wall

Just curious...

It seems that Minis get a fair amount of bashing, and that every time someone asks about hot hatches and good small b-road cars everyone talks about Type-Rs and Clios as the best of the breed.

That seems somewhat strange, as most people who have driven one, from magazines such as Evos to former Sti and Elise owners (such as me ), will tell you that a Mini S, even more in Works version, is a seriously capable tool that can outpace most things in the "twisties" whilst retaining a big fun and predictability margin.

I certainly don't miss my elise, which was magic on billiard-table stuff but unsettled and hard-to-live-with in bumpy or wet, and my Sti I still remember for sheer power and traction, but certainly didn't handle as well particularly on really twisty stuff where it had far more understeer and roll.

So, far from being the best car in the world, the Mini CS can certainly hang on to an Sti or Elise in real world b-roads, and (having test driven them) is certainly a more balanced, fun, and perhaps ultimately faster tool then both Clio 172 and CTR, again off the track and in the "twisties".

It seems that the above views are not just my own but shared by respected reviewers such as the Evo crew ... so why all the bashing / ignoring?

W

Reffro

Probably because its the Hairdresser/Gym Instructor/Estate Agents car of choice......

Gunn79

LOL - How true!

Matt_Turbo_2000

You cant get more camp than a Mini can you!

wall

Well, the WRX / Sti (depending on age/price) is the chaver / IT nerd ( )/ former-sales-rep-become-manager car of choice mostly, yet it's still an excellent road car and I certainly had one and will again in the future.

jcullen

Think its the same old story, people who slag them off probably havn't even driven one. Got a cooper at the moment which has fantastic handling, but its absolutely gutless and with it's tiny boot it's impractical for the mrs/baby so has to go..

James

Reffro

I've driven all the Mini variants, and I agree they are fantastic fun to drive, though the diesel is sluggish. I also love the interiors of the cars, and the room available to the driver and front passenger, plus the excellent residuals and TLC package. I damn near bought one also, but seeing the people that have bought them puts me in no doubt I was best off avoiding it. Especially seeing as Foxton's estate agents use them as company cars...........

Same goes for the Impreza/Evo brigade, you are right that Chav's and IT/Playstation bods buy them in spades, but they also are great cars to drive, but with the stigma attached of who usually buys them.

wilf

Cooper S Works is a cracker its as quick as a Clio Cup but with decent build.

stevem2k

I'd have a Mk1 Cooper S anyday ....


oh, you're referring to the *other* mini's

Faire D'Income

Not at all. I've rubbished them in the past and will continue to do so and having survived my wife's car for 11 months I'm glad it's gone as it has to have the worst ride I've experienced in a car of this size with the most asthmatic, wheezy sounding engine I've ever had the displeasure to drive.

The interior looks alright until you start looking beyond the cheap plastic parts and what is that fake aluminium all about? They handle quite well for a front driver but I can see why people would recommend Clios as an alternative (if you can put up with the build quality) although I'm not so sure about the CTR as the lack of torque would put me off.

If it floats your boat, so be it but it doesn't suit everybody.

DavidChief

Comparing a MCS Works with a Clio Cup is a bit unfair. Bit of a price difference there, eh?

I've always thought the Mini was a nice car but too expensive for what you're getting.

mynickers

The negative comments are always ones based on motoring vanity, car badge snobbery, no doubt by people whose surname is Bucket – pronounced bouquet! I would ignore these comments as anyone that crosses them off altogether patently has little knowledge of cars, if they’re blind to a cars capability based on the kind of people that buy them. That would be like saying Scooby’s are rubbish as they look like cheap and tacky Japanese mondeo’s with spoilers, as I have heard one muppet say. Again no serious car enthusiast would cross of a scoob, any more than an Evo for that matter.

The Mini appeals to lots of people who know buggary about cars, and doesn’t’ help in London when chains of estate agents like Foxes have decided to use them as company cars, and covered them in advertising and given them to all their agents, so they’re everywhere. They have more of a mainstream appeal than the likes of Civic’s and Clio’s that will normally be sought out by people who want a fairly focused driver’s car, rather than some kind of status symbol. But surely ignoring a cars potential because it’s a fashion statements is as bad as buying one for the same reason?

But for serious motor sports or sports car fans, I think you should base your analysis of the car based on it’s performance firstly, as much as cars get dismissed for being a fashion statement or hairdressers car, there are people that will say Civic’s and Clio’s are Chav cars – so you cant’ win. Civic looks like a Chav’d up MPV to some, and the clio a boy racers shopping trolly on steroids to others.

I’ve driven all of them, they’re all very good in their own ways to ‘drive’, I am sure the Civic would be more fun on a track day, but on the road, you have to drive a bit erratically to keep it on the boil, 6k revs is a fairly high amount before the second set of cam lobes take over to give the high revving power they’re famed for not always a possibility on the road. Driving under the vtec isn’t quite as instant as the Mini or the Clio, living in London I would be more reluctant to have a VTEC hatch (excludes Teg, which I will not have a bad word said about) .

The main reason people like the Clio is it’s price, it’s one of the best hot hatches around, and you can pick up a brandspanker from a dealer for £13k, and you can get a brand new one for less than that from a car supermarket. On the other hand, the standard Cooper S is already pricey, then it seems you have to buy the extras’ to retain the resale value, which takes it up to a fair ol’ whack for a hot hatch, but it’s all relative, given its less likely there will bedepreciation from a Mini!

Chins

I owned a Cooper S, sold after 4 weeks. Too many members of the motoring press are on a back hander. Overated. I had the 17" run flats, which is the only thing that I might of done wrong. In std form the S was Sooooo Sloooooow

Have owned a 182 for 5 months. So much more fun than an S, with better build quality - hard to believe.

Jonathan

clio182

i also have to agree i own a 182 and have driven both cars and am glad i bought the 182 over the cooper s for 5 main reasons:

1.it is faster and handles better than the cooper s (clio has cup pack)
2.it was £6000 cheaper and has the same options as the mini
3.i cant see the minis holding their value once the tlc pakage runs out because beleave me no one is going to want to pay bmw prices to service their mini are they. that was the main reason for bmw offering the tlc package in the first place.
4.far to meny on the road.
5.the interior looked nice but after paying proper attention, it aint all that. noises and creeks from everywhere.

thats just my opinion.

what would scooby do

I bought something else so all other competing brands are crap

chris's scooby

No self respecting Estate Agent would drive one!!!

angrynorth

I used to have one and it was a reet laugh to chuck about. Especially the ones with the ASC traction control strangely enough

I probably wouldn't buy another, but I would recommend driving one for a bit if you can.

what would scooby do

That's because there are no self respecting estate agents

chris's scooby

True but i still wouldn't buy a new MINI

Daz34

LOL

mynickers

I always thought they drove Audi TT's

MattW

I would never enetertain a mini. Why, simple really, I can't get a family of four plus luggage in it. I would n't even have one for the Mrs as the boot is so tiddly she'd never get a pushchair plus shopping in it.

See, not all opinions revolve around performance.

Turbo_Steve

As a performance car, I have no complaints with the mini. Cabin size is...er....acceptable. Interior is totally unnacceptable.....I could choose more ergonomic locations for the switchgear and gauges by throwing them at the dashboard at random.

I just can't take myself seriously sat in one. Maybe if it was 100% stripped out racing spec 400bhp/tonne setup. But with the 'faux-race' retro interior, and the girly external looks....I couldn't get out and feel the car suited me.

It's not a bad car. To drive, it's ALMOST a good car. It's just not a car I want to drive.

wall

Turbo Steve ... lol I agree about the "girly" looks ... had to get mine in black with black roof and aero pack + rallie lights to eliminate the girlish factor Now it always looks dirty and I spent a bit, but at east it looks suitably aggressive (in a diminutive-sized sort of way

mynickers

As much as I am sticking up for Mini's I wouldn't have one! I'd rather have a DC2 for £10-12k or a DC5 for the same cash as a Mini, better performance, wont' see any hairdressers or estate agents in those, in fact you'll hardly see any at all!

There is a nice Mini around these parts though, he has a Silver Roof black body, with black alloys and it looks a bit tougher than most.

Civic is less of a try hard car to look at and if you were in any doubt of what they can do, see it in the hands of an Ex-F1 driver around one of my fav tracks (brands hatch):

http://www.fastdrive.org/download.php?view.197

I especially like the mid corner gear change on driuds (cocky buggar), and the little **** up on Graham Hill bend, that probably would of left me in the green stuff!

Lust4Life

I've just ordered one for my wife if that helps?

Phil

Patt@firstime

http://www.zcars.org.uk/mini/mini_twin_rl.htm

Anyone fancy this, it's for sale

Matt

Iwan

I'm chopping my Scooby in for a new Cooper S in November (ordered 2 days ago), so i'll be able to report back then about how gutted i am.

When i test drove it, it felt pretty gutless compared to my standard MY99 Impreza but the handling was great. I want something smaller, slower, newer, cheaper to run, and more reliable than the Impreza. You can have fun in a Mini at slower (less illegal) speeds, so i think there's (slightly) less chance of losing my licence in the Mini. Residuals are pretty good, and the 5 years servicing for £100 is damn cheap whichever way you slice it.

Just need to decide on the colour now...

Patt@firstime

Look best in dark grey, which is why there all in that colour - if it was me I'd go for plain old red

gregjd

I'm seriously considering a Cooper S too (as a 2nd car to the big family Merc wagon) so I'm finding this thread interesting to see people's opinions. The new Hyper Blue (very STi Blue looking) is nice.. Not sure about white rooves but I quite like the Viper Stripes. I actually like the white ones, bizarrely.

Clio 182 is on my shortlist too, as is the Brabus Smart Coupe and Civic Type R.

I'm torn between a new one of the above and a 2nd hand (early, prob LHD) Boxster or Elise..