john1979

Alrighty folks,
My 2003 STI is currently getting its engine stripped out and rebuilt by a recognised 'specialist' (I won't advertise), as the damn thing broke down after 8 months of ownership.

At the moment I don't know the full extent of the damage and what they will recommend to be replaced, but have had guide prices to rebuild using OEM parts. Although this doesn't break down into the cost of the components, labour etc...

My question to you all is, in my situation and with up to £3k to spend on the repair would you go for a 'simple' OEM rebuild or use this situation as a chance to upgrade? And if so what components should I be asking for prices against? (or do I need a massively bigger budget?)

Basically if a common answer arises I'll be using it to get a quote against.

Thanks

Boosty

I would look into the cosworth subaru engine building scoobyclinic have a range. Or, for the money, I'd get another engine and sell mine for parts/repair. If you look in the vehicles breaking section there are ppl selling some serious engines for cheap. May be worth a gander.oem is always so so expensivo

john1979

I had a lot of advice previously against swapping the whole engine out. Especially aginst a used one from a car being broken.

Pramas

3k should get you a nice forged engine rebuild ( api seem to be the boys) , stick to those since you wont know if the new engine you buy is a dog, better the devil you know
Once mine goes and it will somtime thats the route ive choose, hopefully not in the near future though !

Boosty

Thing is 8 months is not a long ownership b4 the engine blew. Maybe rebuild, but if you can find one that's already been rebuilt happy days. It wud suck to pay out big now for standard internals to later regret no upgrading. Look for forged internals.

dazdavies

iTrader: (22)

Bare in mind that doing the job to budget and doing a job properly are two different things entirely.

£3k could get you an nice OEM rebuild done properly. To do it with forged internals then you could probably add £800-£1000 to the bill.

That's a rough guestimate on what you can expect to pay for a drive in drive out deal.

I think I remember Engine Tuner offering a very good deal on their 2.1 stroker engines drive in drive out for £4500 for a 500bhp capable engine.

jura11

iTrader: (7)

For similar money you can have 2.1 stroker,which i have with Cosworth Pistons,Cosworth HG,ARP 11 headstuds etc.


Jura

Pramas

scoobyclinic offer 2.1 stoker kits for 1600 then fitting on top, best to get it done once properly then pay twice for a half assed job, either way should be insdie ur 3k budget, dpends on ur final bph goals, but if ur doing it anyways do it proper, personally id get it pinned at same time, costs a little more but adds a little failsafe for not much more , assuming u go the reliner route etc

john1979

As it happens, it is at API. David seems to know his stuff (Although he is talking to me who knows jack-****)

Thats whats in my head at the moment, but I need to get a list of parts so I can ask them to quote against it or suggest others.

john1979

I'm very fickle, and the word Cosworth immediately appeals to me. Do you think this is possible for £3k?
I'm guessing it would also need a re-map straight away as well?

Pramas

Youve got pretty much the best guys around to do the job, trust whatever they tell you and you wont go wrong

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

If you don't want to spend more than 3k stick with std!

As Daz says, to get forged goodies you'll be look at about 1k more.

The key thing to remember is that there is a big difference between an engine that is strong enough to produce big power and one with the supporting ancilliaries required to achieve it.

API did my big (ish) power upgrade. You chose the right place for the rebuild.

Even if you rebuild to std, you'll be able to come back and put a bigger blower on there with a few sensible mods and see yourself safely to the late 300s. Beyond that it starts to get much more expensive! Think 5 figure expensive.

Reliable power costs!

dazdavies

iTrader: (22)

OK basic spec for you.

New crank £500 ish
ACL bearings (mains and big ends) £150
Rods £400
Pistons £400-500
Modified Oil pump £200ish
Oil modine £200ish
Skim heads £80 for the pair
skim block £80
hone bores £150
Gaskets and seals £250 -300 ish including head gaskets.

So thats £2.5k in parts alone.

Prices are guestimates but not far off what you should expect to be paying.

dazdavies

iTrader: (22)

Cosworth goodies

£700 for the pistons ( I have these in mine)
Circa £800 for the rods.

Exceptionally good products but it will cost you.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

If you're gonna uprate the pistons, go with Supertech.....trust me on this one!! OEM quiet and tough enough for a proper turbo running proper boost!!!

David and Mick will give you the low down!! APi steel rods would also be a fine upgrade.

Just don't foget that this gives you the scope to run more power, not more power per se!!!

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Have look at this for £3.3k you have 2.1 stroker.

http://www.slowboy-racing.co.uk/inde...mart&Itemid=73


I have similar spec,but with some addons like Cosworth Pistons,Cosworth HG,ARP 11mm Headstuds,uprated oil and water pump,ACL racing big end and main bearing set,and still for good money i must say.



Jura

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Lest the OP is interested, here's what APi did to mine (spec included).

You'll struggle to find a better spec for a road car still at "sensible (ish) levels. It's not all about the power and torque, but how the 2.5 engine and SC46 deliver it; it's got guts everywhere!!

https://www.scoobynet.com/scoobynet-...-from-api.html

john1979

Sounds nice, I made the choice early though that I wanted to repair my engine rather than replace the whole thing, hopefully at the end it will be a good choice.


Thats a great read, the type of thing that really getting my mind ticking over and was really why I originally posted this. I don't wanna be in a situation where at the end of it people will be saying ''you did a whole engine rebuild and didn't do X,Y & Z?''

Totally understand this, and I guess I'm also trying to 'future proof' against anything I change later. So if you have a list that I can suggest to API then it would be appreciated. Next week I'm gonna have to have a clear vision of what I want/need so as to commit to it...

BlueBugEye

iTrader: (12)

If it's at APi I'd just do what they tell you!!

As it's a rebuild on a blown engine there are extra costs to consider, at least you want a new Modine cooler and the turbo fully checked over/refurbished, oil pump and probably the Sump replaced on top of a std rebuild. Probably looking at a head refurbish, block/head skim, bore/hone then new crank, bearings, rings, head gaskets, pistons, rods (not all needed if you stay OE and your parts are ok all needed if you go forged).

Personally with the block in pieces I'd go 2.1 stroker or just get a forged 2.5 dropped in.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

If you want to bullet proof the engine for a higher spec, then replace the std parts with:

- Supertech forged pistons
- APi steel rods
- Cosworth 11mm head stud kit
- ACL bearings
- Cosworth gaskets and seals

As a short engine, that'd take whatever you'd reasonable throw at it! Cost you over 1k more in parts though.

BUT personally, I'd ditch the 2.0 litre in favour of a 2.5. You can then run a bigger turbo with better response at some point down the road. The 2.5 is just a nicer engine for day to day/fast road use too: oddles of low down torque! The only downside is that it needs a bigger turbo to feel as exciting as the 2 litre.

David will see you right!

jura11

iTrader: (7)

This is not replacing your whole engine,this is repair/upgrading your current engine.


Jura

happydude303

iTrader: (1)

save for a 2.1 stroker from engine tuiner it will be the best 4 grand you have ever spent its a build you can rely on dont pay 3 grand and then it brakes a year down the line

Henrik

iTrader: (5)

How about 2.5 short block with replacement pistons, or does that come in far over budget?

john1979

Is that about 4k for the engine rebuild alone, fitting and mapping on top?

Its with API at the moment, the engine is out and I'm just waiting for a diagnosis from them, so I'm expecting that next week. I can ask then for quotes against various options, a 2.1 stroker will no doubt be one I mention but by the sound of it this will be out of my budget (especially as the rebuild is underway so not much time to get saving)

John

jukebox

£1,600 for the 2.1 kit that seems cheap, anyone know the spec on it.

scubbay

iTrader: (61)

I know of a 30k STI engine coming up in the next fortnight. Can be bought complete or as a longblock and can be heard and tested before purchase. Version 7 Japanese import which has never been run on UK fuel. I personally heard it running last night and it is perfect. Car is due to be dismantled and all parts will be available. Expect to pay £1500 for the longblock which includes oil pump water pump, modine sump etc. Basically fit your manifold and turbo etc.

APIDavid

iTrader: (4)

Why not a 2.1 stroker from APi?? Engine Tuner are not the only suppliers in the world of 2.1's !! We do them, 'Clinic do them, RCM do them that I know of.
Lateral supplies build kits..............

In any case; a properly built good spec 2.0 will do just as well as the
' fashionable ' 2.1 ....... 100 odd cc's doesn't make that much difference .

David APi

scoobydog63

iTrader: (4)

You wouldnt get that much more torque then David?

APIDavid

iTrader: (4)

That is always the 64,000 dollar question. lt is possible, I agree, to squeeze more torque from a 2.1. But it is very turbo / mapper dependant and cannot be relied upon as a "given"

David

happydude303

iTrader: (1)

what ever he does he want a foregd engine i.e rods and piston bearings and arp head bolts for that sort of dollar or not far off i konw i paid 3300 for mine two years ago and they rebuilt not so long ago for free becuase of there old mapper who work for them run it far far far to lean ntoe for lal do not use andy vey at vey sport that what the mapper trade as now to be far thou the engine must have been tough to put up with two years of running lean and detting all the time