J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

My eldest is doing science A levels and fancies getting into engineering, the careers stuff at school suggested that was where he should look as well,

So, he is a few months in to A levels but other than "Engineering" he doesnt have anything in mind and Engineering is a very broad term, from someone making stuff on a lathe to the designer of medical equipment and all sorts.

So, after suggestions of what is a good goal to set in terms of a career, engineering disciplines that will have work available towards the end of this decade, whats going to start taking off and what is going to die on its ****, I have started a subscription to New Scientist as that has loads of stuff in relevant to up and coming technology, plus jobs in the back as I reckon if you can define your goal, i.e. picking a job it makes the steps to getting to it easier.

So, any suggestions as to how to pursue this gratefully received as since Blockbuster is going his Plan B has evaporated !

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

As you say, it's a VERY wide field, and more so because people who work IN engineering are now described as "engineers" as are washing machine repairers etc etc.

My eldest has just last year walked away from a job as plater and welder and started a four-year course at Loughborough to study Mech Eng.
Meanwhile, one of his mates is being sponsored by his work to do a degree in Electrical Engineering.

Your lad needs to do some extensive reading about the various branches, see what attracts him and what turns him off.
You could even try and organise some visits for him?

scubbay

iTrader: (61)

Mechanical Engineering is one of those subjects that means you can become an engineer in many fields. I am graduating this year and going to work at Jaguar Land Rover, I have friends going into the autmotive industry, energy industry, aerospace, space, oil, gas etc etc. Mechanical engineering provides you with the skills where you can be a very specialised engineer such as an engine designer or work in more general skilled jobs such as manufacturing engineering etc. I would avoid very specialised course such as motorsport engineering as it makes you a little too specialised imo, others may not agree but I feel Mechanical provides you with all the core skills to go into almost any field. Mechanical is also a subject that builds on the fundamentals of Maths and Physics and tbh it gets more complex but it is all based on that. The likes of Electrical engineering is a bit different in that respect but it is also a growing industry afaik but I couldnt do it as I dont like it.

If you study any type of engineering at a well respected uni then you will never be stuck for a job and career, be it in the UK or anywhere else.

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

Excellent post Jeff.

There is a biiiig difference to sitting in an office doing drawings and making designs/important decisions a la an engineer to swinging spanners around and getting dirty (whilst still using those science or maths principles). I'm the latter as I enjoy mechanical fitting and learning the trade. But I am a skilled craftsman, NOT an engineer. Even though my apprenticeship was a Mechanical Engineering one.

Does your lad want to wear a shirt/tie or a boiler suit

David Lock

Google was invented for questions like this

http://targetjobs.co.uk/career-secto...neering-degree

dl

Lydia72

Mr L72 wears a boiler suit, he's always liked taking things to bits. He got into engineering via an apprenticeship (many years ago but his company still do them and prefer to take on this way as opposed to graduates). Initially he did a college course where they covered mechanical, electrical, and control & instrumentation and then depending on their performance they were herded into one of the three to take further.

He then went on to do a company sponsored degree and then a masters after that.
If your lad is that way inclined then this particular industry (energy sector/ power generation) is about as future-proof as you can get. Petrochemicals also another safe one.
The downside for my OH was that he had to leave home at sixteen and travelled about for quite a few years in order to get on so he made sacrifices that way.

Leslie

My best mate and I have always had a common interest in mechanical devices and we both started on making up and maintaining motor bikes from before we were old enough to hold a licence. You would be surprised at the machines we used to eventually get on the road, and as we got more experience they became more successful and we both natually gravitated to cars. We both constructed our own racers and got a lot of fun out of driving them...as well as a few frights!

We have always maintained our own cars, it was a lot cheaper and was also pretty satisfying.

All this mechanical experience did us both a lot of good and we both developed a kind of empathy with our machines. This taught us a lot about looking after them and being able to find a way to design around problems etc which has always stood us in good stead.

What I actually mean is that a good grounding in the mechanical side is a great help when it comes to designing some kind of mechanical marvel or other. You tend to develop a mechanical "feel" somehow which tends to help you to visualise the effects of what you are designing.

Les

nyscooby

iTrader: (12)

Stuff that. Go work in the private yachting sector....

20k per month tax free....

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Really, suppose that makes sense, be good at stuff rich people want/need.

Graz

I'm an Electronics Engineer and have been since graduating with a Bachelor of Engineering in Electrical and Electronic Engineering in 1994. Thing is I knew that was the field I wanted to be in even at the point of choosing my GCSEs (though if I had a time machine I might go back and tell myself to rethink ).

For my A levels I did Maths and Physics, these subjects are pretty much a prerequisite for any engineering discipline, along with AS levels in Electronics and Computer Studies. For my degree I chose a course offering sandwich placements i.e. two years study, year in industry, followed by a final year of study. From personal experience of employing graduates those that have done these types of courses are much more employable and able to get up to speed quickly when given the job as they all ready have some "real world" experience rather than just 3-4 years in academia.

Upshot is that unfortunately he really does need to think about a specialisation at this stage in his career, as others have mention still broad (i.e. not motorsport engineering) but one of the main disciplines - Mechanical, Electrical/Electronic, Civil, Chemical etc.

Would I recommend it? Probably, you need a degree to get anywhere in the industry, pretty much any subject is going to be very maths heavy so be warned of that. Post graduate employment rates are generally pretty good but unfortunately you do tend to star at the bottom on a pretty cr*p salary but if you're any good you'll climb the ranks soon enough. Some 18 years on and I'd consider that I doing quite well, wage high enough to lose child benefit , car allowance, private health care, decent share scheme etc.

If I were to do it all again? Maybe this or accountancy (easy and well paid but boring ), fancy do architecture now also

Miniman

iTrader: (2)

Basically did the same as Graz and started on an Electrical and Electronic engineering degree. Except our third year allowed us to specialise and in the end my degree is Electronic and Computing Engineering, graduating in 1995. The computing part being the engineering of micro processors and associated IC systems. Small voltages are much more interesting than the weirdo's in their Faraday cages :-)

I knew I also wanted to do this from about 15. And my A levels were the same.

I like data comms and telecoms was just becoming the big thing at that time and I went a telecomms route. It was proper electronics a few years ago, though now a decent PBX is Linux based.

I've been fighting the label of IT engineer for years and "oh you're in IT?", but now given up.

I'm not a people manager at the moment, but always looked for real engineering qualifications when recruiting, even though a lot of what we do now comes out of the merge of IT and telecomms worlds.

My advice is to specialise a little, there are lots of IT "engineers" out there, but very few with proper engineering skills. Everyone has to use a computer these days and no doubt there is a lot of mechanical/civil design that relies on PC's.

I got into Telecomms at the right moment, and (same as Graz again!) means we're well off and doing quite well. I was surprised when I had to update my CV the other day and write that I'd been in telecomms for 17 years - jeez I'm getting on a bit!

r32

Engineering, as every one has said it's a broad subject.
Sadly manufacturing is reducing in the UK, as you know so much stuff is produced in India, China etc etc. Much of what is made is designed elsewhere though so design is still fairly strong. Having been in various forms of Engineering all my working life I've seen many ups and downs. Jaguar, Land Rover are doing very well at the moment, JCB are not doing too badly either. However Ford, GM, Caterpillar and many others are not doing so well. But with all these major manufacturers as soon as sales fall they do tend to lose staff very quickly, often setting back on within six months. There is little consideration for employees. I've lost track on how many of our major parts suppliers have gone to the wall over the past years.
But then again I do know that high quality skilled 'engineers' are a dying breed so perhaps it's not a bad choice.

Saint AAI

As already said, it covers a massive range of things. It's best to think of what interests him and look at what areas of engineering that covers. I went down the electrical route, but didn't know I wanted to do it until I was 23. I had done A level maths and physics in 6th form, but had no idea what career I wanted to do. Ended up starting an HNC when I was 23 and found a few companies willing to employ me while giving me day release. Got a job in a factory I'd already worked at before and worked my way up from there. Now I'm 32 and mainly do PLC programming, but still do a wide range of stuff which keeps the job interesting. I now get day release again to continue my studies and am halfway through my HND, but will be starting a BEng later this year and then on to do my masters after that and CEng registration. All paid for by my company. Pay is good and I enjoy going to work too which helps.

AndyC_772

iTrader: (2)

That's very true, I've seen some truly hopeless candidates for junior engineering positions in the last year. It's really rather sad.

The most important thing has to be to pick something he's actually interested in for its own sake. For me, that's always been electronics, and doing a very general engineering degree course (including mechanical engineering, materials science, thermodynamics and structural mechanics) did nothing to change that.

The jobs at the back of New Scientist are a joke, many of them are offering absolute peanuts for extraordinarily well qualified people. I can only assume that the people who take them are bright academics who enjoy the pure science and are dead set against entering the commerical world proper. I'd almost rather flip burgers in some cases.

AndyC_772

iTrader: (2)

How would you realistically rate his academic ability?

At risk of stating the obvious, a person who makes stuff on a lathe is a machinist, not an engineer. Other people who are not engineers include service and repair technicians, equipment operators, installers, technical support staff, and the vast majority of people who are "in IT" (qualified software engineers excepted).

As a general rule, if you design stuff yourself from simpler components, you're an engineer, whereas if you work exclusively with products that other people have designed, then you're not.

pslewis

You ask what area will be a growing field in Engineering ..... I can answer very clearly.

The future lies within Defence, pure and simple. There are lots of reasons we need top Engineers within the Defence field.

The Trident Missile System only has a limited lifespan from here on in. A new system will have to be designed and built soon - the decision to go ahead will be made in the next Parliment.

This will coincide with his graduation .... a new warhead has a life of well over 30 years, if he gets in at the beginning he has a job for a decent length of time.

Graz

Depends if you have a concious perhaps, developing weapons to kill many thousands of people regardless of whether or not they're going to be used isn't my cup of tea. Don't get me wrong though defence isn't all bad, in my line of work we've supplied communications systems to various military organisations, they may have helped save lives and they may have helped take lives but we're just providing them with a tool at the end of the day. The company that owned us previously are quite big in the surveillance field and they're doing well enough.

r32

A very interesting article, well worth a read..............
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/dyson-warns...015025038.html

r32

Sadly whilst this may be true it is not likely to be jobs in the UK that benefit. My local city had a huge number of defence based engineering jobs, sadly but for a handful they have all gone. Their factories have gone and now support huge housing developments. Like the failed attempt to put BAE into foreign control many of the defence contractors are multi nationals with their headquarters other than in the UK. Strangely enough they seem to support their home Country but in the UK it seems like a mad rush to close up and leave or sell out to foreigners. As mentioned the only bright spot was BAE remaining British (for now).

Graz

I think part of the problem is providing recognition and making it a prestigious career.

I think the Germans have the right idea where engineer is a protected title and you're only allowed to call yourself one once qualified, i.e. University degree + several years industrial training. Over here any idiot can call themselves one if they have a basic grasp of how to use a screwdriver. In Germany you're regarding within the same esteem as a medical doctor, barrister, scientist, etc.

That and more pay please Although if there really is a shortage it may start to drive things up. At the height of the GSM boom it did start to get quite competitive, I was getting a rise pretty much every six months to ensure I wasn't lured to Motorola or Lucent

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

This. You're not an engineer if you can fix fridges or photocopiers!

I did the mechanical engineering apprenticeship. But I am not an engineer. I am a craftsman as I haven't got a degree, that simple. The term engineer is worth nothing in this hole of a country.

zip106

Future doesn't look too rosy...


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...shire-21145802

pslewis

A new Nuclear Warhead will have the Union Jack on it - of that there is no doubt.

It's a brilliant career ...... remember, you are saving many millions of lives - as it will stop any use of such weapons at all.

r32

It may well do, but the defence industry is shrinking, as are the armed forces. Be a crazy industry to join. I doubt there's any jobs going in the UK arm any way.

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Some really interesting stuff there, thanks.

He is fairly academic but, like me, a bit lazy, he got 9 good GCSE's, we are waiting to see his A level interim exam results.

Just trying to get him on track with something specific in mind rather than "Engineering", he needs specific aims as Engineering is really just a word, he needs an understanding of how the real world does stuff, I think the kids and a lot of the public seem to think you have to be a pop star, footballer or company boss to make good money, there are loads of people working for companies you have probably never heard off, doing stuff you are only vaguley aware of and earning very nice salaries. I work for a large engineering services company that used to be mainly in the building industry but moved to more lucrative markets and I speak to a lot of people who do very nicely.

The other thing he was deemed suitable for was airline pilot, it was a fairly intense thing they went through, not your usual half hour careers chat but a full day and they came up with Engineer and Pilot, I could see him as a pilot but it is massively competetive, hundreds/thousands of hopefuls all queing up to fly stag and hen dos to Prague on Easyjet for 25 grand a year, he needs to find a niche, something engineering wise that not everyone can do I think is the way to progress.

I want to see my kids get decent jobs, like anyone does as things look a bit bleak, still, life goes on, stuff still needs building, making selling, I want to give him a bit more input than I got, plus if he does a degree I am goign to be on him like a rash, I am not paying for three years of partying and selfishly I want the little ******* out of my rib for every penny at some point.

fpan

iTrader: (11)

Graz, in which field do you work on and are you still an engineer or manager now?

I wouldn't say the same about telecoms where salaries have remained the same (almost) during the last 8 years due to a lot of things being outsourced to India/China.

J4CKO, it is good you are researching and giving him advice as a good parent would do but let HIM make the decision what he wants to do in the end.

Being able to live a comfortable life is one thing, enjoying what you do while doing the former is a little more difficult sometimes.

Graz

I work in Avionics, primarily satellite communications systems. We supply directly and indirectly to Airbus, Boeing, Gulfstream, Bombardier etc. as well as military applications.

I'd still class myself as an engineer, though more of a systems and architectural bias now. As you say a lot of work is outsourced to wherever it can be done cheaply / effectively but you still need the guys with the in-depth knowledge & breadth of understanding to create the specifications, designs, etc. that the Chinese or Indian subcontractors can then implement. I actively avoided doing managerial stuff over the years, think I'd rapidly lose interest in the job if that happened.

legacy_gtb

iTrader: (3)

Im a concept car packaging engineer now, spend all day driving CAD! Moneys good but the work will only ever be as enjoyable as "da management" lets it be.

I started mid teens working for a historic motorsport restoration company and did many years of building and making before going to uni. This hands on experience gave me a really good footing at uni and although i didnt excel in the book work, the practical side of things dragged me through pretty well!

Dont dismiss the smaller (more practical and hands on) unis, as i definately wouldnt be where i am now if id got my first choice of universities and had my head in a book and nowhere near a workshop for 4 years!

I studied motorsport engineering at swansea institute .... highly rate the course and the town (although that was 10+ years ago now)

My major reconmendation would be to encourage any form of personal designing, making or maintaining! Buy a welder, make a motorbike engined buggy, restore an old bike, any form of basic mechanical experience gives a hands on appreciation for materials and tools, and with the young brain being sponge like, that experience at a young age is invaluable throughout later life.

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Yes, am concious I dont tell him what to do, I want to give him ideas, not dictate and I fully agree that liking what you is very important.