Guest

iTrader: (2)

I've done a search but not managed to find a definite answer. Hoping to get my 1997 Turbo 2000 to 300bhp. Apparently I hear this is just about possible with the standard TD04 turbo, however the grey 380 injectors on my car will be maxed out at 280ish. Planned mods are:

Cold air induction kit
Full 3" turbo back decat exhaust
Walbro or similar 255lph fuel pump
Uprated silicone turbo hoses
The new ESL daughterboard ECU
Phase 2 yellow 440 injectors+Carl Davey fitting kit

Planning on having the mapping done by Graham at Silverstone so I'm confident he'll do a good job! My question is, with the above spec is 300bhp achievable on the standard turbo or is it going to depend on how healthy the engine is? Also all the planned mods can be fitted with standard ECU and management, with the exception of the injectors. If I fitted 440s to the car say, the day before mapping, would it be safe driving straight to get it mapped? (65ish miles from me) I expect it to be overfuelling and the economy to be terrible but is there likely to be any damage done in that short a space of time?

Cheers guys, any comments or suggestions are welcome!

addi monster

iTrader: (6)

you will need a td05 mate the td04 will not go past 270 imho, you can drive the car after fitting the 440s but stay off boost also the phase 2 440s should drop straight in yours without a fitting kit iirc,
steve

mikef04

iTrader: (7)

I've a vf23 which will see you over 300bhp easily with the 440 injectors you'll be fine. Tbh I wouldn't bother with an intake system unless you are going the fmic route

ukpaisley

iTrader: (4)

Full decat and on "V" power I think you will be able to get 280 or above, dont expect more than 290 tho' but there have been a few that made 300, but its rare.

Selling the adaptor kit ?? PM me might be interested !!

Guest

iTrader: (2)

Apparently the phase 1 and 1.5 fuel rail is slightly different to the phase 2, so I was going to buy one of these adaptor kits: http://www.carldavey.co.uk/product.php?id=2

Would love to be proved wrong though as it'll save me 35 quid!

So if you had the same car would you bother with a TD04 at all or go straight for a TD05? Was the TD05 fitted to Phase 2 Turbo 2000s, I know they were fitted to the earlier WRXs. Reason I ask is I've got a mate breaking a 1999 Phase 2 classic, the same car I'm getting the injectors from. If it has a TD05 turbo (or would it be a VF?) should I perhaps get both off the car?

Finally, you say it would be safe to do a short careful journey on unmapped injectors, what about if I were to fit the slightly larger turbo as well? Presumably if I was especially careful to stay off boost and stuck to 50 on the dual carriageway there'd be no problems?

Sorry for all the questions!

addi monster

iTrader: (6)

You will be fine if you stay off boost as the turbo only works on boost,, the tdo5 was fitted to all model classics(top and front entry) phase 1/1.5 rails will need the adaptor`s for phase 2 injetors so why not buy some phase 1/1.5 440`s,, i thought your 2000 reg was a phase 2, my misreading i think,.

stevemoir

iTrader: (24)

Mate just buy that vf23 it's a steal and a guaranteed 300 with supporting mods

And it's only 200quid

Steve

stevemoir

iTrader: (24)

It's a turbo 2000

98 plate

Steve

sonic93

iTrader: (16)

tdo5 alot cheaper turbo and stronger and can get 340 out of it

addi monster

iTrader: (6)

352 out of mine on v power alone

EngineMapper @ Group B Motorsport

The TD05 only comes on the V1 classic saloons as far as I'm aware, but happy to stand corrected.

Best I've seen from a TD04 has been 292bhp with 310lb/ft. So yes you definitely won't see over 300bhp with your current turbo.

I'd think long and hard about the move to see over 300bhp and the injector change. Currently, remapped you would have a very quick spooling and torque driven engine that would be an excellent road car. When you start adding a larger turbo like the TD05 the spool is longer and not as urgent. Unless you are thinking of doing a FMIC and induction kit to support the TD05 to go to 340bhp, then it's probably not worth it for that extra. That is of course that your TD04 is healthy enough to see 280bhp+! But I'd probably try that first.

Graham

sonic93

iTrader: (16)

yea td04 super fast spool.

addi whats your spec thats good result mate

addi monster

iTrader: (6)

i have one on my jdm version 2 from the factory (td05)

addi monster

iTrader: (6)

vers 1.5 440`s here https://www.scoobynet.com/subaru-par...injectors.html

EngineMapper @ Group B Motorsport

V2s might be included in that too then! lol

mikef04

iTrader: (7)

Is the problem in fitting the td05 to the later cars not to do with the fact most are a 90deg inlet instead of a front entry. Unless they have been converted.

Mike

ukpaisley

iTrader: (4)

JDM or UK car ? Its not a good age, Subaru was on the cusp of changing things LOL

99jdee

im thick and have a quick random question, you know the td04 is supposed to be a quick spooler, if i wanted to spend said 200 quid on the td04 could or is there anyway to modify the turbo so its a td04 quick spooler but will go to 340hp etc.. you know having the advantages of the quick spool of the td05 but the hp of the td05, i guess the word im looking for is a hybrid??

mikef04

iTrader: (7)

There is hybrid available from Andy Forrest. But believe you won't get one for £200. I'm not sure in their top limit though, I guess another way to improve spool would be with some of Harvey's headers and matched up pipe

99jdee

surely with todays technology i could give someone my td04 and 200-300 quid and come out with a super td05/td05??? lol

addi monster

iTrader: (6)

What you are asking for is the holy grail mate,, we all want to spool quick but yet have huge bhp numbers, ita a compromise mate,

Guest

iTrader: (2)

A lot of useful answers there guys, all the help is much appreciated, I'm a complete scooby (and forced induction) noob so it's good to hear some sound advice!

That's nearly correct Steve, my car's actually a 1997 Turbo 2000, a phase 1.5 facelift, the most awkward year of scooby to try and modify it seems!

As Grahams very accurately pointed out it's still a road car and I want to do a few track days in it, so perhaps I don't want a huge power monster with enormous turbo lag. If I had a bucket of money then I'd go for the Andy Forrest hybrid TD04, which is claimed to keep the quick spool up of the standard turbo but be capable of 320+bhp. But at £450 exchange they're not in keeping with my 'modifying on a budget' ethos that I'm trying to keep going!

So I guess I'll stick with the slightly lower power figures for a more driveable car for now, I can always swap for a bigger turbo and fit a FMIC and everything else further down the line if I really feel I need the extra power. But in standard trim it's probably down to about 200 bhp by now with age, so if we can pick it back up to 270/280 that'd be great

One other question, I've already PMed you Graham but I may as well ask here too, Would it be worth fitting the 440s anyway as I've been offered them cheap, just to make sure the fuelling isn't posing any restriction and we can really try and get the best out of the turbo?

Thanks again everyone

99jdee

damn lol guess its a td05-16g for me when time comes!

ukpaisley

iTrader: (4)

new fuel pump, remap and pamel filter, it will feel like whole new car

addi monster

iTrader: (6)

for an extra £50 he could buy a tdo5 and have over 300 with his other mods, for me its a no brainer imho,.

mickywrx

iTrader: (29)

Andy F does a front entry converted compressor housing for the TD05, for not a lot of money. They aren't the laggy monsters some would make them out to be, and are tough as old boots.

Guest

iTrader: (2)

Like I said if I could afford it id get the hybrid td04 turbo from Andy forrest for quick spooling and 320 bhp, but I haven't got £450 spare!

mickywrx

iTrader: (29)

TD05 16g is what, £100 these days? £60 for a compressor housing from Andy.

Just because Andy got 320/320 out of a TD04, don't expect that to be the norm.

Mrchips

iTrader: (7)

I got 300, with 310 torque from a td04 hybrid. Great turbo. Not shy at all

Guest

iTrader: (2)

I've seen used 16g TD05s finishing at £70 on ebay so could probably get one cheaper still! Not sure about the condition of a seventy quid turbo but it goes to show they're not big money.

This has confused me further now though, as turbos are so cheap it almost seems rude not to if I'm going to the effort of replacing injectors and spending £600+ on new standalone management anyway!

I've been searching and looking for ages for a definitive guide on turbos, what I need is a list of all the different sizes and what cars they were fitted to but not found one yet! So I'll ask here, what is the 'next one up' from the TD04 that will fit onto my 97 classic? Want something that will still spool up nearly as quick but offer a bit more power, is it definitely the TD05-16G I want to be looking at or is there a VF equivalent? vf34 maybe? I'd like one that'll bolt straight on and won't need any conversion kits, but am I just being too hopeful?

Edited to add I think what I'm looking for is a front entry turbo that's a direct replacement for the TD04. I'd like a TD05 16 as it's supposed to be the next step up, better power increases but still quite quick spooling, but I've not been able to find any info on converting a top entry turbo to front entry, there's nothing listed on Andy Forrest? So does anybody know what VF turbo I should be looking for to give similar perofmrance to the TD05, i.e relatively quick spooling and still capable of 320 bhp with good supporting mods? Or am I better off searching a bit more for the conversion kit and picking up a cheap TD05?