JonW

Althogh Ininifty specific, other brands may have similar wiring...

Been looking at the box of bits that makes up my new Infinity 6.02CS system and am a tad confused by the wiring for the 20.1XP passive crossover. The 'manual' shows 6 terminals - 2 for signal in, 2 for woofer and 2 for tweeter, which makes sense. The unit supplied has 2 for in, 2 for Tweeter and 3 for the woofer - negative, 4.5.6, 5x7. Ive no idea what these mean and am none the wiser after checking the specs etc...

Anyone know which of these I should be using for the standard 602CS woofer???

Jon.

chiark

I would guess that you need to connect the negative to negative and positive to 4.5.6... It's a universal crossover that's used for 4,5,6 inch packages and also their 5x7 speaker.

Nick.

JonW

Cheers, Nick. I'll do that. I assume that it wont make a huge difference and wouldnt damage the units but I did think i'd try and get it right.

Is it worth upgrading the wiring from the crossover to the woofer / tweeters? I ask as the head unit to the crossover will be the standard scoob loom...

Jon.

Adam M

The difference is only related to the attenuation, you could try putting the positive on the 5*7, you may prefer teh sound who knows.

Probably not worth upgrading the cable for the reason you say. I doubt you would hear much difference, weakest link and all that. Except that each length of wire has different attenuation characteristics, and the longer that length the more affect it has on the sound.

I still think it isnt worth it though.

JonW

Hi Adam, cheers for that.

Agreed, I could play with the diff crossover connections but dont think id hear much difference.

As for the wiring I have to say the 'kit' is a tad crap in this dept, hence the thoughts on rewring with better cable... Here's what you get in the kit:

Connectors: The crossover has screwdown gold connections, the woofer had one large/ one small gold male conectors, so good so far... the tweeter has thinish cable soldered on with mild steel one large / one small male connectors... not so good.

Cable: In the kit you get one 'thickish' connector cable with one end soldered and the other one large / one small mild steel female connectors with shroud. You also get another bit of wire (just thicker than bell wire) that has all soldered ends...

Thats it, now with no extra connectors and no detailed instructions its hard to work out what the maunfacturers mean you to do with what they've given you...

My thoughts are: new decent 'thick' cable with soldered connections and soldered ends for the woofer, the same but with soldered female connectors for the tweeter and I guess I cut the connectors off the loom and solder the ends to go on the corssover...

Does this seem reasonable to those in the know?

Jon 'who isn't a complete nonce, just confused by the word "kit" on the box of his Infinity's...'

rockin'Ru

Goodmorning JonW(at least here).I just read the manual for the set too.I'd say manual is for the entire Kappa series of components.Says the 60.2cs set is crossed over at 3.5kHz.If your actual xover has more than one output per speaker,then I'd say experiment with it a little before final install.The different xover points can make a difference and it depends on what sound you like best.
And depending on where the xover is mounted,you may want to upgrade your wires inside the door for possible future upgrades like an amplifier or high powered head unit.That way you won't have to tear it all apart again if you do increase power.
The set is rated for 90 watts rms.The factory radio won't even scratch the surface of what those comp's can do.And if you ever decide to add an amp later,your components will be ready for it
Just my opinion.

JonW

G'mornin to you mate!

Agree with you that the manual is for the entire range but for the cost of the speakers I'd have expected a little more detail on the connections and the wiring I guess, but it does say if you cant work it out you shouldnt be doing it... wot a cop out! ;-P

Agreed, After a quick look at lunchtime I am thinking of locating the crossovers in the kick plates (small bins with lots of cables in them) just in front of the doors so they are easily accessible in the future so I think its a forgone conclusion that I will have to extend or replace the wires.

Current head unit is a Sony XR-C5100R rated at 40Wx4, I ditched the original the day I got the car home and replaced it with the Sony which was a year old at the time (now two to the day!).

In the future I may fit and amp and a sub (if i can find one I can conceal) but seem to have spent enough soundproofing and on the componants at the moment.

cheers for your comments, Jon.

chiark

Hi Jon

Regarding crossovers in the kickpanels... I got shedloads (technical term) of interference when I mounted my crossover in the driver's kick panel. Never heard induced noise in a passive crossover before in any car!

Moved it to behind the dash to the left of the steering column and it shut up.

For fitting new cable into the doors, I used a feed wire and some lubrication to pull through the grommets - they're tight!

Nick.

john banks

I used new speaker wire from amp terminals to crossover with no joins, and the same from the crossover terminals to the woofer terminals - soldered on. Same for tweeters - very short soldering time on the delicate connections to put on some decent wire. The supplied stuff had the funny terminals you described, was thin and not long enough! This is for References but it sounds very similar with yours.

JonW

Nick, Ta for advice re crossovers in the kickpanels... hmmm dont like the idea of the interference and have just this minute taken the door panel off to have a good look at what Ive got and what I can do etc.

I looked at fitting new cable into the doors as per previous posts but am now erring on the side of cowardice! Partly cos the corssover fits nicely on the window winder steady bar in a perfect shaped recess (think this was mentioned in someones previous post) and also cos I didnt like the look of getting the cables thru the gromets and back in the car etc... yup, yellow thats me!

When you say you 'Moved it to behind the dash to the left of the steering column..' isnt that miles from the door on that side thus causing things to be outa phase? im no expert but thought length of cable was important... still its worth bearing in mind because when I do decide to amp the system I will run (more like pay my tame installer to run) new decent cable throughout.

Now ive got the old speaker off I can see the 6.02CS woofer would be a straight fit (lugs and all!) except the splash guard touches the magnet stopping it locate fully. I discovered the Infinity covers are two pieces (plastic surround and a grille) but just the plastic surround isnt deep enough so I will need a spacer, off to source that and a some connectors in a bit.

Interestingly on the discussion of soundproofing I came a cross a square (6x5 inches) of something aproaching Dynamat Extreme (ie. alloy backed and gooey black stuff stuck to panel) in the drivers door...

Jon.

rockin'Ru

JonW,don't be yellow!You got it apart,you can put it back together!Very gratifying to say "I did it myself".You CAN do it
As for the long wires;no,longer wires won't put anything out of phase.Only changing polarity of the wires will do this.(which is an option with the tweeters,swap the + and - wires on the tweeter for a different sound)The only thing to keep in mind is that the longer the wire the more resistance to power flow it has,which is why it's a good upgrade.
With the options you have right now,you could temporarily mount the xover's somewhere that you can get to easily until you have the set up sounding the way you like it,then make it permanent.
And if you have a jigsaw handy,or even a small hand saw,you can make your own spacers.Very easy.Heck,a friend and I wound up using strafoam for spacers in his Camrey because we had nothing else at the time.Cut it with a razor.Still works fine after 2 years.
Keep us posted,eh?

chiark

Mornin' Rockin'!

What side of the states are you on???

Anyhow, have to agree - don't be yellow! Regarding the phasing issue, Rockin' covered it. I can't hear the difference in two feet of cable in the car, and probably can't at home either (but I do keep cable run lengths at home the same for both sides).

The only time you *really* need to have the x-overs out of the doors is if you're going to go "active" on the system. By that I mean include an active cross-over and run the tweeters and woofers of separate amp channels.

If you do add an amp at a later date, you just need to run one new piece of wire into the doors if the crossover is in there, which is quite a bit easier than two. Still, two is possible, just a bit of a squeeze. I did it because I have an active x-over but at the moment I'm not using it... Maybe it'll take my fancy again sometime.

Nick.

john banks

Unless I'm misunderstanding your description, you don't need a spacer - just take the factory spacer out and trim the back - my 605CS (Ref) and ScoobyDoc's Kappas went in that way... Trimming the factory spacer yields a lot of extra mounting depth before the window would hit. Just need a new splash guard - a bit of imagination would suffice - I think Drivers used Duck tape in ScoobyDocs machine - I used a foam baffle from Rockin'Ru. And don't wimp out on the wire issue. I am crap at DIY and I didn't mess anything up on this install - all I had previously done was put 6x9 in a Fiesta parcel shelf. What you will save on doing it all yourself will buy you a nice amp. If you rerun the wires, the crossover will still fit nicely onto the window steady bar. Do it, you know you want to.

JonW

Hi John, yep I could easily ahve done that but I wanted to keep the splash guard as is and also not cut anything too much, saying that I did have to cut the Scoob fitting ring for the connectors...

In the end after trying everywhere in Swindon for spacer rings I ppted to make my own from MDF. I used 6mm and this and the Infinity spacer fit perfectly inside the subaru fitting. have to say making the spacers was dead easy with a jigsaw and the work of minutes!

Well the first door is done and I rewired the lot (soldering cables to the woofer and tweeter and made a link cable from the exiting loom to the Xover for now) and it wasnt a total pain either. I was happy with the install til I discovered a differnet crossover in the kit (see separate thread) and am now a tad miffed cos im sure the one already done is the one Ive got to change.

Jon.