Boost question
31 December 2012, 02:02 PM
#1
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Boost question
I've a bit of a dilemma
Running a td05 on my bug , the mileage is now over 140k
It still pulls well and no worrying knocks ( yet )
I currently have it boosting too 19psi @ 4500 then dropping to 12 to redline
Which suits me really and doesn't stress it too much
But I'm considering holding it to around the 5500/6000 range
But am I pushing it for an old motor and is it worth it for the gain
Opinions and advice chaps
Running a td05 on my bug , the mileage is now over 140k
It still pulls well and no worrying knocks ( yet )
I currently have it boosting too 19psi @ 4500 then dropping to 12 to redline
Which suits me really and doesn't stress it too much
But I'm considering holding it to around the 5500/6000 range
But am I pushing it for an old motor and is it worth it for the gain
Opinions and advice chaps
01 January 2013, 04:52 PM
#2
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id say at your own risk i boost mine to 6000 or little more, and its got 87 k on clock, but well u never know. i was going to ask for rev limiter at mapping to 6000 max. not just engine, could be gearbox. mab change oil and filter more reg check timing belt is changed at correct intervals, and dont think pushing it now and then would present a problem, now and again that is. plus if u know of any history of the engine having work id be even more careful. how longs a piece of string..................£££££££
01 January 2013, 06:01 PM
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My bug has a tdo5 on it @ 106k and it holds boost to the redline mate (1.5bar tailing to 1.35bar)iirc.
It's only mapped on 95 ron (daily driver) and its fine, might have a few dyno graphs if you want a look
It's only mapped on 95 ron (daily driver) and its fine, might have a few dyno graphs if you want a look
01 January 2013, 06:07 PM
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I'm not good with bar ,all my stuff is psi , in 4th it's peaking at 1.4 and dropping to around 1 at 6k ish
So I think I'm gonna run with this for time being chaps
So I think I'm gonna run with this for time being chaps
01 January 2013, 06:15 PM
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The tdo5 is a sturdy unit that likes a bit of boost, My classic was 352bhp/340lbft on 1.4bar and was fine even with my lead boot
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01 January 2013, 06:22 PM
#8
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And becomes a little random , where as now it pulls smoothly right through
Coupled with my box is not at its best I'm gonna run what it's at
Or at least until I have more time and maybe try a three port as well
01 January 2013, 06:31 PM
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But when you look at some maps it's whacked to say 70% pretty much across the board
I'm taking it you can only really do that if your either running lower boost or have good boost control via other means
01 January 2013, 06:33 PM
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Same as you say it's not worth messing about for the cost
01 January 2013, 06:43 PM
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It's a bad day that mate, it's my sons birthday and i need to set the pub up for his party ect, I might get chance to pop down first thing for an hour or so if im lucky,
shame really as i wanted to watch your car implode
only joking
shame really as i wanted to watch your car implode
only joking
Last edited by addi monster; 01 January 2013 at 06:46 PM.
01 January 2013, 08:13 PM
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Here you go as requested, the boost is a tad lower than i remembered.
ps 95 ron fuel and mapper said there was approx 3.5 degrees of timing to go in if it was on v power so it will see 350bhp if wanted.
ps 95 ron fuel and mapper said there was approx 3.5 degrees of timing to go in if it was on v power so it will see 350bhp if wanted.
Last edited by addi monster; 01 January 2013 at 08:16 PM.
01 January 2013, 08:20 PM
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Are you on v power ? if so there will be a lot more in yours mate, mines on 95ron due to 99ron being a fecking pain to find up here for a daily drive.
01 January 2013, 08:25 PM
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+ do I really need much more , what are the gains holding it to redline
Btw what gear were those runs
01 January 2013, 08:53 PM
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01 January 2013, 10:27 PM
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I've read that a steady progression of your Wgdc you can achieve steadier boost but you get slower onset
But when you look at some maps it's whacked to say 70% pretty much across the board
I'm taking it you can only really do that if your either running lower boost or have good boost control via other means
But when you look at some maps it's whacked to say 70% pretty much across the board
I'm taking it you can only really do that if your either running lower boost or have good boost control via other means
I havent tried dropping it too much yet but boost comes in pretty well and not at all abrupt.
01 January 2013, 11:34 PM
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20psi mid range tapering to 17psi at 6500rpm shouldn't be an issue for a tdo5 16g, but you might need a different fuel strategy to what you're currently targeting at lower boost at upper rpm, and of course the timing will need to be adjusted to suit. I personally ensure fuelling is where I want it before doing anything with ign, and afr can move a little after adjusting the timing.
You should still be able to get reasonable control with your 2 port. I think you use OS MAFless? which I don't have any experience with, but I'd be suprised if you cannot log/monitor what the closed loop WG control is doing. From this, as a rough guide, I would monitor 4th gear (maybe 5th if 6 speed) and set your base WG map at 2-3 %below what was required to maintain your desired boost. WG duty will usually increase with rpm if you're aiming to hold that amount of boost into high rpm. Having duty high intially to aid spool up can do some interesting things to transient VE when the WG opens as you approach target boost that might need mapping around (if running MAFless/speed density).
My disclaimer is that I'm an enthusiast and not a professional mapper, so talking only from my limited experience, hence be careful following my advice
Simon
You should still be able to get reasonable control with your 2 port. I think you use OS MAFless? which I don't have any experience with, but I'd be suprised if you cannot log/monitor what the closed loop WG control is doing. From this, as a rough guide, I would monitor 4th gear (maybe 5th if 6 speed) and set your base WG map at 2-3 %below what was required to maintain your desired boost. WG duty will usually increase with rpm if you're aiming to hold that amount of boost into high rpm. Having duty high intially to aid spool up can do some interesting things to transient VE when the WG opens as you approach target boost that might need mapping around (if running MAFless/speed density).
My disclaimer is that I'm an enthusiast and not a professional mapper, so talking only from my limited experience, hence be careful following my advice
Simon
Last edited by SiHethers; 01 January 2013 at 11:37 PM.
02 January 2013, 05:48 PM
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20psi mid range tapering to 17psi at 6500rpm shouldn't be an issue for a tdo5 16g, but you might need a different fuel strategy to what you're currently targeting at lower boost at upper rpm, and of course the timing will need to be adjusted to suit. I personally ensure fuelling is where I want it before doing anything with ign, and afr can move a little after adjusting the timing.
You should still be able to get reasonable control with your 2 port. I think you use OS MAFless? which I don't have any experience with, but I'd be suprised if you cannot log/monitor what the closed loop WG control is doing. From this, as a rough guide, I would monitor 4th gear (maybe 5th if 6 speed) and set your base WG map at 2-3 %below what was required to maintain your desired boost. WG duty will usually increase with rpm if you're aiming to hold that amount of boost into high rpm. Having duty high intially to aid spool up can do some interesting things to transient VE when the WG opens as you approach target boost that might need mapping around (if running MAFless/speed density).
My disclaimer is that I'm an enthusiast and not a professional mapper, so talking only from my limited experience, hence be careful following my advice
Simon
You should still be able to get reasonable control with your 2 port. I think you use OS MAFless? which I don't have any experience with, but I'd be suprised if you cannot log/monitor what the closed loop WG control is doing. From this, as a rough guide, I would monitor 4th gear (maybe 5th if 6 speed) and set your base WG map at 2-3 %below what was required to maintain your desired boost. WG duty will usually increase with rpm if you're aiming to hold that amount of boost into high rpm. Having duty high intially to aid spool up can do some interesting things to transient VE when the WG opens as you approach target boost that might need mapping around (if running MAFless/speed density).
My disclaimer is that I'm an enthusiast and not a professional mapper, so talking only from my limited experience, hence be careful following my advice
Simon
Peaking at 18.5 dropping too 11 at 6500
Tbh I haven't logged boost in 4th , but from my gauge and revs it's peaking around 21 and dropping off to around 14/16 after 5k ,( not that accurate using visual not logging ) It pulls through smooth and is more stable in 4th
Another issue is I don't really have a nice flat stretch to test , which I guess isn't gonna help
I'm generally happy to run as it is , and pretty sure I can make it hold more , but what will my gains be vs strain on the car
Is it worth pushing that little bit more on an old motor
What is considered pushing the boost limits on an old car