Sonic'

Absolutely terrible BBC NEWS | England | Sussex | Puppy tails docked with scissors

Hope she does get a custodial sentence

Markus

I don't see a mention of what age the pups were when the tails were docked

It's a somewhat emotive subject to say the least. I'm pro docking for certain breeds of dog, one example being Weimaraners. I've seen the damage that can be done to a tail of a weim that hasn't been docked and they've been out on the hunt, or just running through thick undergrowth. Breeders tend to dock Weims as they don't always know what the pup will be doing.
Some people say from the outset they'll be a pet, showdog, or trained to the gun, others don't and I'd rather the pup be docked rather than having it's tail damaged in later life requiring it to be removed.

From what I recall, I think pups are generally docked very soon after they are born, fairly sure it's at least within a week of them being born. I don't recall my breeder friend saying they bled everywhere and screamed a lot, and I'm sure she would have said as she'd not want to see her pups unhappy.
What I should clarify is that the dogs are docked by a vet and not by the breeder

** edit **
Pro docking as I am, this foolish woman does deserve punishment as she could well have caused physical and mental anguish to her dogs by docking them herself unless she's a vet and I see no evidence to suggest she is.

NACRO

Whitehawk, what a surprise.

Sonic'

Im not sure whether it is because she docked them with a pair of scissors, why couldnt she have taken them to a vet to be docked, or would a vet not do it ?

Leslie

I am unable to comment on the reasons tor docking, but to do so without anaesthetic is a shameful business in my opinion and I think it should be done by a qualified vet under controlled conditions.

I hope that woman gets it in the neck.

Les

Markus

It's probably due to it being illegal to dock any dogs tail. I think that from March 2006, it's illegal for even vets to dock, unless the dog is a working dog, eg; police dog.

Markus

I do not believe there is any anathestic given whilst docking, and I think part of the reason may be the age of the pups, as they possibly may not come round from the anathestic, but I could be wrong.

Devildog

Always an emotive subject.

As an owner of a formerly docked breed, and being very frinedly with the breeders concerned, I am being aware of the methods employed.

Personally I'm happy either way - as long as its done humanely.

Many "TV" vets will tell you its a horrible thing to do. Most normal vets were always quite happy to do it as they saw no suffering. I suspect the vet quoted falls into the "jump on the bandwagon" camp.

Many dockings were done from birth using a tight band until the tail falls off (usually very quickly) It is said to be stress free for pups and mother. They don't scream, they don't bleed and it leaves a very tidy, clean and, importantly, closed wound without any need to cut or stitch.

Scientific tests have indicated that if done early enough, the pups nervous systems are not sufficiently developed for them to feel any pain - so I can only assume the vet quoted has been docking pups that were too old.

Callus Man

Docking is on the same level as circumcision. Pros and cons either way. Its not natural or nature's way to chop bits off.

Same with having ears chopped (dobermans etc).

Obviously it should be done in as humane as possible incurring as little pain as possible. But one questions as to if it right on not.

I do think its cruel, but at the same time accept its practiced.

Kenneth WRX

Maybe they couldn't afford the vet bills?

Sonic'

Im sure from the sale of 8 pups of that breed would have more than covered the costs of docking

The question I was asking was more whether a Vet would actually dock the tails or not as to the reason why she didnt go to a Vets

Markus

To be quite blunt, if they cannot afford to pay for docking then I would assume they probably cannot afford the vaccinations that pups would require, in which case I'd consider them very irresponsible breeders and they really should not be breeding dogs.

I've read a little more and as of March/April 2007, apart from a dog classed as a working dog, and there are some strict guidlines as to what is classed as a working dog, along with the breed/group of the dog, it is now illegal for dogs to be docked. It will also be illegal to show any dog at a public show that has been docked after the aforementioned date, so you will start seeing show dogs with tails.

I'd assume she thought it'd be ok for her to dock the pups herself as the vet would not do it. Probably thought she'd not get found out. My guess is that she thought "most rotties are docked, I'll not be able to sell them if these aren't docked", not knowning about the new regulations making it illegal to dock them. She's very foolish indeed and will face the consequnces of her actions.

Sonic'

Yes indeed

Im not against the docking as such, but more the way this woman has gone about a bit of diy with a pair of scissors, probably causing pain and distress to the pups

jasey

Thank **** they got her before it was time for castration

docking for working dogs only sounds like the best way forward - no need for for some over weight lard **** who's just gonna keep his owner company down the pub !

mart360

So does that mean sheep can no longer have there tails docked?

I think some dogs look better with the tails docked.

And it would prolly help ars* happy dogs (Labradors)

they wag the dam things so much its a wonder it dosn't snap off


Mart

Markus

Compared to a Weim a Lab has a larger and I'd say more robust tail. Lily's tail certainl seems happy to withstand her bashing it against various things most of the day

pimmo2000

iTrader: (6)

I think the only people who would want this done would be the "hard" guys who want the dog to look mean.. I'm glad its been banned.

I remember a jackrussle when I was young having his tail biten off my the owner to do it in on clean go... bit sick even for me that

Devildog

That's a bit steroptypical mate.

Bear in mind that up until recently there was no choice. Kenel club rules dictated which dogs were docked and which not.

Rotties were proper working dogs, cattle herders primarily and no tail meant no stamping damage.

If I had a choice I'd have a docked Rottie everytime, because:

A) "our" breeder always employed humane docking methods
b) No tail is cleaner and more hygenic for the dogs
c) Never had an "oh ****" coffee table moment.

Now, I'll happily concede that "c" is absolutely no reason to dock. But having had dogs in the family since I was born and having years of experience of many different breeds, "b" is most certainly a bigger plus than many realise.

But our next Rottie pup (booked for early next year) will of course have a tail and I'll be quite happy with that

Unless they change the legislation again, of course.

Sonic'

We nearly had Scooby docked, as he wags his tail that much that he has no fur on the end of it, and kept bleeding

Vet said only option would have been to Dock, but we decided against it at the time, and hoped that it would settle down which it did, Scrappy our other old dog had exactly the same, and actually broke the tip of his tail for wagging it too much

But again we didnt want to Dock

ScoobyDoo555

Our Cocker Spaniel pup has had his tail docked. I see NO problem with it at all. As long as its done humanely. Which I suspect is why this story has made the headlines.

My lab has a rather robust tail too - bl00dy thing's like a whip!!

Dan

miss*scoobygav555*

My Springer Spaniel had his tail docked at a pup because there that thin at the end they just get damaged and infected and anyone that knows what springers are like they never stop wagging there tail so it was only fair because he would of ended up hurting himself!!

I don't see a problem with it as long as its done properly!!

kbsub

I owned working undocked Spaniels for years , They went into the thickest of undergrowth and sometimes ended up with small cuts around the nose face area , but they never ever damaged a tail.

How would you like your tail cut off because it improved your looks ?