londonpaul

is it that bad? I used to abide by strict no undertaking rules, but in my dotage I'm getting more and more impatient with the occasional prat driving at 60mph in the fast lane - or pootling along on a two lane dual carrage way at 30mph. am I a bad man?

boxst

Hello

It's technically illegal, and you will get prosecuted (especially on a dual carraigeway) if spotted.

Steve.

corradoboy

Although I fully understand your frustrations at the morons whom inhabit our roads, you could well be staring at a 6 month ban if caught.

tiggers

No you're not a bad man.

If you're anything like me you're just going about your life from day to day getting increasingly frustrated at the way many people in this country are getting more ignorant and arrogant (and not just on the roads, but that's for another time).

This is mainly due to the fact that our beloved excuse for a police force selectively enforce road laws depending on how easy they are to enforce and that we no longer as a nation remind ourselves of the basic rules of the road via ads and public information films.

People will probably laugh when I say that, but imagine the effect a set of ads coupled with a clamp down by the police would have on lane discipline. Still it's just a dream as it'll never happen these days and while no one gets punished for it more and more people will do it.

Therefore when the likes of you and me get fed up we take to undertaking and no doubt it will be us who ends up on the wrong side of Plod - but that's life in the good old UK.

tiggers.

mrklaw

so is it acceptable to help the person in question become aware of your prescence by constantly flashing your lights at them?

Duck_Pond

You can flash, beep your horn, indicate right at them, but some of the t*ssers still won't budge.

The worst offenders from my experience are the Self-Hire vans, who just sit in the outside lane, doing whatever speed they like, regardless of the tailback behind.

Then they flash angrily when anyone loses patience and does the unthinkable, and undertakes them.

brickboy

It depends -- done a couple of long motorway treks this week and many times have simply driven along in lane 2 at 75, undertaking rows of cars in lane 3 which are doing under 70.

It may technically be illegal but like any other manoeuver, as long as you're aware of what other vehicles are doing and do it smoothly, I can't see there being a problem.

Buzzer

My father in law's best mate is a motorway cop. If you are spotted undertaking (usually by an unmarked car) they will look at it in context ie If the tw@t in the outside lane is doing 60 and you come up behind and he wont move over after you making it obvious to him that you wish to get passed, they will overlook the incident and go for the person in the outside lane who was hogging.

Whilst on the subject, he has given tickets to drivers doing less than 45mph on the inside lane for causing the flow of traffic to be halted ! he has done drivers for hogging the outside and middle lanes as they are considered overtaking lanes only and he has done drivers for tailgaiting, trying to get passed drivers in the middle and outside lanes.

Point is, he said to me its all taken in "Context"

Agree with the points above that most of the time the cops just go for the easy option or way out!

All IMHO of course

NotoriousREV

Undertaking is not illegal, there is no offence that the police can do you for simply for overtaking on the left.

However, if you do it badly (i.e. cause another vehicle to change speed or direction) or commit another offence while doing (i.e. speeding) then expect to get the book thrown at you.

The duty of care is totally on your shoulders to ensure that the manouvre is safe.

Hammy Hamster

I'm not laughing, I think it's a strategy that should be brought back.

Jay m A

iTrader: (2)

We've all seen the scene where theres no cars in the middle lane but 10+ cars in the outside lane all queueing to get past a car doing 70 further up in the middle lane, its just that the car at the head of the queue is overtaking at 72mph, then sees another car 20 carlengths away in the middle lane doing 71, so decides to stay in lane 3 and overtake that as well, to the immense frustration of the 10 cars behind him that want to go considerably faster, but is patiently abiding by the no undertaking stategy.

Technically the guy at the head of the queue is speeding so is undertaking bad in this case? Well I think it if it is the guy at the back of the queue, since he can undertake only till he reaches the car in the middle lane, then has to get back into the queue to overtake. Problem is the already frustrated Q is now even more pissed off now we have a Q jumper. however its perfectly acceptable if you're 2nd in the Q and razz underneath the dawdling lane hogger upfront and give him the finger

Buzzer

Sounds good to me Jay

Jza

Do you live in the UK?

Thats cr@p!!!

Jza

NotoriousREV

Jza,

The offence of undertaking was removed from the statute books in the late 70's. It is not crap. They will however try and throw "without due care and attention" at you and possibly "dangerous driving" if you cause a smash.

[Edited by NotoriousREV - 9/19/2003 1:13:10 PM]

GaryK

Yep agreed, undertaking as far as I'm aware is not illegal, im sure thats what dick grimes told us back in the days of getting some driving tuition when joining the SIDC.

Gary

PPPMAT

I'm sure most people will agree that driving standards have reduced, particularly over the last few years. But where are the traffic police these days? I don't see any that often, so where's the deterrant.

Revenue cameras are all well and good but they do not spot careless/selfish driving.

I had to use the garage runaround car (corsa) for 2 days whilst the scooby was being fixed and I was cut up everywhere and generally given absolutely no respect.

Matt

Spoon

Tiggers- You saved me typing it, I agree.

I undertake now, that's not saying I don't wait for a very fair amount of time a good distance behind the offending vehicle.

I actually think it can be safer as it means you don't have to sit closer than you should for a long length of time just to let them know you want to come past.

If you don't move up to them and maintain a "safe" distance, they will only assume you are happy to follow so it's difficult to win.

Also, if you undertake it does away with the need to flash or sound your horn which may just cause road rage.

Make your move with as less fuss as possible and be on your way.

madbrit

Undertake them.... go past.... pull in front of them.... and SLOOOOWWWW down until they get the message and pull over

Duck_Pond

Funniest method for scaring outside lane hoggers is demonstrated on the Fast Bikes videos, where they overtake on their bikes at speeds up to 100mph faster than the traffic, between the vehicle in the outside lane and the central reservation.

Reminds me - I need to order some of those titles on DVD...

ADP

I heard carrying coffins paid quite well

Leslie

So what is the situation then if someone pulls back into the left hand lane just as you are going past him. He is not expecting to have someone overtake him on the left. If he hits you and it causes a lot of damage, who is at fault? It is the sort of thing that could happen very easily. You can't read the man's mind can you?

Les

Andy Porter

I live in the slow/middle lane of the m'way on my bike everyday, looking at the rows of cars in the fast lane, it can be 50-75 cars long, with the same selfish looking **** at the front. I usually get infront of them and give them some mild abuse, they look at you like YOUR in the wrong

M25 Surrey

Jay m A

iTrader: (2)

Interesting, the 4 lane stretch of M25 from M4 round to A3 is each lane to his own - as in if one lanes faster then stick in it. This is when its busy but bumbling along @ 60 mph, quite stress free in fact. Its when it clears and speeds increase they all make a dart for lane 4...

Dazza01

Quote
"It's technically illegal, and you will get prosecuted (especially on a dual carraigeway) if spotted."

WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG
go and do the new threory test m8, one question on there actually says "When is it LEGAL to undertake" and it then gives u 4 answers to choose from.
i got it wrong, i said it was ILLEGAL to do it..

NotoriousREV

As stated earlier, if you are undertaking, the duty of care is on you to perform the manouvre safely. Stuff it up and they'll do you for at least driving without due care if not dangerous driving.

I reccomend only undertaking if:

a) you've made clear your intention to pass (flashing your lights and giving the ****** sign)

b) you know he's seen you (he's given the finger back)

c) you're prepared for him to swerve at you while you undertake in 3rd showing 2 bar on the boost guage (while giving the finger or shaking your head slowly)

Phil Harrison

Confirm Notorious Rev's view.... he has it absolutely right. Further, it is contrary to the Highway Code NOT to pull in from Lane 3 ("the overtaking Lane"") on completion of a passing manoeuvre, so the Lane-hogger is equally in the wrong!!

Phil

mrklaw

I thought that all drivers, in whichever lane, should exercise due care and attention when changing lanes. If you pull over from lane 3 to lane 2 and are not paying attention and hit someone, its your fault.

You could just as easily be undertaking due to a queue of traffic, and you are maintaining your lane position. Its the person wanting to enter your lane who has to make sure its clear.

Dazza012

you've made clear your intention to pass (flashing your lights and giving the ****** sign)
PMSL....Muddy brilliant, another classic 1 liner or 3 in ur case Mr.N REV

OllieC

londonpaul - i think you've inadvertantly hit the nail on the head. The outside lane isn't called the fast lane. It is for overtaking. If people used the correct title, perhaps it would help to change how the overtaking lanes are perceived.

Just a thought.

Sith

Had a chat with a Traffic Officer a little while ago. (They're not all bad.) He said he can do you for driving 'Without due care and attention' or 'Dangerous Driving' I was kinda supprised.

Edited to say, Rule of the road is keep to the left. There is one lane to drive in and then overtaking lanes. You should be in lane 1 unless overtaking in lane 2, if lane 2 is busy you overtake in lane three and then move back to lane 1 a soon as possible.



[Edited by Sith - 9/19/2003 10:13:11 PM]