CVH

Just fitted a k&n apollo induction kit to my 06 wrx hawkeye and there is a definite difference to the way the car pulls.I have fitted induction kits to all of my cars and i have always noticed the difference.Not a lot of people on here recomend using them.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Careful with such sweeping misleading statements mate.

It's not that people don't recommend them per se; it's that they advocate using them for the right reasons and with the right supporting mods

Induction kits are not generally required untill you get to a power level whereby a FMIC is advisable.

Their effects vary on different MYs. 99 and 00s for example have notoriously fragile mafs, induction kits can increase the chances of maf failure, which if unchecked can kill an engine.

They vary in quality, some are rubbish, some v good. K&N generally fall into the latter

When you get one fitted it is advisable to have the car remapped or at least checked by someone with a wideband AFR and det cans to make sure the car is still running ok. Do you for example know whether the perceived increase in pull on your car is actually a symptom of it running leaner- you want to be sure it's not too lean or you're looking at increased risk of engine damage.

Finally, perception of increase in performance owing to an induction kit is likely to be just that, perception, which could be attributed to increased induction noise i.e it sounds faster so it must be faster. By themselves they make very little difference.

CVH

Hello m8 thats some reply but it sounds to me like you are dead against induction kits.
Like i said i have had no bother with other cars, 2nd from last being an bugeye sti ppp with no remap and caused no problems.
This kit does not give a different indution noise and not imagining more power with more noise.

CVH

Looks like i made my point.

Glowplug

iTrader: (8)

Yeah, proper shut him up that did!
After all what does he know eh? 4 years on SN with 9331 posts, baaa!

ukdave

Green induction kit fitted at same time as decat on MY00, no remap 27,000 mile later cars fine,car did have a maf around 43,000mile but mates my99 were replaced around same time running with std airbox so just put down to wear,done 10,000 mile since and its been fine.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Against them.....well.. You've got me on that one!

BTW I have a K&N 57i about to go on mine! .............. With other mods (including an FMIC) that will take my humble classic to around 340bhp Like I said, they have a place, but to come on here and claim they're fine for all is highly misleading.

I really don't see how you can make such definitive statements about power gains and safety, based soley on your subjective impressions without any evidence to back it up. Do you know what a some peeps say when asked if they noticed anything strange about the car prior to a maf related build "it seemed to be faster/pull harder". Just because something appears to be running quick, doesn't mean all is well. Just because you get away with something doesn't mean others will be so lucky!

I know people who've got away with a CAIK and no remap, or an FMIC, but I know more who've not and now face big engine rebuild bill!

Did you ever get the Bug PPP on the RR before and after the IK change? Chances are you'll have sufferd slight losses, no gains. IKs ca do little more than suck in hot dirty air from the engine bay.


You do know that the induction kit invalidates your warranty, right? Important point that!


Tell ya what,I'll make you a deal, if you're really saying that IKs are ok for all based on your experience of having one fitted to a scooby, without any monitoring of relevant engine parameters etc… Then we’ll all believe you with a proviso.

if anything goes wrong with your Scooby you won’t come on here complaining about reliability etc.

Oh, and you don't expect us to follow your example!

Deal?

thedeester1

When i bought my scoob there were only subaru selling air filters...I bought a blitz wire mesh for the price of 2 of these. I wash it in the sink with soapy water. some people call the MAF (mass airflow switch) killers....mines had one on for 7 years....No dead MAF. On any engine tuned or not better airflow will give you better perfomance. Dont trust the quoted figures though (10%) at best your looking at 2-5 max. As someone stated before they do work better with tuned engines. Also if your really into it, make a little perspex box to fit over it so it doesnt get engine heated air. I know of a DIY mod to run a pipe from the bumper and enclose the filter. This bypasses the inner wing/brake cooling intake. Cold air (like we get in the UK 11.5 months of the year) makes turbo engines faster. SOme of the guys here i think are dealer mechanics and brainwashed to tell you stories of evil.
PS the perspex box also creates increased air pressure inside it so make it strong.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

BTW I should point out that I'm not a dealer, nor a brainwashed mechanic I have owned my Scooby for the best part of 4 years and for the last 2 it has been running at 320bhp with no issue. Whenever I have needed advice, I've always gone to a variety of experts who know these cars much better than anyone else on here and got a concensus of opinion.

Invariably, the response on IKs was, not worth it; std airbox good to levels where an FMIC would be advisable. If you do go for it; get the car checked to make sure all is ok.

The mantra better safe than sorry is wise when dealing with performance cars IMHO. Be warned these cars can very considerably even within the same Year and there are significant differences between MYs imports/uk etc.. What's ok for one may be bad news for another!

That's my advice, take it or leave it.

Best of luck, whatever

T5OLF

iTrader: (4)

CVH is your car running over 350 brake? if not then your wasting your money on an induction kit. All it does is pull hot air into the engine - I'm sure you know what that means.......

A panel filter is a much better option as you still have your cold feed. I would only fit an induction if running a front mount, even then I would have some kind of cold feed to it.

But hey do what you want you seem to know more than the people who have been tuning these cars for some time.

doshwrx2007

i agree with scooby 04 and t5olf i too had an induction kit on my car when i bought it ( a hks ) and kept it on for over a year but then started having running problems when car was hot , so replaced it for a standard airbox a few weeks ago and its run fine since , thing is you think its doing good but infact your just letting hot air into your intake and not really gaining anything .

sorry mate unless your running big power your wasting your time, but this is my opinion

trails

iTrader: (41)

on the money as usual T5OLF; its not about being against them...its about them being for their correct application CVH

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Echo, Echo, Echo

trails

iTrader: (41)

oh go on then...I guess you are right too NS04

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

CVH

Hello all, i dont want anyone to follow my lead your all big boys and can make your own minds up.
I appreciate all your words of advice but i was just speaking from my personal experiences.
My induction kit is not sucking hot air in from engine as it has piping routed inside the wing,i also know what im talking about as i have been a mechanic the last 15 years of my life.
I started this thread to let people know of MY experience of induction kits just thought it may come in handy to other people.

David Harris

Its definitely controversial out there. I have an apexi ind on the saloon and HKS hi-flo on the wagon, would have never really had it any other way. However, i went to a meeting a fortnight ago and the majority of people were sticking with aftermarket panel filters. Even running high power.

Fat Boy

Your experience of two subarus and 15 years as an oily rag doesn't mean squat - on some subarus an induction kit like an APS CAIK is a sure fire way to **** your engine.

Up to 340-350bhp an IK won't make any beneficial difference apart from a louder noise -the sti panel filter flows as much as any of the Ik's at that level and stops all bits going through, plus it prevents the MAF killing vibrations that for instance the MY99/00's particularly suffer from.

Come back when you've learnt a bit more - until then listen to those people above in this thread who have pointed out that your sweeping statement is at very bext badly inaccurate

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Sharing your exprience is fine mate

But your post read like you were saying that your experience would safely generalise to everyones car and that is misleadng

Ns04

MrNoisy

iTrader: (28)

Before I owned a Scooby I tended to run HKS or K&N equivalents on my previous Jap cars, so when I bought my first Scoob I spent £180 on a new HKS SPF kit, only to find that despite the noise it didn't seem to make a blind bit of difference at all, and in fact seemed a little more juddery in the cold. Then I joined this forum, and read up on here and NASIOC and soon recognised my error and removed it and went with a Green panel filter instead.

Looking back on it, with the amount of heat generated in the engine bay, it would be bonkers to assume that it could have sucked in anything other than hot air, even with the original feed from the wing blowing over it.

The only way around that as I understand it is to add an additional feed and build a heat shield around it, OR do what you've done and have an element with a heat shield built around it like the Apollo. However, I'm more inclined to believe in tuners like Powerstation, who from what I know still use K&N panel filters unless you're running big BHP. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Its a known fact that a panel filter will give you just as much power as an induction kit on a new age car upto and around 400bhp, after that its up to the owner if they want to go the induction kit way, but new age cars have a very good air flow into the standard airbox
Its also not adviseable to run an induction kit/airfilter on a PPP'd car due to the way the kit is mapped (this goes for decatting also)

Tony

DB07P1

I believe i have an induction kit on my car however i didnt put it on,and dont know much about it,however after reading this thread and just having the head gasket replaced on mine among other problems im starting to worry that was the problem,mind id had it 4 months before the head gasket went so a bit confuzzled!

David Harris

A bit of a witch hunt there i think my friend, i know they can be detrimental to performance if used unnecessarily but other than fuelling and MAF problems i dont think they could be responsible for the head gasket? I hope not anyway!

CVH

Hey fatboy what gives you the right to talk to me like that? as for learning a bit more i thought this was the idea of this forum?
Why dont you learn to spell BEST.
Everyone is allowed there point of view but i think the way your talking is getting agressive.

Fat Boy

Hey, CVH, why don't you learn to spell their or don't?

I posted that way because you're coming out with incorrect (and dangerous to people's engine's health) comments and presenting them as fact by backing them up with statements like "i also know what im talking about as i have been a mechanic the last 15 years of my life". No, you don't ...at least not in this case. You could, in the worst case, cause people to be saddled with engine rebuilds.

You were also ignoring people coming out with sense in their posts and repeating your generalisation, which just doesn't apply to a lot of subarus. Not much evidence of wilingness to learn there as far as I can see.

By the way, I run an induction kit but my car is running somewhere north of 440bhp, it doesn't have a MAF anymore, and it has been carefully mapped by a leading mapper to take account of all the modifications.

You can have your finger back now

DB07P1, as David Harris says, an induction kit wouldn't affect your headgasket.

CVH

I am stating fact because my fact is correct on cars i have had not on anyone elses cars i was just letting people know what this kit has done for my car. As i said earlier people can make their own mind up, just thought members might like to know. And you cant tell me what i can and cant post!

T5OLF

iTrader: (4)

Lets not all fall out over this The pipe you added will do nothing mate, the engine on that side is very hot and your filter will just pull this in and not the air from the pipe. The only way is to enclose your filter and run a pipe from that to the inner wing so the filter can only pull cold air.

If you stick your car on a rolling road and do a 3 or 4 power runs with a panel filter and a IK print off the results and then post them here we can all see what is best - panel or IK......

Until then I stand by my original quote.

CVH

Hello mate the filter is totally sealed and the pipe runs down to the bottom where the fog lamp is.
Would like to rr it after i change the exhaust system too.

T5OLF

iTrader: (4)

Ah you should have said, I that case is should be fine. I will be doing the same with mine as it's open to the heat from the uppipe at the moment. I would rather run a panel filter but the front mount stops me.

CVH

Yes mate its the apollo kit dont know if you have seen it?Nice looking bit of kit too.
Very touchy subject with some members this, different people different opinions.