The Zohan

Was talking to someone about this last night.

It was around 3 or so years ago, two blokes (i think, may have been a third/driver) robbed a bank, in body armour and using AK's with armour piercing rounds. these guy where hard as nails (or off thier heads) taking rounds and returning fire at the same time without batting an eye They looked well trained!

The Police where outgunned but eventually took the two down.

The whole thing lasted around 5 mins or so and it not unlike a scene from a John Woo film but real!

Not trying to glamourise it but it is an incredible piece of footage, something like 2500 rounds where expended to bring them down.

Was explaining it to someone but pictures are far better than words, does anyone have it or a link to it. It has been on UK tv before.

Thanks

Paul

Tiggs

http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/1997/yea...5.robbery.html

"these guy where hard as nails (or off thier heads)"

the ones that got killed by police were, i assume, the later!

The Zohan

Hi Tiggs, yes that looks like the robbery, there is a longer version of it that i have seen. Did not realise it was 9 years ago mind!

boomer

I would love to see the longer version (first saw it on TV years ago) - the event was quite frightening.

Two things were particularly scarey

Firstly, their body armour meant that the police bullets literally bounced off them, so they couldn't be stopped.

Secondly, their armour piercing rifles were actually shooting straight through the cars that the police were hiding behind!!!

The chopper pilot filming it was brave, to say the least.

mb

2000TLondon

http://www.student.oulu.fi/~hmikkola/shootout.html

It appears there is actually a film about it starring Michael Madsen called 44 minutes!!!!

Low rent, no doubt!

I remember this well, my brother was in LA at the time. Like watching HEAT!

If you search google for North Hollywood shootout (or bank robbery) you get some good pages!

P1Fanatic

I remember seeing it on Americas Greatest Shootouts. IIRC the rounds werent anything special - a 7.62mm rd from an AK would have no problem going through a car door etc.

Also I believe the local cops only had 9mm weapons and as the guys had full body armour on they may as well have been peashooters. Then they borrowed some guns from a local gun store and thats when they took them out.

It was like a scene out of the film Heat.

Simon.

Chris5-0

Interestingly enough we were talking about this at work recently as to how this event changed policing in America.

The whole incident lasted approx 45 mins, the two robbers were fans of 'Heat' and even stuck watches to their gloves like in the film. They'd already done 2 or 3 similar robberies i think but were looking for a big payday out of this one. They planned to be in the bank 8 mins (time for cops to arrive) but were spotted by a police cruiser as they went in and it went on from there.

Cops at the time were carrying 9mm slp (self loading pistols, usually bereta's) and had a shot gun as well with i believe small shot ammo. The robbers had AK47's in various designs with 100 round ammo drums and, more frighteningly an HK 91 i believe, which is a scary piece of kit.

The cops called for backup and hid behind cars etc thinking the robbers had handguns etc. In the ensuing battle over 3,000 rounds were fired by the two robbers with about 1500 to 2000 being fired by the police. Had the two been skilled in their shooting it would have been a massacre, the cops cover didn't stand up against armour piecing rounds and a couple were shot through their cars and body armour. Luckily the SWAT team were training together and got to the scene as quickly as possible.

As the robbers tried to leave in a vehicle one stayed out and sprayed rounds at anyone in the area, luckily for the cops he had a stoppage and instead of clearing it, easily done, he threw it and pulled his pistol. Now at a 50/50 standoff the cops managed to wound him several times causing him to drop his pistol and when he picked it up he either deliberately or by accident, shot himself in the head, dropping immediately.

Meanwhile his mate had tried to hijack a truck but found himself face to face with SWAT who had arrived and an exchange from about 10 feet away began, finishing with the second robber being hit 29 times and dying.

They were VERY luck many weren't killed.

This incident led to cops over there being issued with assault rifles such as the AR-15 and recently the M4 in case they ever come across ths kind of firepower again.

Very frightening.

The Zohan

Hi Chris
By a strange coincidence there is a documentary on this shootout running as part of the Shootout series on The History Channel and it is on right now and starts again at 17:00hrs on History+1

Chris5-0

I know!!! How weird, just switched over the TV and seen the last 10 minutes of it!! It was 1500 and 600 rounds for baddies/cops not what i said ealier. Definitely going to watch it now!!

The Zohan

And me!, just off to make a coffee and ensconce myself on the settee.

boomer

Chris,

thanks for the detailed info - fascinating!

Paul,

Is THC on FreeView - if so i'll be keeping my eyes open for a repeat (in the next 2 or 3 days knowing FreeView )

Cheers,

mb

Brendan Hughes

But Chris - were they carrying ID cards?

The Zohan

Hi there

It is part of the series called Shootout, there are 8 or so of them. The whole series is pretty go but the Hollywood robbery one was very well done using reconstruction and real footage of the event.

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

you don't need armour piercing rounds to go through a soft skinned vehicle any decent calibre bullet will do the trick, low velocity 9mm will go through a car so when you see the cops hiding behind the car doors and being shot at with m16s it is all bollox and hollywood dramatics.

The Zohan

too true however these guys did use some ap rounds, that will be the ones that went thorugh the bodywork and engine block out the other side and still did damage!

9mm ss sub-sonic rounds will go though a car door, maybe out the other side as long as it is at a close range say 100m or less assuming they dooes not come into contact with the seats/frames or something to stop it.

7.62 and 5.56 will have no trouble whatsoever. i remember a talk about the velocity and damage a 7.62 std ball round would do fired by an old SLR (same cal as a Russian AK but the chinese ak is 5.56). it would quite happly penetrate the side of a Russian troop carrier and kill anyone it hit Also how during the Falklands the Argentinians also using SLRs returned fire, hit one solidier in the arm pretty much severeing it, the bullet just shattered the bone and the force torn it off almost.
Just have a look at the size if a std field dressing as carried by our troops.


Hollywood would have it that you can just get up and walk away from a gunshot, the reality is usually something else.

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

Paul I was in the army I already know what a standard ball round will do

The Zohan

Cool, not just for your benefit everyone is entitled to my opinion

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

LOL good point

CrisPDuk

I seem to recall that Jeremy Clarkson demonstrated just how (in)effective a car is at stopping a bullet in the Guns installment of his 'Inventions that Changed the World' series

Chris5-0

Car's don't protect nothing nowadays, even a .22 round will go through doors if it hits in the right spot!!

We had a range and penetration demo and it was one hell of an eye opener as to what calibre does what. I know one thing gor sure, i don't want to be hit by any of them!