Thatcher mainly good- Blair mainly bad?
31 January 2010, 06:26 PM
#1
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Thatcher mainly good- Blair mainly bad?
I grew up during the Thatcher years and was a grown up tax payer under Blair. I'll leave Major out of the equation.
Though Thatcher made plenty of mistakes, on the whole her legacy seems positive. she mended the broken economy that had been bankrupted, modernised industry and working practices etc.
Blair seems the opposite, though he did some good things like the peace deal in NI, on the whole his legacy seems a negative one. The economy bankrupted again, unchecked immigration, what seems like a more lawless and violent society, and then there is the war. Most people now feel that was an illegal and immoral action, and almost a slur on the british people in general.
What do you think? Please note though I am not saying that either was 100% bad or good, but on balance, the net effect of Thatcher was a good one on the country, and the net effect of Blair was a bad one
Though Thatcher made plenty of mistakes, on the whole her legacy seems positive. she mended the broken economy that had been bankrupted, modernised industry and working practices etc.
Blair seems the opposite, though he did some good things like the peace deal in NI, on the whole his legacy seems a negative one. The economy bankrupted again, unchecked immigration, what seems like a more lawless and violent society, and then there is the war. Most people now feel that was an illegal and immoral action, and almost a slur on the british people in general.
What do you think? Please note though I am not saying that either was 100% bad or good, but on balance, the net effect of Thatcher was a good one on the country, and the net effect of Blair was a bad one
31 January 2010, 06:46 PM
#2
To put it in one line; Thatcher got things under control. Blair allowed things to get out of control. IMHO.
The way I see it is Thatcher put control on a disorderly mess inherited from Wilson and Callaghan, and in doing so unloaded alot of financial burden off the state; In some cases actions taken was excessive and unpopular, but I feel it was done with good reason as continuing in the state that it was could not have been maintained indefinetly.
"New" Labour, in my view failed to control this country, leaving outdated policies in place and unchecked (some created by the previous government - but that is no excuse to leave it without making sure it applies or works in current climates) and only revising after things have deteriorated and caused a mess (and often blaming the previous government for introducing it), with little or no redress or reform until its too late.
The way I see it is Thatcher put control on a disorderly mess inherited from Wilson and Callaghan, and in doing so unloaded alot of financial burden off the state; In some cases actions taken was excessive and unpopular, but I feel it was done with good reason as continuing in the state that it was could not have been maintained indefinetly.
"New" Labour, in my view failed to control this country, leaving outdated policies in place and unchecked (some created by the previous government - but that is no excuse to leave it without making sure it applies or works in current climates) and only revising after things have deteriorated and caused a mess (and often blaming the previous government for introducing it), with little or no redress or reform until its too late.
31 January 2010, 06:52 PM
#3
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Cardiff. Wales
Posts: 11,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It is only Blair who says he admired Thatcher and he is not fit to polish her shoes. Margaret Thatcher took the country from being the sick man of Europe into a vibrant economy when many foreign investors set up their business here because of the business friendly attitude and low interest rates.
Margaret Thatcher took the unions by the throat and is much maligned for causing mass unemployment. I would say that the unions shot themselves in the foot by their greed and by their determination to hold the country to ransom. I do remember the 'Winter of Discontent', I remember 27% inflation and I also remember that the miners eventually rejected Arthur Scargill. He ended up very well off and they, mostly, ended up losing their jobs. What a great union leader.
Having put up with the winter of discontent, we were then faced with the uproar that Maggie created. These were not good times but at least we had a leader with guts.
To all those who hate her or her legacy, I would say I remember those times and, whatever mistakes she madeshe always fought for this country and,its interests and, dare I say it, she had a successful outcome in the Falklands.
CanTony Blair (ex CND) say that about Iraq?
Margaret Thatcher took the unions by the throat and is much maligned for causing mass unemployment. I would say that the unions shot themselves in the foot by their greed and by their determination to hold the country to ransom. I do remember the 'Winter of Discontent', I remember 27% inflation and I also remember that the miners eventually rejected Arthur Scargill. He ended up very well off and they, mostly, ended up losing their jobs. What a great union leader.
Having put up with the winter of discontent, we were then faced with the uproar that Maggie created. These were not good times but at least we had a leader with guts.
To all those who hate her or her legacy, I would say I remember those times and, whatever mistakes she madeshe always fought for this country and,its interests and, dare I say it, she had a successful outcome in the Falklands.
CanTony Blair (ex CND) say that about Iraq?
31 January 2010, 06:57 PM
#4
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,559
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thatcher let the working man rot .... unemployment was an acceptable way of getting the working classes into line.
Unless you were a tax payer and worker in Thatchers Britain then you have no idea what dis-content there was ..... riots in the streets, really - it was that bad! Yuppies and a "I'm alrigh, Jack" attitude was all evasive and corrosive.
Blair was much more 'inclusive' allowed those who wanted to rise up the ranks, do so. It didn't matter if you had a Silver Spoon in your mouth ..... you could get on - the chances were there for the grasping.
They both got things wrong - but, you don't win 4 General Elections unless the 'people' are 'generally' satisfied.
I know that the UK, as a whole, was better off under a Blair Government. The rich did better under Thatcher.
Unless you were a tax payer and worker in Thatchers Britain then you have no idea what dis-content there was ..... riots in the streets, really - it was that bad! Yuppies and a "I'm alrigh, Jack" attitude was all evasive and corrosive.
Blair was much more 'inclusive' allowed those who wanted to rise up the ranks, do so. It didn't matter if you had a Silver Spoon in your mouth ..... you could get on - the chances were there for the grasping.
They both got things wrong - but, you don't win 4 General Elections unless the 'people' are 'generally' satisfied.
I know that the UK, as a whole, was better off under a Blair Government. The rich did better under Thatcher.
31 January 2010, 07:08 PM
#5
That last statement is either plain daft, or more trolling.
You know, as well as the rest of us do, that the gap between the rich and the poor in the UK has widened faster under Labour over the last 13 years than at ANY OTHER TIME.
Please stop making silly statements like that, there's a good lad.
You know, as well as the rest of us do, that the gap between the rich and the poor in the UK has widened faster under Labour over the last 13 years than at ANY OTHER TIME.
Please stop making silly statements like that, there's a good lad.
31 January 2010, 07:09 PM
#6
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Type 25. Build No.34
Posts: 8,222
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mrs T certainly did some good things, most notably she destroyed socialism in this country once and for all. Therefore one of her most often forgotten legacy items was Tony Blair and the NL 'Project'.
I think the economic impact of conservative governments and Labour govs isn't by no means as clear cut as some people think. Sure the Tories got the economy out of the doldrums of the 70's, but they sure as hell put it back in the doldrums in the 90's. It is often stated that the Tories have to 'clean up the economic mess that Labour leaves behind', but consider how that has been achieved? It is equally fair to say that Labour normally has to clean up the mess the Tories make of the public services. Now I'm not claiming everything is rosey in the garden as far as NHS and Education are concerned, but they are in hell of a lot better shape now than in 1997.
Blairs legacy will unfortunately be Iraq, and there is nothing he can say or do to change that, people views on that are far too entrenched.
I believe he did some good things, as already stated Northern Ireland, but also Kosovo (without Blair, Clinton would of sat on his hands), Sierra Leone. As well as lots of good domestic social reforms.
Negatives for me are the complete failure to tackle public sector reform (although that can most of the blame for that can be laid at the feet of Brown), this is a crying shame, as this government changed the rules winning 3 elections, and ensuring that the Tories had to promise that funding for the key public services would be secure.
Which leads me onto Blairs final legacy....David Cameron
Maggie or Blair? well both for me, certainly when you compare them to the current PM!
I think the economic impact of conservative governments and Labour govs isn't by no means as clear cut as some people think. Sure the Tories got the economy out of the doldrums of the 70's, but they sure as hell put it back in the doldrums in the 90's. It is often stated that the Tories have to 'clean up the economic mess that Labour leaves behind', but consider how that has been achieved? It is equally fair to say that Labour normally has to clean up the mess the Tories make of the public services. Now I'm not claiming everything is rosey in the garden as far as NHS and Education are concerned, but they are in hell of a lot better shape now than in 1997.
Blairs legacy will unfortunately be Iraq, and there is nothing he can say or do to change that, people views on that are far too entrenched.
I believe he did some good things, as already stated Northern Ireland, but also Kosovo (without Blair, Clinton would of sat on his hands), Sierra Leone. As well as lots of good domestic social reforms.
Negatives for me are the complete failure to tackle public sector reform (although that can most of the blame for that can be laid at the feet of Brown), this is a crying shame, as this government changed the rules winning 3 elections, and ensuring that the Tories had to promise that funding for the key public services would be secure.
Which leads me onto Blairs final legacy....David Cameron
Maggie or Blair? well both for me, certainly when you compare them to the current PM!
Last edited by Martin2005; 31 January 2010 at 07:11 PM.
31 January 2010, 07:15 PM
#7
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Cardiff. Wales
Posts: 11,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just look at Britain today under Balir and Brown ,there are so many scroungers out there that have no intention of working because the state will pamper to their every whim.
I know that the UK, as a whole, was better off under a Blair Government. The rich did better under Thatcher.
Chip
Trending Topics
31 January 2010, 07:24 PM
#8
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
ssu, no Thatcher did not let the working man rot. My father was a working man and a tax payer under Thatcher, so I think its fair for me to comment as I was always aware of my fathers financial situation as a young man.
she encouraged everybody to work hard and pull themselves up by their boot straps. The working man has not become more socially mobile under Blair, hard data, as mentioned above by Alcazar proves that.
As for the 'rising through the ranks' and 'silver spoon in mouth' comments, just look at Blair and the people he surrounded himself with, ie Mandelson. They all came from humble backgrounds and comprehensive educashun right???
Martin, you are on a different planet mate! Labour have always blamed the Tories for everything, but you have gone even one step further. You say that the whole New Labour movement was the fault of the Tories!!!!!!
I'd also be interested to know what 'lots of good domestic and social reforms' you are referring to
she encouraged everybody to work hard and pull themselves up by their boot straps. The working man has not become more socially mobile under Blair, hard data, as mentioned above by Alcazar proves that.
As for the 'rising through the ranks' and 'silver spoon in mouth' comments, just look at Blair and the people he surrounded himself with, ie Mandelson. They all came from humble backgrounds and comprehensive educashun right???
Martin, you are on a different planet mate! Labour have always blamed the Tories for everything, but you have gone even one step further. You say that the whole New Labour movement was the fault of the Tories!!!!!!
I'd also be interested to know what 'lots of good domestic and social reforms' you are referring to
31 January 2010, 07:28 PM
#9
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Type 25. Build No.34
Posts: 8,222
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ssu, no Thatcher did not let the working man rot. My father was a working man and a tax payer under Thatcher, so I think its fair for me to comment as I was always aware of my fathers financial situation as a young man.
she encouraged everybody to work hard and pull themselves up by their boot straps. The working man has not become more socially mobile under Blair, hard data, as mentioned above by Alcazar proves that.
As for the 'rising through the ranks' and 'silver spoon in mouth' comments, just look at Blair and the people he surrounded himself with, ie Mandelson. They all came from humble backgrounds and comprehensive educashun right???
Martin, you are on a different planet mate! Labour have always blamed the Tories for everything, but you have gone even one step further. You say that the whole New Labour movement was the fault of the Tories!!!!!!
I'd also be interested to know what 'lots of good domestic and social reforms' you are referring to
she encouraged everybody to work hard and pull themselves up by their boot straps. The working man has not become more socially mobile under Blair, hard data, as mentioned above by Alcazar proves that.
As for the 'rising through the ranks' and 'silver spoon in mouth' comments, just look at Blair and the people he surrounded himself with, ie Mandelson. They all came from humble backgrounds and comprehensive educashun right???
Martin, you are on a different planet mate! Labour have always blamed the Tories for everything, but you have gone even one step further. You say that the whole New Labour movement was the fault of the Tories!!!!!!
I'd also be interested to know what 'lots of good domestic and social reforms' you are referring to
I was reffering to reforms such as minimum wage, Sure Start, better maternal and parternal care arrangements etc, or didn't those things happen?
Last edited by Martin2005; 31 January 2010 at 07:30 PM.
31 January 2010, 07:30 PM
#10
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,559
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Or, quite possibly someones opinion?
I said that we are a more 'inclusive' society - at no point did I say the gap between the poor and rich was closing - it's not the same thing. There are so many more people in the UK today, so many more workers, so many more businesses that you simply cannot compare 'gaps' over history with any accuracy.
I believe that the poor can rise up the wealth league much better under Labour .... or course, the rich do very well too - it's called 'inclusivity'! 1% increase in general wealth means the gap widens .... BUT, the poor are STILL 1% better off!!
I won't even give this sentence a reply as it is plain stupid.
I believe that the poor can rise up the wealth league much better under Labour .... or course, the rich do very well too - it's called 'inclusivity'! 1% increase in general wealth means the gap widens .... BUT, the poor are STILL 1% better off!!
I won't even give this sentence a reply as it is plain stupid.
31 January 2010, 07:37 PM
#11
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,559
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm not being rude and I hope the irony of it isn't lost on you ... brilliant piece of writing
31 January 2010, 08:01 PM
#12
No Pete, you DIDN'T say anything about an inclusive society, you said, and I quote:
Now since I have proven that to be patently wrong, and you have tried, unsuccessfully, to wriggle out of it, PLEASE stop making silly statements, there's a good lad.
Originally Posted by SunnySideUp
The rich did better under Thatcher
31 January 2010, 08:14 PM
#13
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,559
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Blair was much more 'inclusive'"
We can play semantics all night, but I'm not too interested right now - so, you'll have to wait until I'm ready .. there's a good lad.
31 January 2010, 09:02 PM
#14
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Far Corfe
Posts: 3,618
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I lived under many PM's but one thing I have noticed with them all is that two terms is maximum before they think they are in power for good. They start to take the public / electorate for granted, passing laws and policies they want not what the public need,
So it doesnt matter whether youre Labour Tory, BNP or whatever we need a change as this bunch needs removing.
So it doesnt matter whether youre Labour Tory, BNP or whatever we need a change as this bunch needs removing.
31 January 2010, 10:09 PM
#16
Scooby Senior
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: West Midlands
Posts: 5,763
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It is only Blair who says he admired Thatcher and he is not fit to polish her shoes. Margaret Thatcher took the country from being the sick man of Europe into a vibrant economy when many foreign investors set up their business here because of the business friendly attitude and low interest rates.
Margaret Thatcher took the unions by the throat and is much maligned for causing mass unemployment. I would say that the unions shot themselves in the foot by their greed and by their determination to hold the country to ransom. I do remember the 'Winter of Discontent', I remember 27% inflation and I also remember that the miners eventually rejected Arthur Scargill. He ended up very well off and they, mostly, ended up losing their jobs. What a great union leader.
Having put up with the winter of discontent, we were then faced with the uproar that Maggie created. These were not good times but at least we had a leader with guts.
To all those who hate her or her legacy, I would say I remember those times and, whatever mistakes she madeshe always fought for this country and,its interests and, dare I say it, she had a successful outcome in the Falklands.
CanTony Blair (ex CND) say that about Iraq?
Margaret Thatcher took the unions by the throat and is much maligned for causing mass unemployment. I would say that the unions shot themselves in the foot by their greed and by their determination to hold the country to ransom. I do remember the 'Winter of Discontent', I remember 27% inflation and I also remember that the miners eventually rejected Arthur Scargill. He ended up very well off and they, mostly, ended up losing their jobs. What a great union leader.
Having put up with the winter of discontent, we were then faced with the uproar that Maggie created. These were not good times but at least we had a leader with guts.
To all those who hate her or her legacy, I would say I remember those times and, whatever mistakes she madeshe always fought for this country and,its interests and, dare I say it, she had a successful outcome in the Falklands.
CanTony Blair (ex CND) say that about Iraq?
mb
31 January 2010, 10:20 PM
#17
Scooby Senior
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: West Midlands
Posts: 5,763
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
31 January 2010, 10:36 PM
#19
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Inverg
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Would I be correct is assuming that either this is a mainly Conservative Torie dominated board or may be its we all hate Labour. My dilemma is that all the main parties are full of hypocritical goons that are only there to better themselves and Not to serve the public. I remember the Tory government and Thatcher, There was as much scandal maybe more than there is now. Either way both parties don't deserve a single vote this election, Which begs the question which of the two evils do we vote for? More of the same or some form of revamped Conservative party. Back to the OP, Thatcher good? That would depend on which side of the border you stayed, middle class or working class. She never did the working class any favors, but in turn they never helped themselves.
Cue the Flaming!
Cue the Flaming!
Last edited by spray1974; 31 January 2010 at 10:38 PM.
31 January 2010, 10:49 PM
#21
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Inverg
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hang on! what about that fellow who was plastered all over the news last week TB 
31 January 2010, 10:52 PM
#22
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: riding the crest of a wave ...
Posts: 46,493
Likes: 0
Received 13 Likes
on
12 Posts
Thatch didnt give a **** about the people her eyes were on the economy, always - she was badly advised tho towards the end and hang also for too long
But she wasnt in it to be a career politician like Bambi whos just an excellent pr man !
I mean **** me i bet they themselves actually privately cringe themselves when the term 'new labour' is mentioned nowadays - its the same old labour , spend as much as possible before being voted out
But she wasnt in it to be a career politician like Bambi whos just an excellent pr man !
I mean **** me i bet they themselves actually privately cringe themselves when the term 'new labour' is mentioned nowadays - its the same old labour , spend as much as possible before being voted out
31 January 2010, 10:54 PM
#23
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (9)
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: .
Posts: 20,035
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oh FFS not another Thatcher rose tinted spectacles thread.
As I posted in another recent thread:
Shall I tell you what Thatcher stood for - dog eat dog, greed is good, I'm alright Jack!!!
She sold off the country's assets to buy votes
She took us into a war she could have avoided to win votes.
She killed off whole communities over a petty argument with an equally devisive union leader
She created the greed is good dog eat dog dociety in which we now live
She created the expenses system under which most MPs ripped off the tax payer for many many years and thereby created career politicians.
She dismantled the unions but sadly by dismantling manufacturing in the UK forcing our economy to rely on the financial services sector to a much greater degree than is sensible.... I am sure I don't need to explain why that is a bad thing right now
She deliberately created an under class and encouraged a black economy creating a two tier society.
She put 4 million on the dole at a time then the world was not in recession!!!
She presided over economic mismanagement that drove house prices sky high and then led to 16% mortgage rates forcing in many families both parents out to work thereby damaging the fabric of family life .... the start of the breakdown of the social fabric of the UK that so many of you short sightedly blame Labour for....
Shall I go on?
As I posted in another recent thread:
Shall I tell you what Thatcher stood for - dog eat dog, greed is good, I'm alright Jack!!!
She sold off the country's assets to buy votes
She took us into a war she could have avoided to win votes.
She killed off whole communities over a petty argument with an equally devisive union leader
She created the greed is good dog eat dog dociety in which we now live
She created the expenses system under which most MPs ripped off the tax payer for many many years and thereby created career politicians.
She dismantled the unions but sadly by dismantling manufacturing in the UK forcing our economy to rely on the financial services sector to a much greater degree than is sensible.... I am sure I don't need to explain why that is a bad thing right now
She deliberately created an under class and encouraged a black economy creating a two tier society.
She put 4 million on the dole at a time then the world was not in recession!!!
She presided over economic mismanagement that drove house prices sky high and then led to 16% mortgage rates forcing in many families both parents out to work thereby damaging the fabric of family life .... the start of the breakdown of the social fabric of the UK that so many of you short sightedly blame Labour for....
Shall I go on?
31 January 2010, 10:58 PM
#24
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (9)
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: .
Posts: 20,035
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To the posters above praising the Falklands war. Thatcher chose to not enter into any diplomacy prior to the invasion despite the fact most advisors at the time felt the situation could have been avoided by diplomatic negotiation.
The fact she was in danger of losing an election and there is nothing like a good war to get patriotism running high had nothing to do with it of course.
So how does that make her any better than Blair????
The fact she was in danger of losing an election and there is nothing like a good war to get patriotism running high had nothing to do with it of course.
So how does that make her any better than Blair????
31 January 2010, 11:00 PM
#25
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: My turbo blows, air lots of it!!
Posts: 9,073
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oh FFS not another Thatcher rose tinted spectacles thread.
As I posted in another recent thread:
Shall I tell you what Thatcher stood for - dog eat dog, greed is good, I'm alright Jack!!!
She sold off the country's assets to buy votes
She took us into a war she could have avoided to win votes.
She killed off whole communities over a petty argument with an equally devisive union leader
She created the greed is good dog eat dog dociety in which we now live
She created the expenses system under which most MPs ripped off the tax payer for many many years and thereby created career politicians.
She dismantled the unions but sadly by dismantling manufacturing in the UK forcing our economy to rely on the financial services sector to a much greater degree than is sensible.... I am sure I don't need to explain why that is a bad thing right now
She deliberately created an under class and encouraged a black economy creating a two tier society.
She put 4 million on the dole at a time then the world was not in recession!!!
She presided over economic mismanagement that drove house prices sky high and then led to 16% mortgage rates forcing in many families both parents out to work thereby damaging the fabric of family life .... the start of the breakdown of the social fabric of the UK that so many of you short sightedly blame Labour for....
Shall I go on?
As I posted in another recent thread:
Shall I tell you what Thatcher stood for - dog eat dog, greed is good, I'm alright Jack!!!
She sold off the country's assets to buy votes
She took us into a war she could have avoided to win votes.
She killed off whole communities over a petty argument with an equally devisive union leader
She created the greed is good dog eat dog dociety in which we now live
She created the expenses system under which most MPs ripped off the tax payer for many many years and thereby created career politicians.
She dismantled the unions but sadly by dismantling manufacturing in the UK forcing our economy to rely on the financial services sector to a much greater degree than is sensible.... I am sure I don't need to explain why that is a bad thing right now
She deliberately created an under class and encouraged a black economy creating a two tier society.
She put 4 million on the dole at a time then the world was not in recession!!!
She presided over economic mismanagement that drove house prices sky high and then led to 16% mortgage rates forcing in many families both parents out to work thereby damaging the fabric of family life .... the start of the breakdown of the social fabric of the UK that so many of you short sightedly blame Labour for....
Shall I go on?
31 January 2010, 11:02 PM
#26
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,559
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thatcher was a borderline dictator ... don't forget it.
She was a class act in pure Politics - as Mandelson is today.
But, she destroyed the Manufacturing Base of this country.
She had her own lie to parliament - the Belgrano.
Blair brought in the minimum wage and many other things people see fit to forget.
We had civil riots under Thatcher, we had father against son, neighbour against neighbour .... she divided to conquer - not one thought for the common man and his simple needs.
The reason that the Tories are not way ahead in the polls probably has a lot to do with the fact that there are still people around who remember how bad it was, and how bad it could get again .......... do you really want to risk the next 5 years on a hunch that change is needed? I don't think the public are that brave or that stupid!
She was a class act in pure Politics - as Mandelson is today.
But, she destroyed the Manufacturing Base of this country.
She had her own lie to parliament - the Belgrano.
Blair brought in the minimum wage and many other things people see fit to forget.
We had civil riots under Thatcher, we had father against son, neighbour against neighbour .... she divided to conquer - not one thought for the common man and his simple needs.
The reason that the Tories are not way ahead in the polls probably has a lot to do with the fact that there are still people around who remember how bad it was, and how bad it could get again .......... do you really want to risk the next 5 years on a hunch that change is needed? I don't think the public are that brave or that stupid!
31 January 2010, 11:07 PM
#28
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: riding the crest of a wave ...
Posts: 46,493
Likes: 0
Received 13 Likes
on
12 Posts
Or, quite possibly someones opinion?
I said that we are a more 'inclusive' society - at no point did I say the gap between the poor and rich was closing - it's not the same thing. There are so many more people in the UK today, so many more workers, so many more businesses that you simply cannot compare 'gaps' over history with any accuracy.
I believe that the poor can rise up the wealth league much better under Labour .... or course, the rich do very well too - it's called 'inclusivity'! 1% increase in general wealth means the gap widens .... BUT, the poor are STILL 1% better off!!
I won't even give this sentence a reply as it is plain stupid.
I said that we are a more 'inclusive' society - at no point did I say the gap between the poor and rich was closing - it's not the same thing. There are so many more people in the UK today, so many more workers, so many more businesses that you simply cannot compare 'gaps' over history with any accuracy.
I believe that the poor can rise up the wealth league much better under Labour .... or course, the rich do very well too - it's called 'inclusivity'! 1% increase in general wealth means the gap widens .... BUT, the poor are STILL 1% better off!!
I won't even give this sentence a reply as it is plain stupid.
its been been reported in the news IN THE LAST WEEK that theres a bigger divide than ever and that social mobility and a chance to do better in life if 'raised poor' is even more unlikely than it was when 20 years ago
your trolling
31 January 2010, 11:30 PM
#29
SN Fairy Godmother
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Far Far Away
Posts: 35,246
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I rather liked Thatcher, as I said on another thread. This lot have proved to be an easy lay (excuse the pun). No way, would Thatch have allowed the ripping off of the tax payer by MPs, the scrounging layabouts and the constant influx of foreigners.
I actually have a letter from her, true, after I complained about the tax laws, at the time.
Wish I had someone like her to vote for in May, as I am at a loss who to go for. It certainly won't be the shower who are in power now
I actually have a letter from her, true, after I complained about the tax laws, at the time.
Wish I had someone like her to vote for in May, as I am at a loss who to go for. It certainly won't be the shower who are in power now
