dpb

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/news...re-reform.html


Hopefully this all deter those wishing to get paid for being depressed at home in their armchairs / other 'incapacitated' to boot

Snazy

Fingers crossed it has a positive effect

stilover

Lets hope so. On this mornings news, they were saying that 43% of people in a town in the North East (can't remember which one) are on Benefits.

Shocking. Bloke interviewed admitted people try to get the sack, so they can start claiming.

EddScott

I'm concerned by the references to "poverty"

Again we come back to the governments catch 22. We don't want children and families living in "poverty" I use speechmarks because our version of what poverty means and its meaning 30 years ago is a tad different. You can live in poverty these days but still have a roof over your head and enough money for ****, booze and Greggs pasties.

However, we don't want (but already have) generations of families choosing to be career unemployed. Its these that need targetting and I fear what IDS has said is just a rehash of the existing system with no real teeth.

The whole system needs a rethink from the ground up. Being put on the sick is started by some sob story to the GP - the GP needs to either tell them to take a hike or better still you need 2 or 3 GPs to agree that you deserve to go on the sick. Case in point - wifes brother used to work for the local council in Yorkshire. He came up with some sh1te about depression and now is officially "on the sick" apart from being a f*cking loser theres nothing wrong with him.

Kieran_Burns

iTrader: (1)

I almost exploded at this bit:


Martina Milburn, chief executive of youth charity The Prince's Trust, commented: "Thousands of young people don't have the skills, confidence and qualifications to break out of long-term unemployment and poverty.

"These youngsters have been pushed further from the jobs market in the recession, as they struggle to compete with graduates fresh out of university.


ARGH! They didn't bother trying at school, so have no skills or qualifications and are complaining that the kids that DID try and then go on to Uni are getting the jobs! For crying out loud.

warrenm2

Its 60% of the median wage. See here http://burningourmoney.blogspot.com/...e-problem.html Also note that median figure is calculated AFTER benefits, so the more benefits they give, the higher the median wage rises and hence the more they have to give to people in poverty which.... etc etc repeat until bankrupt

Clarebabes

I work with young people and I hear things like, "I'm not getting out of bed for £95 a week" all the time. That's an apprenticeship minimum wage. Apparently, these youngsters with no GCSEs, drug problems and criminal records as long as their arms are worth more than that. I don't think so!

Another thing I hear is "well, the next thing you know I'll be pregnant, they'll have to give me money then."

Boils my **** and I have been trained to be all "caring" about it

Clarebabes

Oh, and they're very fertile.

They see kids as a money-making exercise and when they get to 16, they chuck them out so the kids can get benefits. I get sick of saying kids are the responsibility of their parents until they are 18, but it goes in one ear and out the other! It is a career to them and they are "entitled" to the money, like it's the Government's present to them for living. They have no understanding that I am paying for them out of my tax, they think it gets pulled out of thin air.

GRRRRR I gotta calm down!

Nimbus

I think the issue these days is that these sort of people think the world owes them a living. They see people who are working hard having nice items like flat screen TV, xbox/PS3, holidays and nice cars. They think that they should have the same and a job that provides the wages to buy them. But because they don't have the qualifications and can only get lower paid jobs, they think that it's not worth it and would prefer to get hand outs. It does not seem to register that if you're only capable of a low paid job you should take it, lower your spending expectations and learn/improve yourself so you can work up.

Jaybird-UK

we're number 1 at something!!

The Zohan

Agree with all the comments above, about time Martin2005 came along and called us all DM reading fascists and give quiche a chance!

nick172sport

iTrader: (6)

slagood is he not with you seeing though hes your bum chum

Martin2005

No actually I agree, we need to act on this issue and I'm pleased the government is on the case. It will be one of those 'easier said than done' problems to solve though.

I think a safety net is an essential cost to any modern society, but it must be fair and it must be affordable

So no argument from me

Martin2005

Nice to see you adding to the debate with your usual high standard intellectual interventions

Lee247

Totally agree with you, Clare.
My Son is at University. Has just completed his first year studying Criminology.
He has updated his cv and is walking his shoes off handing them out to everywhere, looking to get a job during the summer before he restarts Uni again in September.
He doesn't even ask us for money, he uses his bit savings. (well, he sometimes asks for his bus fare to play footie on a Saturday )

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

how easy is it for the "haves" to point the finger at the "have nots"?

Clarebabes

They may "have not" but take no responsibility or have any inclination to help themselves. It's all take, take, take, what they're entitled to, what they can do to screw the social.

Bloke on Radio 1 news said he's not going to work until it's a job he wants, i.e. bricklaying. Is he trained? We don't know, but if he was, he might be able to get a job in it. Is he doing a night class to get the skills? I doubt it. Why should he when he can sit on his *** and get loads of money?

c_maguire

Society would undoubtedly be a much more pleasant place if only those with I.Q.'s in excess of 100 were able to breed.
I haven't and don't intend to before anybody starts casting aspersions.

Kevin

Lee247

I'm not pointing the finger at anyone

Martin2005

Clare - your words could be interpreted has saying that EVERYONE on social security support is some sort of low-life and therefore undeserving of help....be careful

Clarebabes

Yeah, OK Martin, fair point. Maybe it's just the ones I deal with day in day out

Lee247

I can see where Clare is coming from, especially if she is dealing with the workshy on a regular basis.
There will always be deserving cases, but at the moment, I would hazzard a quess that the spongers far outweigh the ones in real need of help

Martin2005

Really??

I doubt it!!

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

Clare: I know quite a few young 'uns here as my own lads are 24 and 20. They would LOVE to work, but there is none. Even the labouring jobs they might have had in previous years have either dried up, or are being done by Eastern Europeans.

I have PERSONALLY had to FORCE four of them to claim any benefits as they are being made to feel like lowlifes for so doing.

Guess who makes them feel that way?
Yep, people like you

Meanwhile, Johnny Foreigner has no feelings whatsoever as he dips into OUR pot

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

+1.

I feel very lucky to be on approx £490 a month wages at 25 given the situations around me (thats for 40 hours a week too).

Lee247

Just the way it seems. I would love to be proved wrong.
I do not begrudge anyone benefits, if they really deserve it. Quite a few do, but I feel, sadly, quite a few do not.

Clarebabes

I have no problem with people using the welfare state for what it was designed to do: help people out of a tough spot. I also would positively encourage those who are entitled because they are actually in need to seek help from it.

What I am saying is that I do not like the people who use the welfare state as a career choice and have no intention or ambition to better themselves. The whole reason we've got no jobs is because everyone thinks they are better than sweeping the streets. That's why we have imported a workforce grateful of this type of work, who in turn through hard work and a good work ethic, have filled the gaps where your common-all-garden no qualification person would normally had filled, hence there being no jobs at the bottom of the ladder.

I hear every day like I said before that they would not get out of bed for under £100 a week. Yes, you might say the same, we're a bit older than those I'm working with. We also might see the long-term gain from training. They don't.

I'm not going to argue with anyone, I'm just telling you some of the things I have witnessed and know about. Every day we have kids coming in because they've been kicked out by parents who cannot afford them and they have to go into hostels. This is seen as the first step on the housing ladder for many as under 18s get treated differently.

It is a cycle which I cannot see an end to. Parents haven't worked and neither did their parents and they had a roof over their heads and could afford to live a life we would hate, but seems to be OK for them. However, if that's all you've known, then how do they know how to get themselves out of it? They don't! And the cycle continues.......

If you knew some of the things that go on in the town I work in, honestly, it would freak you guys out. Perhaps that will be saved for another time. I know I don't know the half of it, and that half is bad enough!

Clarebabes

I have no problem with people using the welfare state for what it was designed to do: help people out of a tough spot. I also would positively encourage those who are entitled because they are actually in need to seek help from it.

What I am saying is that I do not like the people who use the welfare state as a career choice and have no intention or ambition to better themselves. The whole reason we've got no jobs is because everyone thinks they are better than sweeping the streets. That's why we have imported a workforce grateful of this type of work, who in turn through hard work and a good work ethic, have filled the gaps where your common-all-garden no qualification person would normally had filled, hence there being no jobs at the bottom of the ladder.

I hear every day like I said before that they would not get out of bed for under £100 a week. Yes, you might say the same, we're a bit older than those I'm working with. We also might see the long-term gain from training. They don't.

I'm not going to argue with anyone, I'm just telling you some of the things I have witnessed and know about. Every day we have kids coming in because they've been kicked out by parents who cannot afford them and they have to go into hostels. This is seen as the first step on the housing ladder for many as under 18s get treated differently.

It is a cycle which I cannot see an end to. Parents haven't worked and neither did their parents and they had a roof over their heads and could afford to live a life we would hate, but seems to be OK for them. However, if that's all you've known, then how do they know how to get themselves out of it? They don't! And the cycle continues.......

If you knew some of the things that go on in the town I work in, honestly, it would freak you guys out. Perhaps that will be saved for another time. I know I don't know the half of it, and that half is bad enough!

mj

So basically, you are twice as irate about this?