zip106

Love it.
Looking at ways to replace the Alpina with one...

Sounds great on full load even with a bit of piped induction noise.
Didn't play with all the M settings but those I did play with means this car can be at home as an everyday vehicle, or can be equally happy spanked around the track.

Lovely seats, great kit and I managed 23mpg on a spirited A and B road run

It also looks far more purposeful than the M4 that was parked next to it - that (in black at least) just blended into the background like any 4 series would.

It'll do me.

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

23mpg?

Some folk have more money than sense.

Rob Day

iTrader: (78)

What kind of cash are we looking at for a new M3?

Dave Y

iTrader: (52)

Aren't they around the 45/50,000 mark?

Dingdongler

Hi Zip

Yes the M3 looks much better than the M4. I was wanting to get into one but when I'm speccing it comes to about £62k and there seems to be no discounts to be had for now. On top of that the new C63 comes out in about a years time and I'd like to see what that's like.

But I'm so fed up of my 535d that I just can't live with it any longer. So today I've put down a deposit on a used C63 AMG estate.

I'll keep it for a couple of years and then either get into the M3 (when the deals appear) or the new C63 depending on which seems better.

Btw please don't tell me there are deals to be had on the M3 as I've just put the deposit down on the C63!

Rob Day

iTrader: (78)

Reason I ask, I am sure I have seen them with up to 20% reduced on this site:

http://www.drivethedeal.com/default.asp?vans=false

Obviously I've looked now and the offers is currently not on, but they do often pop up.

Audi Q5 with over £3k knocked off at the moment: http://www.drivethedeal.com/specialo...asp?vans=false

Dingdongler

Deals do pop up but as the new M3 has just been released there won't be any deals for some time.

zip106

BMW aren't going to be propping up the new M's for at least 18 -24 months, so you may get a couple % off list.
I specced mine to £60,600 so including the DCT, not many options (Adaptive lights, sliding armrest, loudspeaker and a few low cost things).

I think, if I can sell the Alpina by September, I may lease one for 3 years.
The lease co's are doing around 17% discount, so very favourable.

As with all M's, the depreciation will be quite eye-watering, so I reckon lease is the way forward...

Ding - my mate had a C63 and couldn't get more than 16-20 mpg.
Great car though, and having driven the 507 Edition myself, I can see the attraction!

Dingdongler

What, no heads up display?? It's a must have option, I just wish other manufacturers would adopt it.

I'm expecting poor fuel economy, my M5 averaged 13 mpg in the last 6 months of ownership due to a fault. My 535d is 3.5 years old and has done 16,000 miles so my yearly mileage is low.

The way I see it in a few years time these large NA engines won't exist, might as well experience one again before it's too late.

The car is 9 months old with 1800 miles and asking price was £24k less than list. They also offered me what amounts to 50% of the purchase cost of my 535d which is 3.5 years old, needs three new tyres, a major service, has a whole load of dings and scratches and all the alloys are badly scuffed.

Man maths said it was a deal I couldn't turn down

It'll do for a couple of years until I can decide between the M3 or new C63. AMGs have been getting better and better over the years and the new 63 will have a V8 tt rather than I6tt like the M3 and will probably have about 480 BHP.

zip106

The one I drove today had the HUD, it's an £850 option and although it was good I'm not sure if it's one of those things I wouldn't notice after a while (like the Internet option I've got on the Alpina - never used it!)

More so, if I end up leasing, most options are a total waste of money...

AMG - I very nearly changed my Spyder for the 507 I drove but it reminded me too much of my 996tt - not a weekender by any stretch.
However, as a daily drive it will be stupendous but I'd like something that will give a little better economy

Would love a V8 over a 6, but I love BMW's so the Merc will have to wait for a while.

Anyway, in your position I think you're doing exactly the right thing getting rid of the 5.

Man math always wins in the end

Tidgy

personaly still prefer the e46 to the newer ones but that is a pesonal choice

Dingdongler

I had the hud in my M5 and have it in my 535. I must say it is one of the very best options on offer, especially in a performance car. You never have to take your eyes off the road. Imho it's not a toy like internet etc, the hud actually helps you to drive faster safely.

zip106

As the mrs will be driving it 80% of the time believe me - it'd be wasted!

Littleted

Get that c63 To acid at MSL in Birmingham, you'll be sniffing 700 hehe.

Dingdongler

I'm not very comfortable invalidating the warranty on an engine that probably costs £20k to replace! Brabus have an offering but its £5k for what seems to be an ecu tune!!

Littleted

Ahh sorry ding I thought it was second hand, mines the same it's 3750 plus fitting for the brabus chip takes mine to 404bhp ,

Failing that you have

MSL Birmingham
RENNtech germeny

I'm ordering the RENNtech I think, but maybe MSLs RENNtech are the leaders in amg tuning kind of globally, x AMG techies.

But tbh I think what I start with will be enough for me,

Is the c63 new? Don't forget the add Harmon kardon, it's worlds away from the normal unit

Dingdongler

Hi Ted

No not brand new. It's about 9 months old and so still has quite a bit of warranty left. Unfortunately it doesn't have HK sound, I wish it did. I really wanted the reversing camera (because I'm used to it in my current car) and LSD, both of which it does.

The **** who specced the car went for amg performance media at cost of over £2k, and from I can tell it's of no use at all.

If I had the car tuned I'd want something that could easily be put back to standard in case of a warranty claim

Littleted

Ding here. Piggy back Box first 1

http://www.renntechmercedes.com/www/catalog/471

sites down for MSL at the mo but here

https://www.facebook.com/MSLPERFORMANCEUK

I wouldn't get anything else but piggyback box like you, I couldn't sleep at night

ScoobyJawa

Internet is completely pointless as it can be used from syncing your phone to the car so who cares if the car can do it on its own!

The HUD is outstanding. I've only just picked up my F31 330d xDrive Touring and spec'd the HUD, its superb and I've hardly looked at the dials since, I've only done 150 miles in the car but its one of the options that I couldn't live without now already!!

Littleted

yes I,ll second Internet in the car, what a load of ****e. when u have tethering on the Iphone why bother.

zip106

To be fair, the Internet was part of a package and I wanted the other bits.
But it really is a waste of time in a car, as is the ability to play dvd's on the front screen - that's never been used either!

I'll look into having the HUD, but as I said, £850....

Dingdongler

DMS charge about £1200 and it's reflash of the ECU all done via the obd port. They'll flash it back to normal in the event of a warranty claim free of charge (not that I condone such behaviour)

They'll also do the black series gearbox remap.

They reckon 535 BHP and 490 torques


(Sorry Zip, hijacked your bimmer thread)

Littleted

id stay away from ODB stuff, piggy back from Renntech or MSL is undetectable, Anything that messes with it via the ODB would have my **** Pinching......
Plus what a ballache, what if it blows up side of rd are they coming to see you at 11.30 PM on the A1 .

piggy back is 3 or 4 connectors job done.

john banks

I very much doubt piggybacks are genuinely undetectable, or anything like the best way to tune a turbocharged petrol engine. This may not be the narrative in the forums of marketing around tuning these engines, but people piggyback when they can't OBD flash. If they can't OBD flash they don't have a clue about the anti tuning codes the Germans are hiding within their ECUs. They are not nearly as stupid as they are made out to be.

Suggest an undetectable piggyback method, which signals you would alter and I will be able to suggest known countermeasures OEMs can, could or do use.

Dingdongler

John, can you expand on what you mean by 'anti tuning codes?'

Thanks

Littleted

John your maybe right but maybe wrong, The A45 hasn't had its ECU Hacked yet so all it can use is Piggyback Boxes, the only time they use the OBD port is when you buy the TCU update that makes gear shifts Instant.
Rebellion and RENNtech all state undetectable, How True I don't know,

I think if your going OBD router and have a proper Map, then just be prepared to have warranty denied.

I had my old Insignia mapped by a Piggy Back box from DTUK it lasted 20 mins injectors blew, hasten to say I took it off and Vauxhall was none the wiser.

What a pile of **** that was LOL

MSL in Birmingham are close to cracking the A45 and will in-turn release a proper MAP with WEISTEC just as they have with the C63

john banks

Ding, Google TD1 Audi for example, other manufacturers are similar.

Littleted, the OEMs don't reveal their full arsenal of tuning detection until they want to refuse a £15k claim. R35 was claimed to be untunable, but my experience is that they left the door almost wide open but have still undiscovered anti tuning detection techniques to the point that a mature tuning industry has grown around them far more prevalent and developed than almost any German car yet companies and customers don't attempt or believe they are clever enough that the OEM don't know. On the other hand, the German anti tuning detection stuff appears to be even more sophisticated.

Thinking a piggyback is clever enough to fool an OEM that really wants to know is naive and disingenuous on the part of aftermarket tuners. As I say, propose a mechanism and I can propose many countermeasures, and I've been in this game for a while on less sophisticated countermeasures than are presently employed.

Dingdongler

Thanks JB. TD1 is interesting and hardly an unreasonable step for the makers to take given how after market tuning has increased dramatically.

One thing I wasn't quite clear on was whether TD1 could detect the change even if the ecu was flashed back to original.

One of the companies that tunes the amg (? Eurocharge) will supply you with a hand held obd tuner that can flash the oem map back on when you want to go to the dealer.

Would a programme like TD1 still detect that the ecu was at some time interfered with?

Thanks

john banks

Still detectable if the manufacturer wants to detect it and has put measures in place. For example, flash event through OBD can be recorded by other modules or hidden areas on the engine control unit itself. Just resetting the most obvious flash counter accessible by low level dealer tools is probably false reassurance. For all these reasons I think companies shouldn't market as undetectable until there are years of experience on a particular model showing it to be so. By that time they are often out of warranty and the problem is moot.

Littleted

Im now starting to believe you and not them :/.

Bah nice post ( know it all )