ProperCharlie

damn - my spread sheet *was* working. thought for a minute i'd made a decimal place error, and was going to look extremely silly!

basically, to re-phrase, is it a waste of time to attempt short term trades with a low amount of capital (e.g £1000), due to the relatively small points gain likely to be achieved on the average trade?

imlach

Nah, I heard a rumour BRB were in trouble.....

ProperCharlie

thanks for that imlach

scoobyjimbo

Try and avoid small quantity purchases all you can as all your profit (if you make any), will be taken up with commision charges etc, in this competitive market dealing prices and commsion are dropping. I have a frequent traders account with charles shwab and they are great as you get loads of other toold to manage your porfolio, also try barclays stockbrokers as they have very good online tools and advice on buying and selling. If you are new to share dealing try and keep to the blue chips where possible until you know your market, these smaller companies can give you sleepless nights..:-)
The number one thing is to do your research, you can never do enough of that. There are plenty of places on the web that can help you out so go take a look. If you do a search for online share dealing you will get hundreds come up.
Hope this helps..
J

ProperCharlie

scoobyjimbo - cheers for that. the thing about commission taking up profits was what i was thinking about. if i started with £1000 in my account, it wouldn't really be worth spreading it about loads of different stocks for that reason. i have opened an account with comdirect - they seem pretty good on charting tools and so on. i haven't started using it yet - i am still resaerching and want to carry out a few "virtual" trades to see if i am any good at it

at the moment, i am thinking that if i aim for modest gains i will be less likely to get my fingers burnt.

JFB

Not that I know anything but one share worth a look from a chart point of view is Telecom Plus Ord - (TEP). IMHO this stock could be an interesting one to cut your teeth on as a "virtual trade" so you can follow the fluctuations and those factors influencing the shareprice movements.

Note the growth in profits.
Founder's significant shareholding and increased recently.
Founder's track record is excellent.
Company's recruitment policy is pretty unique.
It's a service that pays for itself.
3% dividend yield and growing rapidly.
Mentioned in last Sunday's Telegraph.

Do your research Hemmington Scott, ADVFN, Motley Fool, and check out the Investor's Chronicle out every Friday.

Hope this is of use.

Jerome

ProperCharlie

cheers - just checked it out. i'll take a virtual punt at 288 and see what happens. incidentally, there is a 10 point difference between the bid and the offer price on this share - why so much?

Spoon

PC- You can't *trade* properly anyway without having "real-time" at home as you have to have the prices on your screen as they change, so you can deal immediately via phone or dealer link as part of the software package.

By the time you've executed your deal on a website the price could well have changed 3 or 4 times, and not always for the better of course.

My dealing package + annual real time license cost thousands but I had the prices on one screen with the news on another and charts on another, then ScoobyNet.

Ted Maul

spread,spread, spread man!!

ProperCharlie

Spoon - doesn't it depend on what timescale you are looking at? Obviously, paying thousands for a dealing package isn't going to make sense for a novice punter. can't you stipulate what offer price you want your order filled at?

ted - i appreciate that there will be a price spread, it's just that this seemed a lot bigger than other shares i had looked at.

JFB

This is the market maker's spread. He sells the shares to you at 288p and buys them from someone else at 278p and takes 10p for the pleasure! This is a very simplistc explanation. However, the larger the company, the more liquid the shares and therefore, the narrower the spread. eg Vodafone at 0.25p spread. But that's not strictly a fair comparison as it's not a market maker stock but a SETS stock which is another chapter for another evening.

PM me if you have any other queries and I'll help if I can.

JB

imlach

Take a look into spread-betting too.
www.igindex.co.uk

Aside from the CGT benefits (or rather, there is none to pay), it also allows you to short shares, so you can profit in a falling market too....which is always a useful facility to have....

JFB

[QUOTE]can't you stipulate what offer price you want your order filled at?[QUOTE]
This thread is quicker than my typing!!!!!!!!!!

Yes that is called a "limit order" where you place an order to buy a fixed number of shares at a fixed price within a pre-determined period of time i.e. an expiry date.

JB

Spoon

PC- Yes it does but then I'd prefer the term "investing". Trading to me is several times a day maybe, perhaps even on the same stock.

You can indeed stipulate a dealing price but it doesn't always get filled if the price isn't reached for example and you're just left in limbo searching around the net for another punt.

Plus as I've said, the time lapse can mean the difference between profit or loss even if you bought low. By the time you get to sell, the price could have dropped below your original stake.

Unfortunately "novice" and "punter" don't mate up, you'll get shafted if you're not careful. However if you're careful you won't make much of an impact either.

gsm1

You won't make anything with £1000 trades, PC, short term. I work with at least £5k per trade if it's for such trades. Remember you also have to pay a stamp duty when you buy.
I buy and sell tech shares because you'll find far more movement in trading.
Another tip: Steer clear of the Share Trading bulletin boards!

Spoon

You won't do a great deal with 5k either.

ProperCharlie

JB - cheers for that.

imlach - i've had a look at IG, a while back. rather went off the idea, but might have another look at it.

Spoon - every expert was a novice at some point, weren't they? i appreciate that i might get shafted, but i'm only going to put in what i can afford to lose without having an impact my general financial well being. if i really screw up i can always sell a few cases of wine to compensate. (bordeaux futures, anyone? )

imlach

...unless you margin trade it using spread betting

ProperCharlie

ironic, or are you warning of all the bogus "tips" that fly about? i have only looked at motley fool, so far.

as for not making much impact - well i don't need to.

if it works out, all the better. if it doesn't - so what?

Spoon

There is that Imlach but trying to run before you can walk isn't good.

PC wants to buy and sell shares not bet on something that hasn't happened yet and may never, or if it does then have no clue why!!

gsm1

I know, but it's depends on what kind of profit you're after and how 'short' your short term trades are. For day trading you'll need at least £30k and some decent movement.

imlach

True, but then, normal share trading follows your stated criteria too

ProperCharlie

at least i've still got the day job - for the time being...

Spoon

Trust no bulletin board, they are fuelled by traders who have positions that rely on people acting on their advice.

Change the word impact then for "any profit at all". If you therefore say you don't need to make profit then buy Premium Bonds.

Having said that, gaining experience makes it worth it.

gsm1

The bulletin boards are full of guys trading short or long. They'll go to the extent of having multiple posting names and each backing the other's advice - it's pretty sad, but then many of these guys have a lot of money invested.

Spoon

With my software I reckon I know where it's going 75% of the time. If however it suddenly turns and I hold a position, I can exit immediately because my bell rings like fúck to let me know.

imlach

Ditto with margin trading using spread betting.....

Spoon

As I'm fully aware.

imlach

OK....just wasn't sure where you were going with this

ProperCharlie

if i don't make any profit, i will either learn why not or give up. as you say, i am mainly looking at it as a learning experience at the moment. i am bored with my current line of work and am looking around as to what else i might be able to do. buying premium bonds is going to achieve f*ck all for me: no learning about anything, no excitement, no great likelihood of making much money either. even if i only achieve one of the first two objectives - that's better than nothing. i've got index tracking ISAs for my "safe" bet.