The correct use of car lights - a general rant
10 January 2013, 10:09 PM
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The correct use of car lights - a general rant
Sorry if this sounds patronising but I've got to get this off my chest. Today's foggy weather highlighted once of my greatest motoring irritations, improper use of lights. Never are people so devoid of common sense than when they switch on side or head lights or fog lights so here's my biased opinion on correct use.
Firstly, let me clarify that car lights have only 2 purposes; to see with and to allow other road users to see you.
Side lights - these should be removed from all cars. There seems to be this belief that head lights are for the dark and side lights for day time. Ok let's start with night time, head lights are needed to see with and to be seen. No controversy there. But what about day time? What's wrong with side lights? Light is relative, a dim light in a very dark place is bright and a bright light in a bright place appears almost dim. So in the day time when ambient light levels are high, you need a bright light such as a head light. When you factor in rain or fog as well, the inadequacies of side lights are made more obvious. How many times have you overtaken in the rain when it looked clear when at the last minute the previously invisible car with side lights coming the other way, suddenly appears? So if you need a light on, just put head lights on, day or night.
Fog lights- so if it's foggy then you need to switch on fog lights, right? Wrong!
Rear fog lights are to stop you running into the car in front so if you see his rear lights and he's not got fog lights on then you don't need them. In fact as soon as you don't need them, switch them off because I can't see anything except your glaring red retina slayers when they're not required.
Front fog lights- sorry but I forgot about the additional use of these; making a fashion statement. And if you really want to annoy me why not combine them with side lights?
The proper use - to light up the verge on the road so that you don't drive into a ditch. And that's it.
Rant over.
Firstly, let me clarify that car lights have only 2 purposes; to see with and to allow other road users to see you.
Side lights - these should be removed from all cars. There seems to be this belief that head lights are for the dark and side lights for day time. Ok let's start with night time, head lights are needed to see with and to be seen. No controversy there. But what about day time? What's wrong with side lights? Light is relative, a dim light in a very dark place is bright and a bright light in a bright place appears almost dim. So in the day time when ambient light levels are high, you need a bright light such as a head light. When you factor in rain or fog as well, the inadequacies of side lights are made more obvious. How many times have you overtaken in the rain when it looked clear when at the last minute the previously invisible car with side lights coming the other way, suddenly appears? So if you need a light on, just put head lights on, day or night.
Fog lights- so if it's foggy then you need to switch on fog lights, right? Wrong!
Rear fog lights are to stop you running into the car in front so if you see his rear lights and he's not got fog lights on then you don't need them. In fact as soon as you don't need them, switch them off because I can't see anything except your glaring red retina slayers when they're not required.
Front fog lights- sorry but I forgot about the additional use of these; making a fashion statement. And if you really want to annoy me why not combine them with side lights?
The proper use - to light up the verge on the road so that you don't drive into a ditch. And that's it.
Rant over.
Last edited by DJB3; 10 January 2013 at 10:14 PM.
10 January 2013, 10:35 PM
#2
Aren't front fogs designed and positioned to reduce the reflected light in foggy conditions and allow you to see better, while also doing the same job as the rears by increasing your visibility to other road users?
I agree with you about people using them at the wrong time though, very annoying.
I also hate big 4X4s driving behind me with HIDs on, completely dazzled through the rear view mirror.
I agree with you about people using them at the wrong time though, very annoying.
I also hate big 4X4s driving behind me with HIDs on, completely dazzled through the rear view mirror.
10 January 2013, 10:51 PM
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In the 20+ years that I have had cars with front fogs there have only been a couple of occasions when turning them on has been beneficial. Generally dipped headlights do the job just as well. Generally turning them on makes no difference to what I can see.
10 January 2013, 10:57 PM
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What about brake lights. With seemingly ever brighter brake lights you'd think the to55er in front waiting ages for the lights to change would have the decency to pull the handbrake up and save your eyeballs.
10 January 2013, 11:42 PM
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Fog lights are supposed to be used in conjunction with side lights and not your main headlight, that way the light remains lower to the ground and does not disperse so much in the fog/cloud thus improving your vision and also the persons driving towards you. People with both main and fogs on when its foggy annoy the hell out of me.......learn what's correct and use your sides.....rant over 
I dont agree with people who drive around with fogs etc on all the time though......especially when your driving down clear country roads.....I've taken to flashing my fulls and fogs at them to let them know they have them on because they've obviously 'forgotten'
I dont agree with people who drive around with fogs etc on all the time though......especially when your driving down clear country roads.....I've taken to flashing my fulls and fogs at them to let them know they have them on because they've obviously 'forgotten'
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11 January 2013, 08:06 AM
#8
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Last i read it was if visibility is less than 100 metres for fogs,some say 50 metre for rear,In the highway code it says 100 but don't specify if that is for front or rear,so assume its the same for both.But saying that.
The way some drive,i'm amazed they passed a driving test,so do you think these motorists have read in a book etc,the correct use of lights..
The way some drive,i'm amazed they passed a driving test,so do you think these motorists have read in a book etc,the correct use of lights..
11 January 2013, 08:12 AM
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Our van has DRLs but luckily not the horrible LED ones. And if you turn sharply at under 20mph, one fog light comes on; a bit odd but its quite handy.
I'll use fogs on country lanes in very poor weather just so I can see the road surface more clearly. I turn them off for oncoming traffic though.
I think many should use their lights more like the do in Sweden.
I'll use fogs on country lanes in very poor weather just so I can see the road surface more clearly. I turn them off for oncoming traffic though.
I think many should use their lights more like the do in Sweden.
11 January 2013, 08:58 AM
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Saints forever
So front fogs and side lights is ideal combination. Two problems with that, many cars still don't have front fogs so will either have to use headlights (which they should) or be invisible to on coming traffic and just use side lights. And if you do have front fogs, what purpose do the side lights serve - because I can't see them until you're 3 car lengths away. In reality front fogs light up the road and verge immediately in front of car and dipped headlights the bit beyond that. I agree however that full beams are useless in bad fog.
So front fogs and side lights is ideal combination. Two problems with that, many cars still don't have front fogs so will either have to use headlights (which they should) or be invisible to on coming traffic and just use side lights. And if you do have front fogs, what purpose do the side lights serve - because I can't see them until you're 3 car lengths away. In reality front fogs light up the road and verge immediately in front of car and dipped headlights the bit beyond that. I agree however that full beams are useless in bad fog.
11 January 2013, 09:07 AM
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I just leave it to the car to make up it's mind what lights it wants on, either daytime running lights or headlights usually. It's up to me with the fogs but I rarely ever use them. 
11 January 2013, 09:26 AM
#13
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Bright day = no lights.
Dull day = side lights.
Dusk to dawn = dipped headlights (although the legal requirement for roads up to 30mph with street lighting is side lights, dipped for +30 or where there are no street lights).
Fog where vis is <100m = rear fogs (but fronts come on with them) and usually sidelights, and turn them off if conditions improve, or if it is obvious following cars are fully aware of your presence.
Unlit road at night = Main beam h/lights as long as there is no moving vehicle ahead, either coming towards or travelling the same way ahead of you.
Fogs are positioned low where atmospheric pressure and ambient road temperature make the fog less dense, and are for illuminating the verge and white line to a distance of about 5m. This means that using them instead of dipped headlights you are illuminating things you are very likely to hit as you are under the stopping distance for most vehicles at normal speeds.
Headlights are aimed away from oncoming drivers, but fogs need to have a wide beam pattern to both sides. Combine this with their low position (for good scientific reason mentioned above) and thus a low angle of reflected incidence, it means on a wet road their potential to glare is doubled.
DRL's are fine, but I can't see why sidelights weren't just made compulsory whilst the vehicle is in motion. They do the same job, but without the rears being on. Some LED ones are quite dazzling, Citroen especially ! I expect that with their now widespread use on new cars, and with them often looking very similar to front fogs that police will stop bothering pulling fog-light abusers, so the situation is sure to get worse and we all will just have to get used to it.
I used to have the sides on my Scoob on permanently, but that was to ensure that the 'smart' (bloody dumb) alternator charged my battery. I had one fail not long after getting it before I knew the trick, and after selling it the new owner didn't heed my advice and turned them off, resulting in another flat battery within 3 months.
Dull day = side lights.
Dusk to dawn = dipped headlights (although the legal requirement for roads up to 30mph with street lighting is side lights, dipped for +30 or where there are no street lights).
Fog where vis is <100m = rear fogs (but fronts come on with them) and usually sidelights, and turn them off if conditions improve, or if it is obvious following cars are fully aware of your presence.
Unlit road at night = Main beam h/lights as long as there is no moving vehicle ahead, either coming towards or travelling the same way ahead of you.
Fogs are positioned low where atmospheric pressure and ambient road temperature make the fog less dense, and are for illuminating the verge and white line to a distance of about 5m. This means that using them instead of dipped headlights you are illuminating things you are very likely to hit as you are under the stopping distance for most vehicles at normal speeds.
Headlights are aimed away from oncoming drivers, but fogs need to have a wide beam pattern to both sides. Combine this with their low position (for good scientific reason mentioned above) and thus a low angle of reflected incidence, it means on a wet road their potential to glare is doubled.
DRL's are fine, but I can't see why sidelights weren't just made compulsory whilst the vehicle is in motion. They do the same job, but without the rears being on. Some LED ones are quite dazzling, Citroen especially ! I expect that with their now widespread use on new cars, and with them often looking very similar to front fogs that police will stop bothering pulling fog-light abusers, so the situation is sure to get worse and we all will just have to get used to it.
I used to have the sides on my Scoob on permanently, but that was to ensure that the 'smart' (bloody dumb) alternator charged my battery. I had one fail not long after getting it before I knew the trick, and after selling it the new owner didn't heed my advice and turned them off, resulting in another flat battery within 3 months.
11 January 2013, 09:51 AM
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THIS!!!!
or when they're sat at the lights on a slight decline with the foot on the brake pedal. On then off, stifle forward, brake back on, off, shuffle forwards some more, again and again! Argh it's like some sort of epileptic ******* traffic light disco. Put your ******* hand/parking brake on you 'tard!
11 January 2013, 09:52 AM
#17
I think I see far more cars these days with dipped headlights on during a perfectly normal day. And occasionally full beam in day light! And far more cars with no lights at all hen it's dark. This has gotten worse over the last couple of years.
IMO it's the advent of auto lighting that has caused this. People have forgotten to check their lights are on and don't worry about whether they need to be side or dipped or turned off.
Ironically the feature (auto lights) that has been developed to increase safety has meant people don't care to make sure they are correctly lit and actually decreased safety overall.
IMO it's the advent of auto lighting that has caused this. People have forgotten to check their lights are on and don't worry about whether they need to be side or dipped or turned off.
Ironically the feature (auto lights) that has been developed to increase safety has meant people don't care to make sure they are correctly lit and actually decreased safety overall.
11 January 2013, 09:52 AM
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Especially when I'm in the truck, they still carve you up, but now without letting you know their gonna stop!
One day I'm going to end up taking one out, it's only a matter of time
11 January 2013, 10:34 AM
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Sorry if this sounds patronising but I've got to get this off my chest. Today's foggy weather highlighted once of my greatest motoring irritations, improper use of lights. Never are people so devoid of common sense than when they switch on side or head lights or fog lights so here's my biased opinion on correct use.
Firstly, let me clarify that car lights have only 2 purposes; to see with and to allow other road users to see you.
Side lights - these should be removed from all cars. There seems to be this belief that head lights are for the dark and side lights for day time. Ok let's start with night time, head lights are needed to see with and to be seen. No controversy there. But what about day time? What's wrong with side lights? Light is relative, a dim light in a very dark place is bright and a bright light in a bright place appears almost dim. So in the day time when ambient light levels are high, you need a bright light such as a head light. When you factor in rain or fog as well, the inadequacies of side lights are made more obvious. How many times have you overtaken in the rain when it looked clear when at the last minute the previously invisible car with side lights coming the other way, suddenly appears? So if you need a light on, just put head lights on, day or night.
Fog lights- so if it's foggy then you need to switch on fog lights, right? Wrong!
Rear fog lights are to stop you running into the car in front so if you see his rear lights and he's not got fog lights on then you don't need them. In fact as soon as you don't need them, switch them off because I can't see anything except your glaring red retina slayers when they're not required.
Front fog lights- sorry but I forgot about the additional use of these; making a fashion statement. And if you really want to annoy me why not combine them with side lights?
The proper use - to light up the verge on the road so that you don't drive into a ditch. And that's it.
Rant over.
Firstly, let me clarify that car lights have only 2 purposes; to see with and to allow other road users to see you.
Side lights - these should be removed from all cars. There seems to be this belief that head lights are for the dark and side lights for day time. Ok let's start with night time, head lights are needed to see with and to be seen. No controversy there. But what about day time? What's wrong with side lights? Light is relative, a dim light in a very dark place is bright and a bright light in a bright place appears almost dim. So in the day time when ambient light levels are high, you need a bright light such as a head light. When you factor in rain or fog as well, the inadequacies of side lights are made more obvious. How many times have you overtaken in the rain when it looked clear when at the last minute the previously invisible car with side lights coming the other way, suddenly appears? So if you need a light on, just put head lights on, day or night.
Fog lights- so if it's foggy then you need to switch on fog lights, right? Wrong!
Rear fog lights are to stop you running into the car in front so if you see his rear lights and he's not got fog lights on then you don't need them. In fact as soon as you don't need them, switch them off because I can't see anything except your glaring red retina slayers when they're not required.
Front fog lights- sorry but I forgot about the additional use of these; making a fashion statement. And if you really want to annoy me why not combine them with side lights?
The proper use - to light up the verge on the road so that you don't drive into a ditch. And that's it.
Rant over.
11 January 2013, 10:55 AM
#24
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Last couple of years i've driven everywhere, day & night on dipped headlights.... never turn them off.
Feels safer IMHO... I started it when one of my company cars was tarmac colour, and thus invisible to other road users - lol it's become a habit now.
my bad?
Feels safer IMHO... I started it when one of my company cars was tarmac colour, and thus invisible to other road users - lol
it's become a habit now.my bad?
11 January 2013, 11:07 AM
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Don't get me started on misaligned headlights
Or cars/vans full of stuff and not adjusting them!
Just to add my new van headlights don't turn off, when off they are on dipped headlights. It's a ford thing.
Or cars/vans full of stuff and not adjusting them!
Just to add my new van headlights don't turn off, when off they are on dipped headlights. It's a ford thing.
11 January 2013, 11:15 AM
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I used to have a Renault 5 GT Turbo with the yellow front fog lights. Because they contrasted with the white headlights, they were great for being behind cars, flicking them on and off, and getting people to turn off unnecessary rear fog lights. I was almost stopped once for having on my Scoob "fog lights" one misty day, the Police don't like them being used in those conditions at all.
11 January 2013, 11:16 AM
#27
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Why have a separate switch for front and rear fog lights? How many tossers do you see driving around with just the fronts on? If there was just the one switch i dare say there would be less people who would put them on to look cool!
While we're at it, why not make it law that the fog lights are cancelled when the lights are turned off or the ignition - then anyone with them one could not have just forgotten that they are on.
Only thing worse than a front fog light tosser, is a front fog light tosser hogging the middle lane
While we're at it, why not make it law that the fog lights are cancelled when the lights are turned off or the ignition - then anyone with them one could not have just forgotten that they are on.
Only thing worse than a front fog light tosser, is a front fog light tosser hogging the middle lane
11 January 2013, 11:17 AM
#28
The car I've just scrapped had headlights wired through a latching relay, such that they could ONLY be on main beam with ignition on. Turn OFF the ignition, they reverted back to dip, so you couldn't get in and inadvertently drive on main beams.
great and cheap safety feature wired onto a car nearly 14 years old.
So WHY can't modern manufacturers do the SAME for front, and especially rear, foglights?
LOL posted 1 minute after Brun's comment above.
great and cheap safety feature wired onto a car nearly 14 years old.
So WHY can't modern manufacturers do the SAME for front, and especially rear, foglights?
LOL posted 1 minute after Brun's comment above.
11 January 2013, 11:19 AM
#29
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The car I've just scrapped had headlights wired through a latching relay, such that they could ONLY be on main beam with ignition on. Turn OFF the ignition, they reverted back to dip, so you couldn't get in and inadvertently drive on main beams.
great and cheap safety feature wired onto a car nearly 14 years old.
So WHY can't modern manufacturers do the SAME for front, and especially rear, foglights?
LOL posted 1 minute after Brun's comment above.
great and cheap safety feature wired onto a car nearly 14 years old.
So WHY can't modern manufacturers do the SAME for front, and especially rear, foglights?
LOL posted 1 minute after Brun's comment above.