Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

Fitted a VF28 to my 'X' reg UK scoob over Easter and was immediatly impressed with how it worked in conjunction with my other mods.

These included the following, with the price I paid in brackets :

H&S downpipe (£100, 2nd Hand)
H&S Resonated centre Section (£160, New)
TSL Group 'N' rear box (£200, 2nd Hand)
STi (JDM spec) Panel Filter (£30, New)
TEK ECUTEK remap (£350 Exchange, 2nd Hand)
Standard 440cc Injector
Standard Fuel Pump (Only done 30,000 miles)
Standard Pressure Regulator


This spec was 'presumed' to be appox 280BHP running the TD04, although I didn't ever put it on the rollers. I thought it may be 270(ish)

So as mentioned Fitted the VF28 and it immediatly felt better running approx 1.2bar, dropping to 1bar at 7,000rpm using the TD04 ECUTEK boost control and TD04 restrictor/orrifice.

Well.....on Friday I paid a visit to PE for a checkup and custom map.

Pre-remap

Recorded 294BHP & 274ft/lb of torque, with no knock and the ECU was apparently handling things well i.e it was running nearly all of the available timing.

Post remap

Recorded 316BHP & 314ft/lb of torque

After seeing the pre-remap result I didn't think it would get much better....how wrong was I....this is running 1.33bar peak, 1.2bar held then dropping to 1 bar at 7,000rpm

Price paid for VF28 - £180 2nd Hand
Price paid for Custom Map - £295 (not a bad price for another 40ft/lb)

Roojai

great results and thumbs up for PE I presume

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

Yes thumbs up indeed....

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

After a 2nd visit last week to sort out the boost control, I was expecting the power to drop away slightly.
On the road it was boosting to 1.5bar where I was expecting 1.3bar. Hence why I though the power figure would drop.
After another hour or so on the rollers Chris set the boost control and after a few spirited runs outs on the road we managed to tweak the duty control to get a stable 1.3bar.

Back on the rollers then for a power run gave the following results.....
1st run 306BHP / 291ftlb torque
2nd Run 309BHP / 296ftlb torque
3rd Run (with water for overheating intercooler) 321BHP / 314ftlb torque

Needless to say my next project is a pressure sensative intercooler water spray.

PE RR Plot, with water

StickyMicky

nice results mate

EddScott

Well done mate.

Was the original TEK sofware on your ECU from PE? Only ask becuase mines got TEK2 from PE and have always wondered if it could be remapped for a different turbo - either VF28/35 for me too.

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

Yep, was TEK'd by PE for a TD04 by Mervyn (now works for ECUTEK, next door).
Chris then downloaded the TD04 map onto his laptop for safe keeping, then flashed a suitable map (UK, 440cc Inj, Full Decat, VF28) back into my ECU. Then spent 2 hours on the RR fine tuning. Cost £293 inc VAT.....

IanW

Excellent Scott!

I am debating going back to a similar spec to what you are running now that I have another car to use daily (and I think my TD04 is about to give up ).

andypugh2000

Cracking results scott, makes me want to have a re-map now but its pointless still running std injectors and composite head gaskets.

Nice project and glad it turned out well

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

Couldn't believe the difference the water made. All Chris done was fill his tea mug with water and poor it in the scoop (Incidently the previous map prior to the boost control tweak, with 317BHP was also with water).

I've now got my pressure switch and some gardena irrigation misting nozzles (from the garden centre), which fit into standard washer pump 3/16 hose.

Have fitted these on the right and left hand side of the intercooler rubber gaiter (so one spray from right to left accross intercooler, the other left to right) and tested them by connecting to the standard screen wash pipe.
All seems to work well.

I Just need to get another resovoir and pump.

I may also splash out on some genuine 'Auto' and 'Manual' switches

No-bars Krud

Nice one Scott ! And thanks for your advice.

Andy.F

Whats wrong with composite head gaskets ? My RA was running composites at around 400bhp for a long time, std 380cc injectors are also good for 340+bhp if you have an uprated pump and regulator fitted.

Andy

Jim_B

iTrader: (1)

Scott

Great results - have been looking at changing my TD04 for a VF turbo ( either 28/34/35 !) but the only thing putting me off was later spool... From your dyno graph - it looks like the turbo still spools up pretty well. How does it feel compared to your TD04 ???

Andy.F

Hmmmm.... graph doesn't look right to me 180ftlb torque at 2000 rpm ??
I don't think so !!

Andy

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

Not alot in it w.r.t spool.
I do a 3rd gear pull up a hill from 2,000rpm on the way to work and the VF28 starts to pull about 1 car length later (judged by road markings and the location of a t-junction....very scientific).

Thats the only time a notice the difference. General driving and overtaking etc..etc..and it's not really noticable.

Make sure you use the right oil feed banjo bolt for the VF tho', if you go for a roller bearing i.e Vf24,28,29,34.
Or the bearings will overpressure with oil using the standard TD04 banjo bolt and delay spool.

below is the old TD04 plot.....for you to compare

andypugh2000

Hi Andy, I was told that my head gaskets would only manage 1.2 bar of boost with a VF28 or was that person referring to my std fuel pump??

What kind of boost were you running on your composites?? Do you think I can run more than 1.2 in std form or........how much with an uprated fuel pump and reg??

Sorry for the hijack scott

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

So what are you doubting Andy ?

Because my VF28 plot looks to be at similar levels to the TD04 plot. Also the TD04 plot was from a different car i.e Peccy's UK car, which is who I got the TEKECU from.

Also Subaru reckon on similar torque figures at 2,000rpm for their PPP, see below :

Andy.F

I'm doubting your car on a VF28 makes 180ftlb of torque at 2000 rpm. If the reading is incorrect at 2k then I suspect it may also be incorrect throughout the power run.

Your turbo is closer to the Sti in design/spool and even with the benefits of vvt Prodrive don't quite make 150ftlb.

Andy

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

I've been waiting for this one......so the usual doubting of PE's rollers then.....I thought Bob silenced this rumour by comparing them to G-Forces set-up.

I don't know how accurate these rollers are at such low RPM, but after 2 visits and also comparing it against other RR plots (not only from PE) it all seems pretty consistent.

Plus the feel/spool of the VF28 compared to my TD04 feels little different.

All I do know is, that I have used PE for years on Fords and Scoobies, and at the moment my scoob feels bloody quick compared to how it ran on the TD04 and TEK ECU.

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

That's a good result Scott but the problem may be that Carl Davey IIRC, had a similar spec but with a TD05 (more potential) and under achieved on the rollers. I don't want to dilute what you have done although it looks like you have just added a zorst, filter, turbo and remap to get 315bhp. Some decated P1's had a hard time achieving this even with decats! There also could be speculation that the vested interest in producing a good result, is with the tuner who is linked to the RR.

Enjoy your new performance on the road and be happy.

F

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

Yes, but it had 294BHP & 274ft/lb even before they mapped it.

I know of a number of other UK cars that are running similar power/torque with the same or v.similar spec i.e

Decat, VF24, 97/98 ECU mapped and RR'd at PE (311BHP)
VF24, ECUTEK mapped by Bob and RR'd at Well Lane (318BHP)
Decat, VF24, Not Mapped with HKS boost Control and RR'd at G-Force(290BHP)

The mapped figures above are similar to mine, and even the un-mapped is pretty much spot on with my un-mapped figure.

I done my research before doing the mod and the BHP/Torque I got was pretty much on the nose.

Mine gave 321BHP with water and 309BHP without. I happy with either (but water spray will be installed soon ).

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

I used water spray on the 'Ring in the height of summer and it made no real difference to inlet temps that I saw. I certainlt felt no difference but then again, could you feel 10BHP?

F

andypugh2000

Scott,

What power did yours make at the wheels, this is the figure tha is most important.

Mine made 203 @ wheels with more or less the same spec as yours but running 1.2 bar

AP

Andy.F

Scott

It's not that I don't think your current spec is capable of the power figure you claim, I posted on one of your other threads that the turbo is good for 350+bhp.
I just said that the torque at 2000rpm is definitely too high and hence suspect the rest of the run maybe of questionable accuracy.
When the torque at low rpm reads high like this I usually suspect a dragging clutch or brakes which can give high rundown losses, this in turn increases the PAF figures.

Andy

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

Below are a few more RR plots :

Plo1 1 shows the increase in torque/power between the TD04 mapped ECUTEK ECU running the VF28 Turbo and peaking at 1.2bar overlayed onto the final run done on VF28 remap on 22nd April (with water assistance).
Plot 2 shows final map, after the boost control was corrected on 27th April and without the assistance of water for the intercooler.
The 'un-assisted' plot shows the torque at a slightly lower level at 2000rpm compared to the final 'water assisted' run record 5-10 minutes later (321BHP plot on previous page)

Plot 1 - TD04 map running VF28 Vs VF28 Map, 22nd April 2005


Plot 2 - VF28 map 'without water for intercooler, 27th April 2005

RobEvo5

iTrader: (9)

Nice result M8 - You will have to take us out for spin. Not bad at all from effectively DIY bolt on Mods and a remap.

With these figures and costs, I would have to ask myself if I would ever want a STI again. I could save £0000's buy a good UK with History spend the money on it, get it to STI performance and beyond and still have change

See you soon.!

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

A very good result for £1300. Have you changed anything else previously? Do you have uprated TMIC hoses for instance? Or an uprated pump? Did you do the work yourself? Are there any other tweeks - cold air feed or resonator removal from std air box?

F

harvey

iTrader: (48)

The VF28 is a very capable turbo and in my experience capable of well over 350 bhp when all the supporting mods have been done. It is certainly going to give far more power than a TD04 in a like for like comparison although it will spool a bit later.

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

What would you expect to add to the list to get to 350 on a VF28 Harvey? A FMIC, 550's and headers?

F

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

Samco intercooler hoses are fitted, and a pretty cheap mod TBH. It also makes removal of the intercooler a whole lot easier.

The correct VF roller bearing banjo bolt is also fitted to aid spool.

No uprated pump or regulator, as it was deemed 'not required' by PE and Andy.F (but car has only done 31,000 miles).

All work was done myself, other then the remap. And it's still running the standard airbox, but with a JDM Spec STi Filter.