considering it's group 19!

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

According to Autocar, you can get an imported GTI for 17,250, even the dealers will lop a grand off, it looks expensive compared to the other two, I suspect that after the initial few weeks you will see both the Astra and Focus head nearer to the 16 grand mark, you can already get a Megane 225 for about 14 and a half. The new R32 will be 24 grand.

Anyway, its good news for those who cant afford a new one as competive new hot hatches mean cheaper old ones, whats a Golf 1.8T, Focus 170 etc worth nowadays, not a lot with much more powerful and talented new stuff coming out at reasonable prices.

And this illustrates how they are getting cheaper, 10,435 pounds bought a basic Golf GTI mk2 8 valve in 1989, in 2005 you can get a much higher specced Clio 182 for about a grand more !

As for the Mini, I am sure its great but I feel I am a bit too old (34), married, male and not trendy enough, I cannot text and drive, my hair does not take well to any kind of tinting/highlights or strong hold gel, I would just look wrong with my Iriver (as opposed to an Ipod) Mp3 player. I also tend to try not to annoy other road users, I think Mini owners think that their car is so cute and cheeky so they can get away with driving like a ****. The new Mini CSL looks good, isnt it always the case that you get what you think is the top model that the buggers bring out something tastier, 225 bhp, carbon and ally panels, should be rapid.