oilman

iTrader: (9)

I read so much stuff on the internet about Synthetic Oils that is simply not true so I felt it was time to tell the truth rather than accept the myth.

So in future when you see someone state any of these, please do me a favour and point them at this thread!

Synthetic motor oils damage seals:

Complete Nonsense! Any oil seals made after 1975 or thereabouts will be entirely compatible with any type of synthetic engine oil. (The same goes for synthetic gear oils and transmission oil seals.) It must be understood that everything associated with lubrication is thoroughly tested. The major oil manufacturers do not make oils that attack seals; seal manufacturers ensure that their products function correctly with modern lubricants.

Synthetic oils are too thin:

It is true that the best synthetic blends can be low viscosity (0w-20 for example), but they do not have to be! It is also true that the latest engines are designed to run on thin oil, which improves power output and fuel consumption. Even so, thicker synthetic based grades (10w-50, 15w-50, 20w-50etc) are available for air-cooled motors, older engines, or severe high temperature conditions. These grades can also benefit rebuilt classic engines dating back to the 1940s.

Synthetics mean higher oil usage:

The complete opposite of the truth. Oil consumption in well-maintained modern engines is mainly down to the oil evaporating at high temperatures. Synthetic base oils (specially the PAO and ester types) are very resistant to evaporation loss even in low viscosity blends, so oil consumption is minimised. Obviously, engines with worn valve guides, defective seals and worn piston rings will use oil regardless, so there is no point in using expensive synthetics as an ‘old banger lube’.

Synthetic oils are not compatible with other oils:

All engine oils intended for normal road use in recent 4-stroke engines are compatible with one another, regardless of the base make-up. (mineral, PAO/ester/hydrocracked synthetic, and semi-synthetic.) There is no need to flush or strip down an engine when changing from one type to another. (…but be careful with the exception: castor oil based racing oils.)

Synthetic oils produce sludge:

Well honestly, this is just totally daft. All synthetic bases are more resistant to oxidation than mineral oil, and sludge is largely due to oxidation. In any case, all motor oils intended for road use meet the higher API specs such as SH, SJ, SL and diesel equivalents. One of the main reasons for introducing the API specs back in the 1950s was to deal with oil sludge problems. All high-spec oils run very clean, especially synthetics.

Synthetic oils cannot be used with catalytic converters:

‘Cats’ will perform more efficiently and last longer if synthetic based engine oil is used. Their lower volatility (see 3 above) means that less oil reaches the combustion chambers via crankcase ventilation, so there are less harmful ash residues from burnt oil to de-activate the catalyst matrix.

Synthetic oils can void warranties:

People who make statements such as this never define the type of synthetic, thus revealing their ignorance. Provided that an oil meets or exceeds the API and viscosity ranges specified in the handbook, the warranty will not be affected. (By law, OEMs cannot insist that a particular brand of oil must be used to maintain warranty.)

Synthetic oils will last forever:

The better synthetic blends will certainly last longer*, especially in high performance or high annual mileage situations, but ‘forever’ is not on, simply because contaminants such as soot, and acid gasses from traces of sulphur in the fuel degrade the oil.
(*Provided that a very shear resistant VI improver polymer is used in the oil formulation to keep the viscosity up to spec. This point is often forgotten.

Synthetic oils are too expensive:

True, for older vehicles that use a lot of oil or are almost ready for the scrap yard. For cars that are worth maintaining, the right types of synthetic oil are a cost-effective way of retaining ‘as new’ performance, low fuel consumption, and reducing maintenance costs. (See 6 above, for example. ‘Cats’ aren’t cheap!)

Cheers
Simon

pslewis

Interesting article Simon

I take issue with the comment above, Semi's are good enough for road cars - even Imprezas! (I am living proof!)

All that NEEDS to be spent is Ł15 for 5 Litres of Semi ...... as Subaru themselves recommend.

Clearly you sell good quality oil and at a good price ................... but, for me, and many others, Fully Synthetic would be overkill.

Anyway, its popped your sales pitch back to the top of the page

Pete

oilman

iTrader: (9)

Pete,

You are entitled to your opinions, I for one don't agree but then again, hasn't the virtues of cost/qualty been well debated here?

With regards to using cheaper oils and changing more often. In the first mile the higher volatility, inferior anti-wear performance and poor temperature resistance of a cheap grade of oil will start to show. Obviously, there will be no immediate effects. The whole point of top quality oil is long-term performance retention, which is particularly valuable to people who actually own the car they drive rather than fleet cars.

The ‘performance’ enthusiast will want to retain the new-spec BHP figures, and the cost-conscious will want to see good fuel economy with 100,000 on the clock.

Cheap oil, (particularly 10W/40 or thinner) evaporates quickly, and the vapour is drawn into the combustion chambers via the crankcase ventilation system. This means calcium and zinc oxide deposits (from oil additives) which will cause pre-ignition, so the knock sensor retards the ignition, giving less power and poor fuel economy. The deposits also contaminate the exhaust catalyst, leading to high emissions and MOT failure. Besides, how much does an average catalyst box cost these days?

Cheers
Simon

DonnieDarko

too in depth for me, but cheers,

just so i know what oil do i need to take to subaru next time i have an oil change & how
much is it?

2005 WRX Wagon (no PPP...yet)

oilman

iTrader: (9)

5w-40 synthetic

Cheers
Simon

mgcvk

Can you use synthetic oil then with even a very new engine? I thought you were meant to use semi for the first few thousand miles.

DonnieDarko

cheers

oilman

iTrader: (9)

Synthetic is not used for running in as it extends the process. A mineral or petroleum based semi is what's recommended.

Cheers
Simon

gpssti4

iTrader: (6)

I had the car serviced last week and was advised against fully synthetic. They told me that they recommended semi as 'it lasts longer', whatever that means. I think they meant that it will not degrade as quick. Is this true - they reckon that a fully synthetic oil will be okay one day but knackered the next!!! What's really the score? Oh and it was a specialist BTW.

Cheers

Graham

oilman

iTrader: (9)

They are talking through their............

Semi's need to be changed every 4-6000, fully's 10000-12000.

Complete load of...............

Cheers
Simon

Sirus

any special brand or are thay all the same

oilman

iTrader: (9)

Do a search and take a look at me December Offer, there are some decent ones in there.

Cheers
Simon

Ben WRX Bug-Eye

Interesting article Simon.

When you say fully synthetic oil should be changed every 10,000 to 12,000 miles, does that mean it's pointless to change earlier? I use fully synthetic but have been changing the oil every 5,000 to 6,000 miles under the belief that this is better for the engine. Have I got it wrong in terms of cost v benefits here?

Thanks,
Ben

oilman

iTrader: (9)

Of course you can change it earlier if you wish but a good one will go that mileage without a problem. Never forget that a % of the benefit is they last longer.

Cheers
Simon

mart360

interesting, the scoob gets semi, because thats what it calls for in the handbook. the soot monster gets fully, because thats what it calls for in the hand book, although interestingly enough, the scoob gets a change at 6000 the sooty at 10000

yet my 2 stroke used to run fully and gulp 1 litre every tankfull


M

pslewis

Change at the mileage/time Subaru recommends ...... whatever oil you use!

Oilman, who sells oil, is suggesting you that you can ignore Subarus advice - I would STRONGLY advice you NOT to!

And Semi is absolutely fine .... to state that it is only ok for cars parked at the scrapyard gates, is utter crap!

Pete

JJC

Simon

I have allways used Castrol Formula RS 10w - 60 are you saying a 5w-40 is better ?

Regards,

John

pslewis

He'll sell you something 'suitable'

Pete

JohnD

iTrader: (5)

In terms if 2001 on 10,000 IS the Subaru recommendation (7,500 for pre - 2001) and in any case, Oilman is NOT telling anyone to ignore the recommended period, just that the full syn. is GOOD for 10 - 12k
Who said semi - syn is no good? He's simply suggesting that full syn. is better!
I admit to a certain amount of (mild) critisism of Oilmans "subliminal" marketing tactics on here (and other forums) in the past, but in this case I think Mr Lewis is having a pop just for the sake of it?
JohnD

oilman

iTrader: (9)

For what model, year etc plus any mods or track driving.

Cheers
Simon

oilman

iTrader: (9)

With all respect, if Pete knew something about oil, he wouldn't be talking out of his rear view mirror!

Sorry Pete you need to do some homework on oils and read my posts rather than twist what I am saying to suit your argument.

Cheers
Simon

johnfelstead

why is this in a non technical forum? I wont comment on the content.

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

because its the usual spam by 'oilman' just advertising as much as he can.

oilman

iTrader: (9)

Give me a break, if you don't like my posts, don't read them!

Cheers
Simon

pslewis

John, quote:-

"Synthetic oils are too expensive:

True, for older vehicles that use a lot of oil or are almost ready for the scrap yard.

Cheers
Simon"

Implying that anything other than Synthetic Oil is only any good for cars ready parked at the Scrap Yard gates. You need to read the WHOLE thread before making judgements on people!!

Pete

pslewis

Are you an Oil Salesman or a Chemical Engineer with a Degree??

I would hazard a guess that you are a salesman trying to sell a 'certain' type of oil.

What you sell is no doubt good, no doubt a good price,

BUT DO NOT SAY THAT I AM TALKING RUBBISH!!! Or you will **** me RIGHT off!!

I am using Semi in my Impreza, Subaru state that is OK, I have NO REASON to believe that I have chosen wrongly .............. indeed, all pointers say that YOU are selling Oil that EXCEEDS the requirements.

If people want to waste money then fair enough ..... but do NOT say I am talking rubbish when I am doing as SUBARU tell me to do .............. or you and I are going to have a BIG falling out!! OK????

Pete

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

If we want your 'copy and paste' advice we'll ask for it.

pslewis

Simon

That is NOT the point ............

You RAM the SAME message down every BBS throats .... to sell Oil.

Now, I don't care personally, you do a spamming sales pitch if you want ..... but do NOT try to cheapen my argument FFS!!!!

You post the SAME stuff on all forums ............. high performance, low performance, sports car, classic car, fun car, toy car ...

You do NOT care what we drive ...... just as long as we buy your stuff.

So, be nice now!!!

Pete

ru'

And there was me reading the original post for information.


Not wanting to take sides here, but I don't find the spamming offensive as it's done in an informative way.

Let's just hope Oilman doesn't drive with his front fog lights on though...

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

Its funny how this thread has stayed in 'General' when it is clearly a technical (or garbage) thread whilst mine re 'oilmans' spamming was moved immediately.