aob1

Hi,

Got my 06 wrx back yesterday after having the 'Secondary Air Pump system Removed' and 'Delete kit / blanking plates' fitted.

Trouble is now running really rough/lumpy...and idle is v.erratic

Am yet to have CEL codes mapped out, but was under the impression it should still run OK? (..just obviously throw loads of error codes)


Is this right.. (and therefore something not quite right with fitting.. eg possible leak some where)... or is it simply because I haven't mapped the x2 valves and pump out yet?


Any advice from anyone who has already done/had theirs removed/blanked greatly appreciated.


Thanks

MOTORS S GT

iTrader: (2)

Not having the codes removed will not cause running issues, just puts up the eml, either there is an airleak somewhere, or something else has been disturbed.

aob1

Thanks.. thats what I thought

and does x1 of the valves need to be left connected?
only I've read one contains atmospheric sensor (which can be 'cut from top of valve').. or is this just for STI (...or just old wives tale?)

MOTORS S GT

iTrader: (2)

No, remove everything.

aob1

So this is NOT required / pointless ?

http://www.wrxforums.com/forums/11-s...re-sensor.html


Car wouldn't idle ... re-attaching seemed to improve idle
(no - haven't cut/removed from valve.. just re-connected to test)

FMJ

iTrader: (2)

All guides I have seen to do it suggest you need to keep the pressure sensor. Where does it read pressure from? Just the bay? Or inside the pump assembly?

aob1

FMJ - well it definitely improves things (just dies on idel without it)

reluctant to cut/remove from valve until know for sure though...
guess will have to wait I til get the error codes mapped out

FMJ

iTrader: (2)

So does it run fine just with it connected? Or is it still not right?

aob1

still not right even with sensor connected... rough/lumpy when driven and idle is v.erratic (constantly droping around 700/600 and up to 1200/1300)

found plenty other posts saying sensor is needed.. (although many referring to STIs not WRX) http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=275

removed pump relay from fusebox.. have also read posts about people removing fuse(s) for relay(s) ...but info didnt seem to match layout of my fusebox??

aob1

further info regarding atmospheric sensor...
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=346

although does contradict what I'm seeing on my 06 WRX??

aob1

info regarding 'valve fuse' and 'pump relay'

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=359

aob1

just went up the road... Flashing EML and think went into limp mode!!!!

Can anyone who's actually done this on an 06 WRX 2.5 hawkeye please confirm the steps took?

1. Did/Do you remove or re-connect the sensor on top of one of valves? (ie. containing 'atmospheric sensor')
2. Did/Do you remove the air pump relay from engine bay fuse box
3. Did/Do you remove the 10a air-cut fuse (for relay) from engine bay fuse box
   
   
   ..and the million dollar question
4. Did/Does it actually 'run correctly' without/before the error codes are mapped out?
   (...or will it simply 'not run smooth' until mapped out?)

Again, any advice greatly appreciated.
Thanks

domino46

I removed all of the air pump motors and valves and pipe work from under the engine bay when I done a engine swap and it ran ok after ,, EML came on and it would idel slightly diffrent but was running ok and drove it up to the mappers just fine

MOTORS S GT

iTrader: (2)

I have done dozens of them, chuck everything out, as said before, why would you keep part of the system, the sensor is only there for operating the system when all is connected & working, it senses temp for cold start function, which is the only time it runs, sounds like you have another issue, not connected to the air pump delete.
No need to take out relays / fuses, its being switched off ecu wise so will not function anyway.

Double check that you have not disconnected the knock sensor at the back of the block, as its very close to connectors for the air pump solonoids, on the l/h side.

FMJ

iTrader: (2)

Not wishing to argue but on the yank sites people state that the sensor is a barometric pressure sensor used by the ECU in general not for the air system. They had the ECU plugged in and the barometric pressure read correctly with the sensor and with it unplugged the value defaults to a set pressure. The car still runs but the value is not variable. Not sure what effect that has on things? Or even what the ECU needs barometric pressure readings for?

rob84

iTrader: (5)

Threw all of mine in the bin on my hatch, nothing plugged in all wiring harness muliplugs insulated and tied back into the harness, the sensor you mention is only for reference to see if the system has a stuck/seized valve of if the pump is innop.

It gets an atmospheric reading and once the valves shut down this reading should increase which tells the ecu that 1:- the air pump is functioning as intended & 2:- the combi valves arnt seized open.

rob84

iTrader: (5)

Sounds more like you have an unmetered air induction after the maf sensor.
check for air leaks with some brake cleaner etc,

jazzyjembreaze

iTrader: (11)

As above
Junked everything on mine
Sound like u have other issues

aob1

First off.. thanks to everyone who's responded (is v.much appreciated)

You have all pretty much confirmed what I originally thought .. and put in my original post
The 'air pump relay' and '10a air-cut fuse' are a complete red-herring
(as confirmed/explained by MOTORS S GT )

Jury still out regarding whether the 'atmospheric sensor' is actually required...
in theory (and again confirmed/explained by MOTORS S GT ) IT SHOULD NOT BE REQUIRED... However, it did/was making a positive difference whenever it was re-connected


On the bright side (well kind of ).. car been thowing 'P0304 - Cyl 4 Misfire' codes since going into LIMP mode, so something else def not right and is going back bright and early in the morning..


Cheers Guys

FMJ

iTrader: (2)

Cool, so it doesn't measure atmospheric pressure for any other purpose? I.e. fueling, idle control, ignition etc?

To the OP please update us when you get it all sorted so we know what the issue was.

aob1

Just to let you know got car back today with a new coil fitted... and is running smooth as again!

is running WITH NOTHING CONNECTED

1. Secondary Air System completed removed + Blanking Plates fitted (x2 valves + x1 air pump + pipes)
2. Did NOT re-connect the sensor on top of one of valves? (ie. containing 'atmospheric sensor')
3. Did NOT remove the air pump relay from engine bay fuse box
4. Did NOT remove the 10a air-cut fuse (for relay) from engine bay fuse box

IT DOES 'Run Correctly' without/before the error codes are mapped out?


Hopefully might get CELs mapped out later this week ...fingers crossed
(thanks to FuZzBoM)


Thanks again to everyone
(particularly MOTORS S GT for his persistance )

FMJ

iTrader: (2)

Cool, so it was a coil issue all along!

Let us know about the mapping. Ie where, how much, and how it goes :-) always good to have these threads end well.

My sensible car when I'm not driving my classic is an 07 hawk sport r so I may delete it if it goes wrong too. I gather you could delete the codes with a code reader but obviously they would keep coming back without them being deleted from the ecu.

MOTORS S GT

iTrader: (2)

I suspected it was not related to the air pump removal, as I have never had any issues removing the system on all Subaru models, inc JDM Hatches.

Good to hear its sorted out for you.

aob1

Hi all,
Further update on this today...

Had codes mapped out today (again, thanks to FuZzBoM)..

Switched off all codes listed here
http://forum.wrx.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=69499
(although some weren't listed/available)

However, EML wouldn't initially 'turn off' (although reader was reporting 'NO DTC CODES' )
Cleared codes again after drive home (EML was on whole time driving back).. and EML finally went off ...

when started the idle dropped to around 500rpm ..
took for drive up the road and even cut out on me a couple of times when dipped the clutch


Swapped air filter back to standard one (which made no difference ), so I reconnected the sensor on top of one of valves? (ie. containing 'atmospheric sensor') ... and surprisingly enough idle is fine again (around 700rpm)

So looking like might need then sensor after all

(even swapped air filter back to uprated one and still running smooth )

jazzyjembreaze

iTrader: (11)

Roast potato
Brussel sprouts

aob1

Car still not sorted after all

Took out last night and was initially running nice..
(actually ...was running noticable well, like always used to be before issues started)

Drove about 3 or 4 miles then bam ...EML came back on and starting running rough again with some obvious (minor, but noticble) power loss..

Drove back and was reporting a P1410 code, so disconnected the sensor on top of valve? (supposed 'atmospheric sensor') .. Low idle problem returned instantly and pretty much died instantly evertime I dipped the clutch when attempted to drive..(was pretty much undriveable at this point .. couldn't only make a matter of meters up the road without revs dropping below 500rpm and cutting it out)... decided to call it a night

Woke up this morning and fired up first time... No EML (sensor not connected).. and idled steady at 1100/1200 rpm

Took on short drive (1 or 2 miles).. by time got back was warm.. idle had dropped to around 700.. Then same thing started happening again.. Low idle problem returned (whenever revs dropped below 1000 it seems to initially 'go too low' before attempting to correct itself back up to 700rpm... sometimes cutting out if/when it couldn't correct the revs quick enough.)


Reconnecting sensor makes no difference once the engine is warm and in this state ..
(EML has still stayed off throughout)

Could it be another coil issue/failure?
(only had one on cyclinder 4 replaced ...so far)



As usual, all/any advice greatly appreciated.
Thanks

aob1

Couple of pics of removed coil


http://postimg.org/image/62kxd6gob/


http://postimg.org/image/y1f341iaz/

FMJ

iTrader: (2)

This all sounds like such a headache! Did the people who mapped it have any ideas?

aob1

Didn't really have anything inparticular 're-mapped' as such..
just Secondary Air Pump / System switched off... everything else left as standard


http://s24.postimg.org/sipjncvlx/Sec...em_Off_001.jpg