16vmarc

I posted recently that for the last 6 months id been keeping a record to cover my back at work, as whenever i get called into the ofice they leave it so long i dont know the job theyre referring to etc. So ive being writing every little thing down that has prevented me from gettign the work done on time and all the little problems ive come across.

Today i was called into the office, i refused to go in. The manager stormed off to see the personell manager who said i had to go in. So i went in with the union guy with the records id being keeping.

When i got there he said he was fuming and when he calls me he expects me to come and that it hadnt got off to a good start. He asked why i refused to go in. I explained that after evey job im being called into the office for a booking for taking too long etc and im sick of it. I said that was the reason i had being keeping the records to cover myself. At this point he interupted me and started waffling, to which i said, are you going to be quiet or a you going to keep on talking over the top of me? You asked me a question now let me answer it!! I thought he was going to explode at this point! He tried to say that i hadnt been keeping a record for 6 months until he saw the last time i was in there.

He wasnt prepared to listen to anything i said and wouldnt look at my reports stating that because i didnt come when he called me he wasnt prepared for any negotiations.

He said he was going to book me regardless because of this and that i had 7 days to appeal.

He said that what i did was a sackable offence and that they were either going to sack me or suspend me with pay, he said he would give me the benefit of the doubt though and said i dont know who put you upto it. Said he was shocked with the union guy too for going along with it.

When i got back to the workshop i was given a job to do, that id never done before with another guy and they took him off it. They were then going to put someone else with me. He too was taken off. Someone else was appointed and he too wasnt allowed to work with me. The manager stated that he wasnt upto doing the job (this was the union guy ironcally)

A few people in workshop were on my side and one of the team leaders even had a go at the manager saying it was out of order how they were treating me, and especially making me do this job alone and he said that the union guy being unable to do it was a joke in itself.

Im on semi skilled money btw.

Ian

iTrader: (10)

power to the people,

i think you will find that he can not fire you for keeping recolds of your work each day etc.

you could allways put in for undue stress that your manager is givin you, if you are doing your job, but others are proventing you, how can you be blamed for this??

stick to your guns, and from what i have just read, you are doing the right things, i would prob go to the citinz advice buro as well just to make sure if there is anything else that you could to to help you out.

16vmarc

He was on about firing me for my refusal to go into the office. Im on a final writain warning because i have being booked 3 times.

When i mean being prevented, i dont mean by other people directly. I mean waiting for cranes, trouble with drawings and machinery breaking down etc. Plus the job i have just finished was very big, 2 other people were making the exact same thing next to me but i was made to do it on my own. I was booked for this today as ive took too long. I worked with some else to make the platforms to join the 2 jobs together. He then had a week on the sick and i had to make the handrails for both jobs by myself.

andyfish

what's your union guy doing about this? there are flavours of bullying and harrassment at work. see your gp and tell him how stressed you are with this and pring the threads on the forum to build your case. if you are sacked you have a case for constructive dismissal. tell your union rep to get his finger from up his backside and do his job or ask for a more experienced union rep.

Jamo

iTrader: (23)

the first thing you need to do is lodge a grievence against the moron, they HAVE to act on this!

if nothing is sorted after this quit under constructive dismissal, then contact acas asap, (you have 3 months) they will help you from there!

take my word on it, there very good and very helpful.

jamo

edit for above comment, once sacked you can only file for unfair dismissal.

Ian_S

or if you get paid sick pay maybe go off with stress, which will give you time to sort another job after you quit claiming constructive dismissal.

16vmarc

He said to write the letter of appeal and he will see the director. Said he would go all the way with it. In his defence he can only do so much, afterall hes still got his job to do, hes not a full time union rep!

Although people at work do say that having him defend me is silly when hes not exactly good himself. But i try to keep out of that.

16vmarc

I was in bad books last week for having 2 days off with cold, Ive had time off in past with broken arm and broken finger so my sick record is bad. i was told it would go on my permanant record and it was noted to the union guy that i was treading a very fine line. Not for going home but for all the above.

pauld37

What line of work are you in?

warrenm2

cant you claim you refused at the time because something pressing needed to be completed? something you'd promised a customer perhaps?

sti-04!!

Hes a welder

sti-04!!

Marcy,

you are getting bullied, ask to speak to someone further up than your immediate boss & make sure you have proof.

This guy has it in for you & make sure that you let the people up the stairs know about this, show them the evidence. If nothing happens about it, move on.
Loads of places need coded welders , so dont be scared about looking for another job , pity you are too far away or i could have found something for you

All the best

16vmarc

Today something came back from the galvanisers that the union guy had made, he'd forgotten to add loads of brackets. One of the team leaders has being defending me to the manager and asked if the union guy would be getting booked for this. The manager just walked off. The team leader said is that it then?

So its definatly one rule for one and a rule for another! At same time though i dont want to get involved in slagging the union guy off!

pauld37

Why dont you look for another job Marc? is that an option. Seems like your being pushed out for what ever reason. Cant be enjoyable turning up each morning

astraboy

mate, I would have walked a long time ago if I was having to put up with that sort of **** from management.
You're skilled and that means you can work for anyone who has a need for your skills. Walk out of that job now, I cant believe the **** you've had to put up with. Walk. But not before you've chased your manager round the building armed with a fire extinquisher.
astraboy.

16vmarc

No, its not enjoyable turning up for work. I want to get out and am seriously thinking of going back to college now. Im even thinking of applying at b&q down the road from me, mainly just as a break from it all and also to get out of this filthy job!

darren...

Marc - be careful - refusal to go into the office classes as failure to follow a reasonable demand - under current employment law that classes as gross misconduct which is a sackable offence. Rules re tribunals changed as of October last year but your union official should know that. If you want advice on what I think you should be doing drop me a PM and we can chat about your best course of action.

s70rjw

iTrader: (2)

My ex Mrs worked where you do.I had a big fallout with the boss (Arrogant Scotsman, he had an M5 at the time) because I dropped her inside the gates one day when it was raining.When I explained to him why he went into one and said he could do what he wanted and sack her too............

judgejules

Sounds like your rep doesnt really know what he's talking about, and neither does your boss.

The course of action for gross misconduct would be for them to send you a letter stating the grounds, not for your to defend yourself without seeing in writing what you're being done for. Thats just a joke right there. Ignore anything thats going on until you get it in writing. Informal oral warnings are not part of the formal disciplinary procedure and you should be informed of this.

Your boss just cant make idle threats about disciplinary procedures, he needs to follow the rules laid out in your employee handbook (I assume you have one if you have a personel manager).

Anyway if/when you get this letter about the meeting, it must give you reasonable time to gather your own evidence to dispute the allegations. Usually 2-3 days is a good guide and anything the same day or next morning is just a joke.

You're legally entitled to take a colleague or union rep into the meeting with you. They can speak on your behalf if you wish for them to put your cash forward. However, they will not be able to answer direct questions on your behalf. Someone higher up the food chain will be the chair of the meeting, and they will be the ones that decide your fate. If there's a wif of them having a decision before hand, walk out and go and see ACAS as you will not be having a fair heaing.

If you go through with the hearing, put your own guff forward and let them decide. They'll then send you a letter outlining the decision. If you're fired you then have another 5 days for final written appeal.

If none of this is followed, and/or he fires you on the spot, then you are in a very strong position.

Do not prompt them into the right course of action if you see them making mistakes, let them make them knowing that its putting you in a better position.

From what you've said, it seems like your boss has it in for you which is evident in the "one rule for one and one rule for another". If this is the case, this can be used as evidence.

When you say things are a two man job and you're doing it yourself, is this a legal requirement on their behalf? Are they under staffing jobs and putting undue stress on you to do two peoples jobs? Is anyone else getting the same treatment (even if not as often) or are you the only one that does things on your own?

This is a legal minefield on their behalf, if they put a foot wrong you can take them to the cleaners. Do you have a contract, does it state what are/arent disciplinary/gross misconduct offences?

Jules

PS. This is intended only as a guide as I may have missed something off.

CooperS

Mate you need to get to your GP and get him to sign you off with stress, then you're off with stress you can look for a decent job.

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

OK, now a VERY similar thing happened to me, where I was getting stick for something I'd done, but when I pointed out it had been done on the DIRECT orders of my superior, suddenly the stick disappeared. On asking whether the same stick would be applied to matey, I was ignored.

I walked straight out of the office, straight to the nearest telephone where I rang the union LOCAL AREA OFFICE.

I was asked to put it all in writing to them, did so, and a guy came along three days later to see my boss. Problem solved, he left me alone from then on.

Alcazar

SJ_Skyline

Good luck Marc, it's no fun being singled out at work. I know, I've been there and even if you play by the rules then they wil eventually find a way. You are in the fortunate position to have both supportive co-workers and a union. That said - in your shoes I would be scrubbing up my CV and considering my options.

camk

Get the shop union guy to get your branch involved if he is out of his depth. If you have a hearing and you turn up with a branch union rep it will be much better for you than depending on a local rep , who as you say has his own job to defend.
The fact that you're keeping records is great. You have all the evidence and they have heresay and perception. Don't go sick unless you are sick as its not going to fix the issue, you'll still need to go back to it and based on what I've read they are understaffed and you'll just be adding fuel to the flames.

16vmarc

I have written my letter of appeal and that has being forwarded to the managering director. My union rep has been in contact with the regional secretary for the union who has told him that i have a very good case. They have already slipped up in that im doing skilled jobs on a semi skilled rate.

My team leader is making things worse, he had a go this morning saying i was "taking the ****" for the amount of time it was taking me to drill some baseplates. 3hr card to drill 8 of them all with 6 holes ranging from 22 and 29mm in 20mm thick plate. He moaned because id piloted them first for crying out loud! So i said if he had a problem we should go to the office, with that he buggered off.

My union rep has also been to see personell to complain about the managers conduct, so will be interesting to see what happens there.

16vmarc

Ive being booked three times because i havnt met deadlines, other people do because their team leader adjusts the times each week so if one persons down everyone is. My team leader doesnt do that so ive being standing out like a sore thumb. He also doesnt want to know when you need help. Management however think the sun shines from his ***. Most bookings are verbal, i have being given a letter as it is what they call stage 3.

Theyve given me a week to write to them to appeal, this was handed in today.

The last job i did i worked on my own, however two people were doing the exact same job (5.5mtr roof) next to me. Theyre on skilled money and im on semi skilled. Some jobs require help to hold things, marking out etc.

Ive never being given one.

All my reports have being photocopied so i have a copy too.

16vmarc

I have my appeal with the managing director at 3pm tomorrow.

astraboy

best of british mate
astraboy.

RS Grant

To me it sounds like you have a strong case, all the best for tomorrow.


Cheers,
Grant

16vmarc

Well i had my appeal today. I told my side of the story and said that im expected to do the same work in the same time as skilled men when im semi skilled (im actually skilled, but was dropped down). I explained that i couldnt work any quicker than i was and i didnt think it was fair that i was given the jobs that id being given.

He asked me what i thought my strong points were, i said it was my welding and that nobody could knock it, and as my bookings are for being too slow i think this backed it up.

He said that he had been round the workshop and asked the team leaders and inspector about me, i was quite chuffed as he said that none of them had a bad word to say about me and they all said my work was spot on.

The inspector (actually a team leader filling in) said my work was all good i just took a while doing it.

So theyre problem is my speed. The union guy mentioned about the manager constantly stood over me and watching me intimidating me. He said im sure it is intimidating and off putting and cant be nice but we need to watch people.

We've given him all my reports and he'll let me know in 2 days after speaking to the manager again.

Im not expecting a good result at all and will probably have to take it further. Im pleased that my workmanship wasnt knocked though.

wwp8

GOOD LUCK