'Cooler' Thermostat
24 July 2006, 10:06 AM
#1
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Sunny Dubai, epicentre of the shallow people
Posts: 198
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
'Cooler' Thermostat
Based on the Group Buy currently running, (http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthread.php?t=530366) can anyone explain how a thermostat which opens at a lower temperature contribute to a cooler running engine?
As I understand it, the thermostat is just a temperature controlled valve, which opens at a set temperature (OEM is 80 degrees IIRC).
As I 'normally' run around 94C on the road, peaking at 107C (!!!) on trackdays, would this actually help, as the OEM thermostat would be wide open by then anyway!
As you guys are experiencing what I would consider a mild winters day temperature wise at the moment
, you may have some idea of the temperature control issues I face here!
Are there any issues (other than extended warm-up) with removing the thermostat completely?
Neil (currently 'enjoying' 48C temps
)
As I understand it, the thermostat is just a temperature controlled valve, which opens at a set temperature (OEM is 80 degrees IIRC).
As I 'normally' run around 94C on the road, peaking at 107C (!!!) on trackdays, would this actually help, as the OEM thermostat would be wide open by then anyway!
As you guys are experiencing what I would consider a mild winters day temperature wise at the moment
, you may have some idea of the temperature control issues I face here!Are there any issues (other than extended warm-up) with removing the thermostat completely?
Neil (currently 'enjoying' 48C temps
)
24 July 2006, 01:52 PM
#2
Former Sponsor
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: ECU Mapping - www.JollyGreenMonster.co.uk
Posts: 16,548
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
because it opens sooner..
seeing now 77 on cooler morning cruise. Still heats up on idle to same as before mind..
Seeing good oil temps too.. although not measured before the stat change.
Simon
seeing now 77 on cooler morning cruise. Still heats up on idle to same as before mind..
Seeing good oil temps too.. although not measured before the stat change.
Simon
23 June 2007, 06:18 PM
#3
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: South West
Posts: 1,568
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Old topic I know guys but did this have any issues with "cold" running on the ecu?
Mine seems to run at about 98 deg on normal/motorway cruise and over 102+ when pushing...
Just wonder if normal runs with coolant temps down to say under 80 deg would cause ecu to run differently?
Mine seems to run at about 98 deg on normal/motorway cruise and over 102+ when pushing...
Just wonder if normal runs with coolant temps down to say under 80 deg would cause ecu to run differently?
23 June 2007, 06:51 PM
#4
Scooby Regular
Engines have an optimum water temp that they run at. I've never quite understood the point of running a colder 'stat. Surely all it does is drop the coolant temp a few degrees under normal running conditions? Which I just can't quite see the point of. If anything, I want to get my coolant up to temperature faster and a colder 'stat does the opposite. And under hard use, the colder 'stat makes no difference whatsoever, surely?
25 June 2007, 08:03 AM
#5
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: South West
Posts: 1,568
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Have to agree with you there but I've heard it does...temps drop to 90 deg when on fast cruise etc...much better for me if I could have that figure instead of 98 before I blat her...I guess its to do with the system cooling earlier (stat fully open) so more cooling (time wise)??
25 June 2007, 11:31 AM
#6
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Warwickshire, UK
Posts: 2,099
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It won't keep it cooler, it may take a (very little) while longer to get to temperature though.
Unless you are improving the cooling to the point where you run close to the stat opening temperature its pretty pointless to fit a cooler stat, even then its marginal as you soon go above that at low speeds unless you run the cooling fan, which hits power and fuel economy anyway.
Simon
Unless you are improving the cooling to the point where you run close to the stat opening temperature its pretty pointless to fit a cooler stat, even then its marginal as you soon go above that at low speeds unless you run the cooling fan, which hits power and fuel economy anyway.
Simon
Trending Topics
25 June 2007, 12:24 PM
#8
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Lancashire
Posts: 2,209
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I can only speak for my experience of cars in the UK.
Cooler stats do make engines run cooler, cooler engines are less prone to det.
The stat is not a switch and is designed not just to stay closed until a preset temp is reached but to open gradually over a temperature range, increasing coolant flow as it does so.
Andrew...
Cooler stats do make engines run cooler, cooler engines are less prone to det.
The stat is not a switch and is designed not just to stay closed until a preset temp is reached but to open gradually over a temperature range, increasing coolant flow as it does so.
Andrew...
25 June 2007, 12:53 PM
#9
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: South West
Posts: 1,568
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ah, all makes sense now...its using the existing rad system to better effect as the stat is open wide longer...so more cooling. Cheers chap
Okay, looks like this is the route I will be taking...
Anyone know where to get one from and how much they are?
Okay, looks like this is the route I will be taking...
Anyone know where to get one from and how much they are?
25 June 2007, 09:38 PM
#10
Former Sponsor
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: ECU Mapping - www.JollyGreenMonster.co.uk
Posts: 16,548
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Engines have an optimum water temp that they run at. I've never quite understood the point of running a colder 'stat. Surely all it does is drop the coolant temp a few degrees under normal running conditions? Which I just can't quite see the point of. If anything, I want to get my coolant up to temperature faster and a colder 'stat does the opposite. And under hard use, the colder 'stat makes no difference whatsoever, surely?
temps on my car have dropped from late 80s to 78 on high speed cruise and engine takes more timing as a result.. and also lower oil temps.
Simon
26 June 2007, 02:15 PM
#13
Scooby Regular
Can't argue with results like that. So the question is, where do you get one from?
26 June 2007, 07:10 PM
#21
Scooby Regular
Don't want to gut you out even more, but I just ordered the same SARD one direct from Nengun in Japan - AND a 1.3 bar rad cap for £45 the lot delivered or thereabouts.
27 June 2007, 09:16 AM
#24
Former Sponsor
iTrader: (20)
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 8.95 @ 168mph. Zero to 1KM 194.1mph
Posts: 1,150
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The one in the link is not a Zero Sports thermostat, and has a much smaller aperture for the water to flow through.
I have tried the one in the link, and the Zero Sports are more reliable.
Mark.
I have tried the one in the link, and the Zero Sports are more reliable.
Mark.
15 August 2007, 11:42 PM
#26
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Stalking Kate Beckinsale
Posts: 4,265
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sorry to dig this up guys but I have been umming and ahhing about getting a cooler thermostat (Zerosports or Sard) as I get tired of getting out of the car with the TT running, just to find that sods law 15 secs after the cooling fans kick in the car turns off, never sits right with me. That and I too believe that it can't hurt to run a bit cooler. HOWEVER, I saw the post from JGM in this thread: https://www.scoobynet.com/general-te...themostat.html and I would like to know what he means in simple folks terms .
Cheers,
Nick
.Cheers,
Nick
16 August 2007, 12:01 AM
#27
Scooby Senior
when the engine is cooler, it needs more fuel, a bit like a choke on a carb car, what simon has done is turn the temp down at which point it needs a choke. so in effect, he's making the automatic choke turn off at 72(random figure below cruise temps) degrees instead of 80
16 August 2007, 10:15 AM
#29
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Manchester ish
Posts: 18,547
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
you cant change the stat opening with the pfc, all you could do is add more fuel but with the standard stat the engine would be running hotter so it wouldnt be able to take more timing so your just wasting the fuel, running injectors at a higher duty for no benefit.
What I think would happen is that with a lower temp opening stat, you would just run a different portion of the map for the temperatures that the engine is seeing.
A question for the mappers on this though, if you had a standard stat when originally mapped, would you benefit from a remap with a lower temp stat
What I think would happen is that with a lower temp opening stat, you would just run a different portion of the map for the temperatures that the engine is seeing.
A question for the mappers on this though, if you had a standard stat when originally mapped, would you benefit from a remap with a lower temp stat
16 August 2007, 10:18 AM
#30
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Stalking Kate Beckinsale
Posts: 4,265
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hmm, sounds like more hassle than it's worth for me I think. I will give the coolant a flush and renew it, I have never had overheating problems anyway, just the comical sod's law fan cutting in just before the TT cuts.
Last edited by Mr Footlong; 16 August 2007 at 10:21 AM.