dhorwich

Gary VR6,

The thing with the cup/172 is they look identical to a 1.2 etc only cosmetically having a different badge and alloys....

To be honest when i see a cup i dont really give them a second look because of the point above, but for some reason when i see a type-R i always have a nosey...

Dan






[Edited by dhorwich - 6/1/2003 8:33:18 PM]

Plantie

Was wondering when you would go from subjective to personal...

Its a shame you cannot stick to comments that may add value.... until your last post everyone was just having a nice little debate.


MHR - as this is your opinion I think the only person able to answer this is yourself.... but you would obviously need to spend a reasonable amount of time in a CTR first.

In my opinion a correctly setup CTR is no different.... but as thats my view it adds no real value to your question... soz

P.

Edited as I am not to good at doing quotes!

[Edited by Plantie - 6/1/2003 10:30:36 PM]

Plantie

ok, perhaps I am thinking of a different car... I will try and find out what some of the CTR boys have done the quarter mile in... for comparison.


Etided as I cnat slpel!

[Edited by Plantie - 6/2/2003 10:42:13 AM]

LG John

Ok, I’m now at the stage where I’m giving fleeting thought to the scooby’s replacement. I’ve just bought my flat and the Impreza is no longer sustainable – largely due to my mileage (hence fuel) and the running costs. I’m tempted to sell the Scooby and get a cheap 306TD or something similar for 3-5k but two things put me off this idea. 1. The potential for problems (hence costs) 2. I like my cars and this has little to offer in terms of thrills or comforts!

Today I looked through the Councils car-leasing scheme and have seen two major temptations for about the same amount – and a third outsider

1. Gold GT PD 130 3dr with a fair whack of trimmings @ about £100-130 a month with only my fuel on top.
2. Clio 172 Cup @ £130 a month with lots of thrills, little comforts and poorer mpg – only other cost = fuel
3. Civic Type-R @ £175 a month with mega thrills and poorer mpg –only other cost = fuel.

My heart says Type-R cause I like them but my sensible head says golf with lots of toys, big alloys, creature comforts and most importantly 45mpg. The Clio seems to be something of a compromise but I just can’t decide

Any thoughts and opinions welcome. And just to spice things up please compare these cars as an ownership prospect: performance, stats, your personal stats, 1/4m, personal mpg, etc, etc. Gouge eyeballs out, be nasty, flame each other, do what you have to do to give me as much info as possible about all these cars

P.S. The 150PD TD isn’t really an option as its £££’s

davyboy

I can not believe you can get a Golf for just £100-130 per month!!!!

I would have one, without even thinking about it!

fatherpierre

I 2nd that.

Very cheap and your fuel costs will be very low.

They have a great mid-range pull that show a lot of other motors up.

davyboy

You dont have to pay insurance?

Are you an essential car user?

48p per mile?

HamishTheWagon

Saxo,

Been doing a similar thing myself lately as may have to sell my MY00 after taking voluntary redundancy.

Here's my thinking, I think if I took the Golf I'd hate the handling and miss the nice scream to a high redline. Sure enough put a tuning box on it for 300 lb/ft or close but changing up at 4K seems unnatural. If most of your time is spent on motorways though I think this is the one I'd have.

I think if you take it easy enough the 172 mpg isn't that bad. It has plenty grunt, looks nice. The only thing that puts me off is the interior. I hate the blue flashes on the steering wheel etc

The insurance on the Civic is severe. I'm still not sold on the looks but I don't doubt you're getting a quality engine/gearbox. My bro has one and I liked it. Big traction problems in the wet but then again so does the Cup/Golf. I think drive wise it's not good enough to pay 40 odd quid more a month than the Cup.

If I didn't need lots of space and taking into account the cash difference I'd take the Cup if you want to retain some chance of B-road thrills and the Golf if you just need to pootle around town/do motorways.

Probably doesn't help.
Hamish

druddle

On a gentle run in my Clio i can get 38mpg average on motorway driving. Can go down to 27 odd on hard driving.

Dave

danny-boy

Saxo Boy, I'm in the same boat, I've had the flat a year, I can afford both the Scooby and the flat, I just don't like affording them.

I thought about selling the Scooby, getting a car for 5k and clear my loan.

Short listed two cars at the mo

Civic VTi and a Pug 306 GTI 6

Good luck mate

Dan

lordlucan

Take a Clio Cup for a test drive, you will buy one. Its a VTS on steroids !!
Im currently seeing 37mpg !! and most get 35mpg average. Top car thats quicker 0-100mph than a 02/03 WRX !!! Standard WRX though. My last car was a 267bhp my00 Scoob that I owned from new, superb car but doesnt have the grin factor of the Cup, got to a point where I was having to do silly speeds to get my fix.
The missus has a Golf tdi130, superb car if a little boring, new Golf coming out in Sept as well.
CTR - Same goodies as Cup plus ABS, nice car never driven one so cant comment !

J.

LG John

Lordlucan your just the man as you've got both the two cars I'm considering and also had a scooby with similar power to mines Is it a nightmare going from the scooby to the cup or do you still feel you have a fast enjoyable car? If you had to choose between the cup and golf for the remainder of you lifetime of driving what would you have? Would the golf's torque spank the cup in most normal situations?

Bit gutted! I wanted to try and test drive a cup soon but there are no demonstraitors in Edinburgh Not to worry, I'm in no rush! I'm starting to get sold on the cup idea. The golf would get better mpg and would have some nice toys but if I can't have full on silly turbo action of a scooby the whizz-bang red line stuff and cheeky handling of a hot-hatch would do very nicely Incidently a VTS is only 50 bucks a month which is mega tempting but I'd get hacked off with it as current VTS's are back to 120bhp and mines was 130 Also, I've made the mistake of going back to old girfriends and as much as I loved the VTS you've got to move forwards

The car lease scheme pays for tax, insurance, tyres, servicing, etc and my council makes a contribution to the lease costs (hence £130 a month!). All I'd have to do is put fuel in the car and I'd never even see the contribution as it would be deducted from my wages.

Does anyone have a picture of the interior of a cup please? Also, does it have the trip computer like the 172 sport? Finally, is cruise control an option (I know, I know, a long shot )

Cheers guys

RSCUP200

Cup is totally stripped of all goodies apart from trip computer and cd player - no leather, air con, traaction control, xenon headlamps - it has crap unsupportive seats which need ripped out including the rear bench! SOunds great,goes like stink, looks mint, nice alloys - bargain hot hatch which should become reasonably rare as production ends this year (new shape clio due out January/Fenuary) Always nice to buy the last of something! Good luck BTW - cruise control not an option although a speed rerstrictor would be a good idea!

LG John

What about the cups performance? Lets be realistic here! My VTS used to stick right up the ar$e of a 172 sport and I'd certainly hope the cup could begin to pull some sort of a lead. Would a CTR totally toast a cup? Is the suspension different from the 172 sport? Bluenose (cause I know you'll stumble on this ) what is the difference between your car and your brothers cup?

Tim-Grove

Cup and CTR are about the same aren't they??

PPPMAT

I'd go for the CTR (owned one for 6 months) Provides lots of excitement and 30 mpg (ish). Also you have that vtec kick to look forward to when giving it 'the lot'. Its the closest effect you can get to a turbo from a NA car.

Cheers

bluenose172

iTrader: (2)

Kenny,

If it's 1/4 mile bragging rights your after then it has to be the Cup. Neil(bro) ran a 14.8 at Crail, he thought there was more to come, totaly humped me!(but then thats not hard to do eh?)

I had a run in it and it does certainly feel a lot quicker than my car. On several occasions now, he has been able to pull a comfortable gap on me to 100+!

It's up to you though, I have a feeling your a Type-R man myself!

[Edited by bluenose172 - 5/29/2003 6:26:43 PM]

Brun

Tek going cheap?

LG John

This won't be happening until about September time but I'd imagine it'll be more cost effective to split and sell the car near standard Keep you eyes peeled

The VTEC hit of the CTR was sexual but I can't ignore the fact that its 40 sheets a month more than the cup and for what? Also, I've never heard a bad word about the cups mpg but I've heard the CTR can be scooby bad if abused..........which..........in my hands in entirely possible

14.8 is pretty good and hints at useful 50mph+ (i.e. one traction is out the way) performance. It would be nice to try and become the fwd launch master again

Carlos The Jackel

I would go for the cup. Its more "old" hot hatch. I was the same (house,bills etc.) and got a Williams (only 27k on the clock). Couldnt afford a cup/type-r. The Golf is v good but doesnt feel like a hot hatch - more a firmer suspensioned cruser (I only had a test drive so correct me if thats wrong).

zoog

Cup has a better power to weight ratio than the CTR, but lower top speed due to less outright power. Get one, and certainly forget thew Golf.

Rich D

iTrader: (12)

May I suggest a 306 Rallye too...

Had mine about 6 months and it is fantastic!

When I replaced my 106 GTi the next car was "meant" to be a Scooby, but I ended up buying a 3 bedroomed semi instead, so the Impreza has been postponed and I opted for the 306 instead.

Was originally going for a GTi-6, but this Rallye cropped up locally and it was too good to turn down, so I opted for that and I'm not regretting it.

Also had a Civic VTi on my shortlist and I looked at and drove a 1.8 VTi hatchback. It was a great car, high spec, very good price but it didn't thrill me, so I left it alone. The Rallye was a car I saw, drove and had to get.

Rich D

iTrader: (12)

Well, a lad I know (TimO off ClioSport) has a modded Cup that ran a 14.3 at York on Monday and that IS a fast Clio!

My 306 Rallye ran a 14.8 too, with mainly 15.0's all day, so that's no slouch, but the Cup is rapid.

Plantie

Saxo Boy,

Drove all three cars you are talking about before buying one of them.

Golf - The most boring car.... but has very very good mpg and a decent amount of torque! It has a very long drab gearshift and size wise it is ok. It is not a hot hatch so I think you would get bored of it quiet quickly...

Cup - Car handles superbly and the blue looks really nice! But they are very very basic inside and the seats are horrid. Very nippy car mind. Gear box is good but the clutch pedal stems from the top so you may find yourself hitting the stem as appose to the pedal... not good if you want to change quickly. Size wise it is a very small car. Lastly... I found myself thinking 'it a clio' you had one of these 4yrs ago.... If you do go for a clio... get a normal 172!

CTR - Superb Car! Handles excellently with a decent geom setup... I believe it would out do a UK scoob in the dry.. but in the wet Scoob by a long way. Performance and drive is very good.... Without using the VTEC it is a normal 2.0l car, its very responsive but nothing to rave about. The VTEC zone is something you need to want to do but when you do, it is very rapid! huge fun and very addictive!! Will out do the Clio in straight line and would be a matter of the driver on the twisties. Interior is great looks smart professional and even slightly sexy! (as interiors go!) Gearbox is fabulous... it has very tight short shifting 6 speed box which is positioned in the most comfortable place! Brakes are excellent and reliability should be second to none. Size wise the car is suprisingly BIG, with no central channel due to gearbox in a different place, the back is very spacey and makes for comfortable passengers. Cons are the radio and standard tyres.... both not very good and should be replaced for better performance. (when taking this car out.... give it a chance.... you need at least an hour... and preferably 2 drives.. I was unimpressed after my 1st drive but after a long 2nd their was no doubt in my mind - this was the car I was buying)

Before deciding my friend I think it would be wise to think about what a car means to you. As someone who owns a Scoob and is a member of this board your car is cleary important to you. And to be fair 2 of the 3 cars are hot hatches.

Would you start to resent the boringness of the golf? and then the Clio (which is great value for money) would always come second to the enjoyment you would recieve from the CTR.

The only other car I would have in this sector would be the new Leon Cupra R. You would then get a close contender to the CTR with the golf environment.

Just don't go buy something not upto the job if you like driving. You will regret it. Budget is obviousley a small factor to look at.

My rec. = CTR

HTH

P.



[Edited by Plantie - 5/29/2003 9:25:00 PM]

zoog

Must say the exhaust note of the CTR when in the vtec range is absolutely fantastic.

dba

Golf maybe the best car for all the wrong reasons,if you don't like driving.Handles like thick soup and there is more steering feel in a JCB.

makes a lot of sense the Golf,so no sense at all then.

golfliam

Change the supension set up on the golf and you have the best of both worlds - its not expensive and its not rocket science
Loads of kit available for the mkiv

its handles the way it does because its set up soft
Bit unfair to compare its hadling with cars that are set up much stiffer especially in the case of the TDI which doesn't usually come with VW so called sport suspension.


I've done mine in stages

Recently beefed up the rear anti roll bar which has made made the biggest difference to body roll.

Tim-Grove

Got to admit the CTR is a good match for the Clio in the Speed stakes, but the Clio far out strips the CTR in shear driver enjoyment and raw edge feeling, it really does keep you on you toes

Plantie

Completley disagree with you there Tim....

Speed wise the CTR is faster, and RAWness.... You put the CTR in the VTEC with its stiff chasis and suspension and you are at about as raw as it gets in a standard road car. Drive it hard and forget your toes.... you need to go change your pants!

Liam - changing the suspension may give the golf some feel back, but it doesn't make much less boring to drive....

Saxo Boy, afaik likes to have a little bit of fun when he drives.... A golf tdi 130 pd will not even raise his blood level.

SB, if you can afford the CTR then forget the clio cup...

[Edited by Plantie - 5/29/2003 11:14:34 PM]

Plantie

Also got to agree with PPPMat - the CTR is the nearest thing in an N/A car to having a Turbo.... and on the CTR the Turbo feeling doesn't run out... you change gear before that happens!

And as we all know it has the best 2.0l engine ever produced.

The 'Type R' pedigree is one envyed my manufacturers and loved by consumers! You just cant tune them up much more