Vate

I love my MY00 but I do feel infuriated by the lack of grunt below boost. I suppose what I'm really looking for is a faster spool up of the turbo? I'm not afraid to admit that I'm no technical whizz but I would understand most that is explained to me.
The car has SS mid and silencer with ITG panel filter. I have 17" OZ Superlegs Eibachs + geom by TSL (lovely blokes) and the so called group N + front brake set-up. I only own the one car as it is almost exclusively for weekend use anyway.
I've listened extensively to Mr Banks on here and others and the idea of the Dawes makes huge sense but the ECUTek 2 or reprogramme by PE using the ECUTek software sounds like the way I should go. I know Imprezas are hardly subtle but I'm trying to keep the car 'normal' looking. It's about the way it drives not how it looks. So. Calling all tuning experts what is my best option. Please try and be objective.

john banks

Objective not sure as the once proclaimed Dawes guru and now mapping with Ecutek!??!

Anyway, I can say unbiased that a downpipe will help a lot.

For spool up a Dawes will certainly help. So would a remap. The latter also allows you to add fuel and advance the ignition making a further substantial improvement in off boost performance and spool up. I gained 25lbft at 2500 with this, Steve the other day got another 26lbft gain at one point from this. I don't think you can add them together and say you'll gain 51 lbft from this, but there are good gains to be had.

The other thing I am less hung up about now is boost at RPM rather than airflow at RPM. There is some debate on I-club about what to do with the ignition and fuel and the effects on spool up - I stand by advance and richen. Whatever, you can have a situation where the turbo has a lot of boost but the torque follows by quite a long way, which feels a bit weird. The Dawes tends to do this on some cars.

Vate

Thanks for the reply.
As I'm down South I was considering a trip to PE.
I rather like the idea of a remap as on appearence nothing has changed.
I'm thinking of a downpipe so I'll be catless so to speak I was just a little worried about roadside testing and warranty.
Should I really be bothered about them though?
I realise spool up faster does not equate to more low down torque on it's own I guess I'd really like to know if the remap etc would be much more worth while post downpipe. In other words would I be wasting my hard earned by remapping now and downpipe later?

john banks

If you fitted a Tek 2 you could benefit before and after the downpipe - the map will cope with either. If you are Tek 3 custom mapping best get the downpipe on first.

Vate

Many thanks.
I'll probably go for the DP + tek2 then judging by the results I've seen from other peolple's dynos.
I should find a more seamless wave of torque and more power coming on above 5000 rpm than now as well as satisfying that better pick up at lower revs around town.
I really like the idea that it's a software executed remap rather than a replacement ECU. Very stealthy!

PING

Vate,

I had a similar target - stealthy performance gains - so on my MY00 Wagon, I had the TEK2 done and the DP will follow shortly.

My car is used constantly for work and pleasure, so I am not keen to push things too far. The TEK 2 has added significant when I get the chance to use it ''Properly''and has smoothed the power delivery enormously for every day stuff. With my standard exhaust (Fully catted), the car died at 5,500rpm prior to the TEK2 remap, to the point of there really being nothing to gain by pushing towards the red line. The TEK2 has changed that totally ... Smooth power all the way through

It was worth every penny without doubt.

Steve

Vate

Many thanks.
All I need now is to 'stealth' a day at PE past my wife ;-)

MKC

Hi Ping,

Am I right in thinking that you went for e Tek 2 with the rest of your car at absolute standard ? Is it OK to do that ? Why would anyone want to go for e Tek 1 if a Tek 2 can be used on a standard car ?

Cheers,

MKC

john banks

Price? Tek2 is safe on a standard car, but will benefit from breathing mods.

[Edited by john banks - 5/30/2002 8:43:57 PM]

PING

MKC,

As John says - no prob's on a standard car, but breathing mods are needed to get the best out of it ... I have dyno run graphs if you would like to see the effect of the TEK2 over the TEK1 plus a Dawes unit.

The price is really the issue, but the extra cash is worth while spending for sure!

Steve.

Katana

More power? One word, NOS!!

Better yet, get your engine bored to 2.2 L. More low down power and torque.

I'v never been a fan of electronics gimmickry, hence why I chose Dawes over an EB Controller, Scooby over an Evo/Skyline, Mech Engineering over Elec. Engineering, a katana over a light sabre, etc. Electronics stuff are a bit too complicated and small for my likings. Too many things can go wrong with it.

Keep it simple like a Dawes and you can see and fix what the problem is.

nom

...except the good thing about the Tek1 or 2 is that there's no additional electronics, just a few critical bytes of information in the ECU are changed so the engine has a slightly different 'aim' that makes all the difference. There's nothing actually new to go wrong! Simple & elegant.
Obviously I'm not a fan...

MKC

Does or has anyone had a Tek 2 before the breathing and other mods?

In totally standard form, do the changes in the Tek 2 ECU mapping still give power and torque increases over the Tek 1 ?

Does the Tek 1/2/3 increase the boost level in some way without the need for a bleeding device ??

Does the Tek ECU look and have the same stickers etc as the original (if you order a whole unit) ?

Thanks,

MKC

PING

MKC,

''Does or has anyone had a Tek 2 before the breathing and other mods?'' ...
That'll be me then !

''In totally standard form, do the changes in the Tek 2 ECU mapping still give power and torque increases over the Tek 1 ?''
My fig's with TEK 2 and standard exhaust were 264 BHP and 253 lbft torque ... cool day admittedly. The TEK 1 (including a Dawes unit holding at 1.1 Bar which is .2 bar above the TEK1 and standard ECU held boost level) was 250 BHP and 230 lbft torque ... so yes is the answer .

''Does the Tek 1/2/3 increase the boost level in some way without the need for a bleeding device ??''
Yes - TEK1 (ooops I mean TEK2) takes boost to 1.15 to 1.2 BAR - no bleed device necessary .

''Does the Tek ECU look and have the same stickers etc as the original (if you order a whole unit) ?''
If you go the PE in Uxbridge, they will remap your own ECU in the car! As they only touch a small amount of code on the ECU, your ECU still gives the same ID to anyone when they plug the ECU in for diagnostics ... stealthy or what !

I hope this helps!

Steve

[Edited by PING - 5/31/2002 7:05:59 PM]

Razor2001

Hey Ping,

What is your car ??? Trying to figure out what your car was 100% stock with zero mods bhp and torque wise ? This is obviously for me to figure out the gains from the tec 1 and tec 2 mod

Cheers,
Ray

PS: Anyone used a TEC 1 or TEC 2 on a JDM or UK spec STi-7 ???

john banks

Ecutek Tek 1 and 2 remaps at present are only available for MY99/00 UK cars. Tek 3 (custom remap) can be done on these cars and also the software is capable of doing STi5/6/P1. MY01/02/03 WRX and STi UK and JDM to follow hopefully.

PING

Ray,

My00 with the infamous 802 ECU! I did not have a dyno done when instandard mode, but general concensus seems to be the 802 without any mods to breathing gives about 200 of both BHP and torque ... 10% down on the quoted book figures! needless to say, the TEk1 and then 2 has made a ooooooooooge difference

Steve

Razor2001

Thought their web site said 01 / 02 STi-7 ready ??? Glad I checked ScoobyNet

Cheers,
Ray

john banks

Delta Dash is available for the new models. Delta ECU is not.

Razor2001

Ping,

50 - 60 bhp and 40 - 50 ft. lbs. of torque with a ONLY a ecu swap ????? You sure there were no other mods that helped this out ? If not, can't wait till they come out with something for the STi-7

Why didn't Subaru produce these gains from the ECU and sell the cars with significantly more bhp.....there must be a downside, what am I missing ??

Cheers,
Ray

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Ray, Subaru balance their map against emissions/fuel consumption/warranty/mechanical sympathy. There's also marketing angles to consider.

I believe the ECUTEK maps are optimised for UK fuel and performance rather than economy/emissions.

F

john banks

The economy and emissions areas of the map are unaltered. What happens when you put your foot down is a completely different kettle of fish. The standard maps are anything but optimised for economy or emissions when you put the foot down - if they were then your engine would blow up. Arguably I am helping things by putting in more air for the same amount of fuel and getting better combustion because of extra advance

[Edited by john banks - 5/31/2002 10:13:48 PM]

Razor2001

I am lost ??


Subaru did a poor job with their ECU ??

So ECUtek 1 and 2 are bad for your engine becuase of the better performance they generate, but they are better emissions and fuel mpg wise ??

Please help to clarify my slow working noggin

Cheers,
Ray

john banks

No, I am saying that driven in cruise or emissions friendly mode there will be no difference in economy or emissions since these areas of the map are unaltered with Tek 1 and 2 as they are perfectly adequate already.

When you put the foot down and go onto boost the car is awash with fuel. Removing small amounts does not compromise cylinder cooling but does release power. You can also advance the ignition timing in some areas to get more power and torque.

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Oh alright then, lets say Subaru have made some performance compromises to build in safety margins on wear and tear. Subaru are a big company and spend millions on R+D, not to say that they can get it wrong now and again like any manufacturer, what all the aftermarket tuners do is to explore those safety margins and push the envelope a bit more.

You have to face the fact that when you start to tune your car you will be taking a risk of some sort, whether it be a poor fitting exhaust or a blown engine. 'You pays your money and you take your choice' as the say.

F

Katana

You forget one thing, car manufacturers always have a specific life span for a car before it starts to needing replacement parts. Thats how they make their money. Putting extra mods in will just wear out that car quicker than what is expected. Don't you just love manufacturing engineering and their schemes?

PING

Razor ... sorry for my absence on replying ... Hol's with the family!

I'm not a technically knowledable person (unlike JB, etc.), but I think there must a likelyhood of reducing the longevity of the engines life if make it create more power. I'm not in a position to drive hard very often - the roads in the South of England during work times are outrageously congested, so I take the view that, yes I am adding strees to the engine, but not too often and the fun is worth it. I guess a well maintained Scoob will go for 100k plus, and I won't get anywhere near that whilst I have the car ... If my thinking is flawed, I'd like to know!

Steve

snowcrash

isn't this the point that if scoob made the cars with an extra 50bhp then they wouldnt sell that lovely value PPP pack..?

MKC

Thanks for the replies Ping and others,

Tek 2 looks good then.

My MY99 has done 65k fully serviced miles and had two engines !!!

I start work late and finish even later so have NO traffic at all.

I have long sweeping clear country lanes and un-cameras clear wide dual carriageways all around me. Its very rare for me not to have full use out of my car to the limit every day for over an hour...!

Either I was unlucky, or continual hammering of the car is not good for it. However, I have hammered all of my modded turbo cars (USED GOOD OIL, COOLED DOWN AND WARMED UP, SERVICED EFFECTIVELY, ETC)and they have all lasted longer than my scooby. I will try the Tek 2 and wait for engine 3 to blow up before giving up on it..!!

MKC