devils_ad69

Why are the anti-car brigade constantly on about speeding?

Don't the vasT majority of accidents occur within the posted speed limit?

Isn't it better to deal with the causes of accidents (bad driving, usually) rather than slowing vehicles down so that when they do crash, the damage is less.

Do these people need detailed research to tell us that accidents at 30MPH cause more damage than accidents at 50MPH???? Why not try to prevent accidents in the first place!!

Absolute muppets.

[edited to correct typo's]

[Edited by devils_ad69 - 2/22/2002 10:35:01 AM]

imatrukahs

How do you prevent an accident?By driving slower..of course,paying more attension to the road,ie not gassing on the phone,eating/drinking etc etc...it takes common sense on OUR part.But speed is a major factor.

****i have been known to do all the above ****

Seamus300

It all boils down to whats considered socially acceptable I guess, speeding seems to be an easy target to address, rather than finding ways to stop crazy people within the speed limits. I'm with you though, Northampton has a fleet of these "safety camera vans", there is no way I'll be convinced that these aren't simply revenue generating machines with the pretense of being there to slow people down. If they are there to slow people down why do they sit in sneaky places (and it isn't always on motorway bridges, have seen them in field gateways).

devils_ad69

Ima,

<How do you prevent an accident?By driving slower>

Eh? Don't you mean driving at a more suitable speed for the prevailing conditions?

Driving slower to prevent accidents is like saying Concorde should fly slower to prevent crashing. It is not the speed that *causes* the crash but I do admit, speed can be a contribuoty factor.

See what I am getting at?

imatrukahs

Boll0cks mate......the Concorde pilot is a highly skilled person!He's paid extremely handsome for that...not a good comparison!

We road users on the other hand arnt....you say about time and place..your right,but the issue with the cops/anti-car brigade is slowing down in 30 limits during the day,which is correct.

[Edited by imatrukahs - 2/22/2002 11:23:18 AM]

devils_ad69

Ima,

Simply sticking to a speed limit can be dangerous.

Which is safer:

A driver doing 30mph in a 30 limit who is checking his speedo every two seconds and not watching the road correctly, or,

A driver doing 25mph in a 30 limit who *has* spotted the kid stood in between those parked cars and has adjusted his speed down further?

Improving driver training will improve the accident/casulaty statistics. Telling people to stick to speed limits does NOTHING to make them safer drivers. Only more training can do that.

NumptyScrub

Hmmm... limit *every* car to a maximum of 20mph, and then see how much the accident rate has increased in the weeks afterwards.

People would gun it to the 20 limit, and would not want to stop FOR ANYTHING, I bet you would see more dangerous driving than if you removed all speed limits from the roads and concentrated on a much more involved driving test (that included all the advanced driving skills/test as well).

It is drivers that cause accidents, not cars or speed.

And before you ask, I am a *crap* driver with a fast car. Which is why I drive nice and slow in town, and keep to my lane even when "caning" it round country lanes. No racing lines for me on the public highway, that's just plain stupid... all it takes is one oncoming vehicle and you've got several people injured/dead that could easily have been prevented.

Derek

imatrukahs

This is a subject NO ONE can win.Unless you ban motor vehicles or people..

devils_ad69

Ima,

<This is a subject NO ONE can win.Unless you ban motor vehicles or people.>

Don't swallow the spiel from the anti-car brigade.

ptholt

I wouldn't say that speed in itself is a MAJOR contributor.

I would however say inappropriate speed for conditions, road, driver or vehicle ability is.

That being the case, doesn't that mean its a driving issue rather than a speeding one?


[Edited by ptholt - 2/22/2002 12:29:13 PM]

imatrukahs

I think your all too intelligent for me,so i will bow out gracefully knowing,i know what i am on about...

devils_ad69

Ima,

That's the whole idea about sharing opinions/views so that we all learn from each other's experiences.

Do stay and explain your viewpoint.

Quote from a classic film:

"It seems to me that it us up to us to show you where you might be going wrong" (or something like that!)

Anyone?

BOB.T

well.... I know I pay far more attention to what I'm doing at 90 down a windy lane compared to 45 behind a granny!

SWRTWannabe

I'm sure this is somewhere on the government's agenda anyway

Boost II

iTrader: (1)

This speed causes accidents thing annoys me too when its basically lack of concentation or coordination that is the real cause. Speed does make accidents more severe though.

I suppose if we all drove at 100mph all the time on every road there would be millions of accidents yet if we all drove at 5mph on all roads all the time there would be hardly any accidents. This is pretty hard to dispute.

I think the truth is most accidents involve either dithering old dears that revese into things and pull out in front of people or involve people who enjoy the excitement of driving towards their limits and occasionally get it wrong. It is a shame society only shuns the latter group - seems a bit unfair as nobody does it deliberately. The most unjust thing is that the arrogant b'stards that drive everywhere in a rage cutting people up, jumping lights etc seem to get away with it.

[Edited by Boost II - 2/22/2002 3:13:17 PM]

NumptyScrub

Nah, if we all drove at 5mph there'd be a hell of a lot more 5mph shunts... speed is only a contributing factor to the *seriousness* of the accident. Buy a Volvo, and you'd feel pretty much invincible if there was a 5mph limit imposed... you'd hardly even be looking at the road 'cos there's no way you'd be hurt in a low speed shunt

It would curb the amount of deaths and serious injury's, however. So in that sense it has improved road safety, but I doubt it would improve the "total number of accidents" figures at all. We'd still get shafted on insurance too, no doubt

Put a careful driver in this situation and there'd be no accidents, put your "average"" driver in, and there'd (allegedly )be loads... it's all about the person behind the wheel, not the piece of machinery.

And I didn't buy a rally-derived vehicle to poodle about at 5mph, I bought it to cane about like a loon whenever *I* felt the conditions were safe to do so. If my judgement on this proves to be suspect, I just hope (and pray) that I am the only one to suffer for it.

Derek

MattN

I have evidence to prove it is just a source of revenue.

At work got a letter saying car reg xxxxx was speeding on such a date. We asked for proof and they sent a photo. The best bit is we then said we couldn't identify the driver (although we knew exactly who it was). The response we got was, OK then just pay the fine and don't worry about the points!

So, no one was in any trouble as long as they got their money.

A crime is a crime and you shouldn't be able to buy your way out of it. seems to me as long as they get money from the fines they are happy.

MatthewC

I get really peed off hearing that speed is "a major contributory factor". No study has shown this. Here's one you can read about for yourselves:
http://www.speed-trap.co.uk/Facts&Figures/Facts&Figures_Home.htm

It's a TRL report. Here's the main point:
"
What this means is that in 7.3% of the accidents, speed was one of many factors, and in only 6% of the accidents was it a definite causal factor. Look at the top 4 factors and you'll see that they can generally be categorised as the old police adage of "driving without due care and attention."
"

So, the FACTS show that driving too fast (irrespective of what the posted limit may be) is a very MINOR factor.

Gordo

MathewC

agreed - from memory there are also stats that show the absolute number of deaths on the road per annum have stayed pretty static since records began.

I'd have thought the things to focus on should surely be (no particular order):

- re-tests on a regular basis from an earlier age
- random eye-sight testing
- drug testing (apparently more casualties involved in fatalities have illegal drugs in their bodies than do those with alcohol - how many people do you know that drive post spliff?)
- better driver training (done at length on here before but a level of training nearer that of advanced training re awareness etc wouldn't go amiss)

I'm sure there are more - speed is rarely the main factor in an accident, it's just the easiest to jump on, measure against targets and raise revenue from.

Gordo

GATSO

I was under the impression that the Police had to make themselves and there camaras more visable.This would reduce speeding afences before they are commited so that the motorist would slow down but know they get you afterwards.The power of money mmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Looks like a pilot issue in Coventry has a fleet of old T5s which they abandon at black spots, or where speeding is common , one for the black book?

AndyC_772

iTrader: (2)

Gordo:

For the record, I agree with all four of your points wholeheartedly. Better driver training would be my no. 1 priority. Of all the accidents and near misses I've witnessed in 10 years of motoring, none have been anything to do with excessive speed, they've all been down to poor observation on the part of one or more of the parties involved.

Let's all be thankful that there aren't acceleration and cornering G-force limits too, that would really suck the fun out of my life. Personally I don't really mind doing 60mph when it takes just 5 fun-filled seconds to get there (On a clear, out-of-town road of course)

Andy.

Katana

Am I the only person here that thinks that the best time to be a hard core criminal is now as the police are too busy getting rich from issuing speeding tickets? Maybe while the police are too busy trying to entrapt speeders, I should join up the Colombian Ring and have my name illuminated on a blimp while living in a palace.

GATSO

I would not say I have the need for speed but I used to have Mavrick on the bottom of the reg plate on my hayabusa, 180 in 8 tenths not on a public road though? superb.