tiggers

So this morning we woke to the news that MSN is to close most of it's chatrooms outside of the US due to the inherent danger to children using them because of paedophiles etc. I'm not a fan of chatrooms per se, but I do think this represents another knee jerk reaction by our society to try and protect children when the real answer is for some parents to actually do some parenting for once.

Surely kids should be supervised whilst on the net (dodgy chatroom inhabitants aren't the only problem you know) and I shudder when I hear about kids as young as 5/6 having net access in their bedroom.

It's the same sort of thing with the films for instance. Certain films have been banned as they have traumatised kids. Then you check and these films carry an 18 certificate so why are the dumbass parents letting their offspring watch the film in the first place.

If some (not all) parents weren't so damned lazy about bringing up their kids then we wouldn't need much of this extra protection from society.

What's next? A child gets run over so we ban all cars?

tiggers.

RB170

Do you have kids ?? I'm guessing not

I agree that parents need to be more proactive in checking what their children are doing on the internet but it's impossible to monitor their activities all of the time.

I have attempted to vet the chatrooms that my daughter tends to use but theer is no way that I could vet every sight\chat room that she visited until after the fact that is.

The only way I could fully protect my daughter from the possibilty of being contacted by a pervert would be to deny her internet access and I do not wish to do that.

[Edited by RB170 - 9/24/2003 10:48:43 AM]

boxst

Hello

Whilst I agree with you in principle. I would not look over the shoulder of my daughter every time she uses the internet. Although she is only 3 at the moment, so it's not an issue yet.

Do you supervise your children's internet access at all times?

Steve.

tiggers

I should have added that I don't have kids myself simply because I know that I'd be an awful father and couldn't devote the time necessary to bring up a child properly.

Surely supervsing your child's internet access isn't impossible, you don't have to sit next to them looking at their every move, just be aware when they are online and take an occasional interest in what they're looking at. Frankly I can't believe with half the stuff on the net (aside form the chatrooms) that you'd let your children go on unsupervised, but maybe I'm being too simplistic. If so I apologise.

tiggers.

Mr.Cookie

Tiggers

Totally agree, a cousin of mine wanted to watch aliens,i said nope your not old enough (he was about 7) he went whinging of to mummy who told me to let him watch it and got quite shirty when i said no

Si

RB170

As you've just pointed out, supervising everything they do is impossible. Taking an occasional look at what they're doing is not good enough because as soon as you're not looking they can logon to another site and away they go.

Even innocent chat rooms can be visited by these sick F*CKS so as I said the only way to protect them fully is to deny them access but then they'll go out with their mates and could be abducted by some sicko.

It is impossible to protect your child 100% of the time and provide them with a healthy social upbringing you can only do your best

boxst

Tiggers:

You are not being too simplistic, I just think that you owe your children some respect. And the best that you can do in the world is to instill them with intelligence to realise what is right and wrong rather than restrict what they do.

Having said that, I would take an interest in what they are looking at, and may be tempted to install PC monitoring software to see what they are up to.

Steve.

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

We're almost at the knee-jerk reaction for cars anyway. In a town not far from me, a 9 year old was run over when she ran out from behind an ice cream van a couple of weeks ago.
Do the parents question her road sense? Do they demand a ban on ice cream vans, (in my mind, one of the most dangerous inventions ever)?
No, they demand traffic calming, and speed limit lowering.
The car was not speeding, the driver stopped but was not charged.
Alcazar

And before anyone says it, YES I do feel for her parents, but we can't blame everything on the motorist.

Can we?????????

tiggers

boxst,

I agree with you completely about instilling your child with what is right and wrong etc. That to me is what bringing a child up is about and that's how I was brought up. You are obviously taking a real interest in your child's development, education etc. and to me that is part of what good parenting is about.

My worry is the parents out there who it seems to me can't be bothered to educate their children properly and then expect society to do it for them. If you can't bring kids up properly then surely you shouldn't have them. You certainly shouldn't expect other people to do it for you.

On a slightly different tack I was amazed recently when the parents of one of the kids who went missing were on TV saying they realised something was wrong when the child wasn't home after the weekend. At first I thought they meant the child had been staying with friends or relatives or something, but it transpires that they thought it perfectly normal for their teenage daughter to disappear on Friday and return Sunday night without knowing where she was all weekend.

Is it just me or is that completely irresponsible? Of course no one dares say anything due to society being so PC these days.

Regards,

tiggers.

chiark

It's as near as damn it impossible. As soon as they get interested in a technology, I'll put money that they'll learn it faster than olds will , and will find ways around it.

You put a mailserver and spam filter on your machine to block pr0n mails - then they find hotmail. You block hotmail... Then they find another...

It's a sad world in some ways, but kids need to be taught the occasional danger of exploring things, which is after all what we are programmed to do.

tittiecarcar

as you have said, you dont have kids so i dont think you fully understand how hard it is to protect your children from this kind of abuse.
you simply cannot be sitting at their side constantly ,i have 2 girls& have resticted the sites that they can logg onto & they also cannot receive i.m's & i check over their shoulder to see what their doing. but the fact is i still cannot stop some pervey little git from contacting them if he really want's to. for intance my daughter is a huge harry potter fan so she finds the warner brother bbs, now you would think that this site would be properly monitored & she would be safe. but no, scroll down the page & you come to the dorm room ..... to say it wasnt for kids is an understament. my point is, it's hard to protect them, even when your aware of the dangers or indeed care about what their up to. so anything that makes that job a little bit easyer is very much welcome , and so what if you lose your chat rooms if it stops just one child being hurt surely it,s worth it

[Edited by tittiecarcar - 9/24/2003 12:15:16 PM]

tiggers

tittiecarcar,

By that logic then we should ban cars as if it stops one child being hurt ....

Sorry, but don't tell me that as I haven't got kids I don't understand as that one doesn't wash with me. The reason why I haven't got kids is because I do understand the amount of time and effort that parenting takes (that and this country has enough people in it already ).

Also if you have really found a dodgy part of a Harry Potter BBS then shouldn't you as a responsible parent be taking that up with the owners of the site? I'm being serious as that would be a real worry to me as a parent - yes you've found it and can steer your children clear of it, but how many haven't.

Regards,

tiggers.

JackClark

Install software that monitors and blocks chat room conversations.

Freak

Totally over the top and un needed reaction.

carl

I don't let their IP address have access to anything other than ports 80 and 53 through the firewall
Doesn't stop hotmail, etc. but does stop chat rooms.

class_A

Teach children that whilst most people are friendly, there are bad people in the world who want harm children. Install filtering/logging software on the PC or give the child their own PC (could be an old P2 or something) and restrict what sites they can visit.

Show them how to use the internet responsibly, don't give out personal information etc.

Attempting to censor the internet is not the answer.

Jye

I reckon Microsoft has only pulled the chat rooms to save money on moderation. Its simple, the rooms are free to use and moderation would cost a lot of cash, why bother then especially with all the negative high profile news atm. The kids will find other methods of talking on the net, probably ones which are harder to control, track or moderate effectively, ones like mIRC etc.

Done mainly to save cash not kids imo.

Jye

And on another note, isnt AOL touted as being the ISP for those parents who value some "security" on the internet.

I reckon AOL are rubbing their hands over this, in more ways than one.

pugoetru

I agree microsoft only done it to save cash

ProperCharlie

it makes me laugh:

1) Course microsoft did this out of a profit motive.
2) Suddenly everyone on the feckin planet is a paedo. A guy on the radio was talking about this and moaning about how it wasn't even safe for kids to play on the street anymore. It was never safe, people just accpeted a degree of risk before.

chiark

Erm, could this be microsoft/MSN making a pre-emptive move before someone sues them for providing the conduit by which kid met paedo?

Given that the makers of GTA are being sued, anything's possible when lawyers and the US are involved

Scooby96

Isnt there netnanny and such like for this. But as carl says block ports etc

Boro

iTrader: (1)

Point well made Nick

chiark

great minds and all that - didn't see your post until I'd posted that...